| 00:01.11 | *** part/#bzflag Palomides (n=palomide@cpe-24-160-182-53.columbus.res.rr.com) |
| 00:02.32 | JeffM | sorry if you guys don't agree, you're welcome to run your own services however you want |
| 00:02.51 | spldart | men... |
| 00:02.55 | spldart | I mean meh |
| 00:02.58 | spldart | don't get me wrong |
| 00:02.59 | JeffM | heh |
| 00:03.01 | spldart | lOL |
| 00:03.13 | JeffM | forums arn't a good place for data storage |
| 00:03.17 | spldart | If it's yours then freedom first then philosophy |
| 00:03.27 | JeffM | now that we have the wiki, thats where all real info that peole want to search should go |
| 00:03.31 | spldart | Run it just however you want |
| 00:04.04 | JeffM | now that's not to say I'd not like to run a commnity centric fourm too |
| 00:04.05 | spldart | or n |
| 00:04.28 | JeffM | for more "related but not the same" type subjects like leauges, servers, and projects like masterbot |
| 00:06.30 | JeffM | I would like to keep the offical fourms to be kept as closely related to the project as possible, and we make a big deal about keeping the running of servers and such seperate from the project |
| 00:07.06 | spldart | My god... That's a good quote IMHO... "Freedom first, then philosophy." Has that already been coined?? |
| 00:07.13 | JeffM | no clue |
| 00:08.18 | nn64 | Wow I need a new server P3's are ok untill you start running massssssssive Php scripting on them :( |
| 00:08.28 | nn64 | hi all |
| 00:08.45 | JeffM | what do you define as "massive"? |
| 00:08.46 | spldart | heh |
| 00:08.59 | nn64 | drupal |
| 00:09.07 | JeffM | that's not masive |
| 00:09.11 | nn64 | 90 to 100 modules |
| 00:09.22 | JeffM | that's called "a website" |
| 00:09.51 | spldart | :-) |
| 00:10.07 | nn64 | hum i wish there was a way to compile php into computer code |
| 00:10.14 | JeffM | how much of your CPU is php using? |
| 00:11.10 | nn64 | 99% (3 to 10 secound ) bursts when I'm loading a page that's just 1 user |
| 00:11.27 | JeffM | that does not sound right |
| 00:11.29 | spldart | ummmm... seems excessive |
| 00:11.43 | spldart | ooop... |
| 00:11.46 | JeffM | I don't think you have your apache configured correctly |
| 00:11.52 | nn64 | but admin is massive so it shoulden't bother me to much |
| 00:12.13 | nn64 | standerd users probably wont have such a problem |
| 00:12.32 | nn64 | What exactly is cashing |
| 00:12.39 | JeffM | are you serious? |
| 00:13.19 | JeffM | caching is when you keep a copy of a commonly used thing close to the thing that uses it for speed. |
| 00:13.42 | JeffM | it's a very common concept in not just networking and hosting, but also in computer science in general. |
| 00:13.45 | nn64 | ok that makes it a little clearer |
| 00:13.56 | JeffM | basic IT 101 stuff |
| 00:14.00 | nn64 | is a cash in memory |
| 00:14.03 | spldart | You do have enough ram right? |
| 00:14.07 | nn64 | for apache |
| 00:14.17 | JeffM | caching == good for most things |
| 00:14.24 | nn64 | lol apache is Eating like 500M |
| 00:14.25 | JeffM | and yah are you hitting your swap space? |
| 00:14.33 | JeffM | I'll take that as a yes |
| 00:14.35 | spldart | woah |
| 00:14.45 | JeffM | your server is not configured properly |
| 00:14.48 | JeffM | not by a long shot |
| 00:14.52 | nn64 | ya is starting to creep me out |
| 00:14.52 | spldart | w0rd |
| 00:15.09 | JeffM | go talk to the php and apache people and have them help you get a sane setup |
| 00:15.19 | nn64 | basically apache will take up all available memory to a extent but not hit swap |
| 00:15.20 | JeffM | then worry about your websites |
| 00:15.30 | JeffM | normal apache does not do that |
| 00:15.54 | spldart | what he said.. you gotta tweak configuration |
| 00:15.55 | nn64 | well what did I do to make that happen |
| 00:16.03 | spldart | .... |
| 00:16.10 | JeffM | that is why I said go talk to the apache and php people |
| 00:16.15 | nn64 | I have looked into it 5 times can't figure it out |
| 00:16.17 | JeffM | this is not a channel for linux webserver support |
| 00:16.18 | spldart | That's not a topic hear |
| 00:16.29 | spldart | I mean here.. but yeah |
| 00:16.40 | nn64 | JeffM, good point im going to talk to the experts now |
| 00:16.55 | spldart | My.. G... 1/2 gig.. for apache... ?!??!@ |
| 00:17.19 | nn64 | 768 somthing is in the server going to add more |
| 00:17.31 | JeffM | fix your issues first |
| 00:17.45 | nn64 | but apache is really doing weard stuff :,,, |
| 00:17.50 | JeffM | each instance of httpd should not use more then a couple k |
| 00:17.55 | spldart | Unless you have alot more running @ the same time you shouildn't need more. JMHO |
| 00:18.19 | nn64 | JeffM, On my server each instance likes to have 8 to 10 MB |
| 00:18.32 | spldart | Meh... Jeff is really covering things with plenty of knowledge.. I'll bow out |
| 00:18.41 | JeffM | then you have it configured incorectly for your needs |
| 00:21.42 | JeffM | bzbb is only usiung a total of 326megs of ram when it runs, no where near swap |
| 00:21.53 | JeffM | sorry bzflag.bz as a server, not just bzbb |
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| 00:24.33 | spldart | Wow... I'm not near as grand a scale and your still under my physical memory by a long shot hehehe |
| 00:24.56 | JeffM | yeah web hosting usualy dosn't need lots of ram |
| 00:25.01 | *** join/#bzflag Think_Differentl (n=shedelj@unaffiliated/thinkdifferentl/x-838543) |
| 00:25.18 | JeffM | hosting EQ servers, then yeah ram.. lots of ram |
| 00:25.56 | spldart | Even while building |
| 00:26.23 | spldart | ... As long as X is off |
| 00:26.24 | JeffM | yeah, unless you are dealing with REALY big things, a gig is a lot of ram on a simple server |
| 00:26.31 | JeffM | yeah X is a big thing |
| 00:26.48 | spldart | I don't run it any more ;-) stupid X |
| 00:26.51 | Think_Differentl | P133, 32MB RAM, 1.2GB HDD ftw. |
| 00:26.57 | JeffM | there ya go |
| 00:28.03 | spldart | I'm currently running pIII 450 and rarely get past 10% of cpu and mem... but.. of course, I'm not bzflag.bz |
| 00:28.36 | Think_Differentl | spldart, what kinda drives? |
| 00:28.53 | JeffM | Fry's has an AM2 BE-2300+ and a mobo for 70$ that looks rather tempting |
| 00:29.01 | JeffM | runs at 31deg at full load |
| 00:29.09 | Think_Differentl | I got an ECS mobo at fry's for 8$ |
| 00:29.32 | Think_Differentl | too bad it didn't support conroe. just bought a cheapy cedar mill celly for it. |
| 00:29.35 | spldart | yah know.. I forgot... gotta ssh in.. ;-) 'can't get over how leet that sounds' |
| 00:31.10 | spldart | HDA1 3842376 and hdc1 19220500.. for data |
| 00:31.37 | spldart | 25% on hda and hdc is whateva I have to have it at |
| 00:31.50 | Think_Differentl | ah |
| 00:31.50 | spldart | rag tab machine |
| 00:32.16 | spldart | viaau@stowaway:~$ -/+ buffers/cache: 57 447 |
| 00:32.22 | spldart | :) |
| 00:32.30 | spldart | 1/2 gig right now |
| 00:33.09 | nn64 | its really funny i just restarted apache and my mem drops form packed to max to literally nothing |
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| 00:34.24 | nn64 | lol : Fatal error: Allowed memory size of 20971520 bytes exhausted (tried to allocate 19456 bytes) in /www/linuxmain/modules/imagefield/imagefield.module on line 163 |
| 00:35.09 | nn64 | wow this think might be actually using all that memory |
| 00:36.10 | *** part/#bzflag LongDon (n=LongDon@host-091-097-063-024.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 00:37.30 | spldart | .... But not troubleshoot it out? |
| 00:38.48 | nn64 | i did it seems the scripts im runing in php need to eat 128MB to run properly |
| 00:39.05 | Constitution | scripts that do what? |
| 00:39.26 | nn64 | run my websites |
| 00:39.37 | Constitution | more specifically? |
| 00:39.43 | AHA | ~whodaman-++ |
| 00:42.30 | JeffM | naw I was talking to Erroneous about it |
| 00:43.33 | nn64 | Constitution, 90 modules for comunity stuff and all based in the php system drupal |
| 00:44.17 | Constitution | so your drupal modules require 128MB of RAM? |
| 00:44.45 | Constitution | a custom module you made yourself, or one of the community ones? |
| 00:45.11 | nn64 | Constitution, yes the entire system of drupal requires that much with all thoes modules in it |
| 00:45.32 | Constitution | that doesn't answer the question |
| 00:45.41 | nn64 | the admin has a gigantic menu and big config pages that it has to loge |
| 00:45.45 | nn64 | load * |
| 00:46.29 | nn64 | Constitution, I have never personally made a module but i would like to try to make one to host bzfs servers |
| 00:46.40 | Constitution | okay, I see |
| 00:46.44 | spldart | ?! |
| 00:46.48 | nn64 | then implement it into bzfmaps.net drupal system |
| 00:46.48 | JeffM | nn64, bzbb is running a copy of drupal, that 300megs I said, includes that. |
| 00:46.56 | JeffM | your stuff is just busted |
| 00:47.01 | JeffM | "modlues" are just php pages. |
| 00:47.06 | spldart | Expand your experience nn64 |
| 00:47.48 | nn64 | JeffM, that load vars and other pieces of stuff into memory for quick access when loading a page |
| 00:48.09 | JeffM | if you say so skip |
| 00:48.38 | Think_Differentl | mmm, new computer parts. |
| 00:48.39 | nn64 | mainly there include files include a tun of code into the main system |
| 00:48.48 | nn64 | Exactly |
| 00:49.12 | nn64 | new computer parts |
| 00:49.30 | JeffM | yeah that's the best thign to do , throw money at it. |
| 00:49.39 | nn64 | lol |
| 00:50.15 | Think_Differentl | JeffM, that _always_ solves the problem. |
| 00:50.45 | Erroneous | I mean, is 256 gallons of code a lot, or only a little? I guess a lot, if it takes up that much memory |
| 00:50.46 | JeffM | #define _always_ eRarely |
| 00:51.58 | nn64 | * linuxmain.net |
| 00:52.14 | Constitution | nn64: it's unlikely that the size of your code itself is causing that much memory to fill up... if my calcluations are correct, 128MB could hold over 4 million lines of typical code |
| 00:52.18 | Think_Differentl | meh, I'm trying to decide if I should actually buy a domain. |
| 00:52.45 | Think_Differentl | the only reason would be email. not even sure if that's worth it now with gmail. |
| 00:53.21 | AHA | Think_Differentl: you would also need a hosting package if you do get a domain |
| 00:53.55 | Think_Differentl | AHA, fail, I don't. Google Apps is there and so is my own box. |
| 00:54.10 | Think_Differentl | however, verizon doesn't provide much up. |
| 00:55.26 | JeffM | I get 768 up |
| 00:55.39 | Think_Differentl | 512kbps here. |
| 00:59.53 | spldart | who do you test with |
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| 01:02.35 | Constitution | their service agreement ;) |
| 01:03.57 | spldart | omg.. ice age is to funny for somebody my age :( |
| 01:06.16 | nn64 | Constitution, 128MB may hold 4 million lines but not processing and running + code |
| 01:06.34 | Constitution | the point stands |
| 01:06.36 | spldart | Was waiting for that |
| 01:06.36 | JeffM | nn64, it's not processed or run unitll the page loads |
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| 01:07.01 | JeffM | nn64 you don't really know what "code" is, so it's best if you dont' dig yourself deeper |
| 01:08.29 | nn64 | php is server side and generally makes the page that the end user views so .... the code (php) has to be processed in the server memory the out come is then shiped as html to the end user |
| 01:09.20 | nn64 | the loading of the php plus all the complex stuff that runs the code also takes up memory |
| 01:09.45 | JeffM | in a very general sense, yes |
| 01:11.05 | JeffM | but not all of it has to stay in ram at once |
| 01:11.15 | JeffM | that is where server config comes in |
| 01:11.50 | nn64 | which is probably where some crasy setting is causing my server to do crasy things |
| 01:12.08 | nn64 | like eat ram |
| 01:12.31 | JeffM | or you just screwed it up when you set it up |
| 01:13.05 | JeffM | did you fully understand each setting in apache and php when you set it up? |
| 01:13.20 | JeffM | or did you just emerge and expect it to magicaly work the way you wanted it to? |
| 01:14.42 | Think_Differentl | emerge? gentoo? :o |
| 01:14.58 | JeffM | that's what he's running |
| 01:15.08 | Think_Differentl | right. |
| 01:26.55 | spldart | Only gettting 1.177 mbps up right now |
| 01:27.06 | Think_Differentl | not bad |
| 01:27.20 | spldart | very unstable though. |
| 01:27.49 | spldart | could get half that the next minute though |
| 01:36.42 | spldart | I say 'though' to many times.. 'dough' |
| 01:36.56 | blast007_nokia | the fact he has 90 modules i the problem... |
| 01:37.03 | blast007_nokia | is* |
| 01:37.26 | blast007_nokia | they all use memory |
| 01:38.40 | blast007_nokia | so it's probable not even a server misconfiguration, but just a bloated drupal :p |
| 01:39.15 | tannerld | judoon platoon upon the moon |
| 01:39.47 | spldart | :-D |
| 01:42.09 | tannerld | \o/ |
| 01:42.26 | spldart | :-/ |
| 01:45.56 | inchworm | excuse you |
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| 02:09.10 | spldart | PENGUIN EATER.... |
| 02:17.37 | penguin_eater | YES |
| 02:17.39 | penguin_eater | oops caps |
| 02:17.56 | spldart | thats us |
| 02:18.02 | penguin_eater | ? |
| 02:18.18 | spldart | too mas cap |
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| 02:39.06 | Constitution | any BZBB admins around? |
| 02:42.18 | AAA_awright | How bad is lag on dial-up? |
| 02:43.34 | Mets | probably pretty bad |
| 02:44.03 | Mets | depends on the map though, big server, not a lot of people, lag might not be too bad |
| 02:46.25 | AAA_awright | It only takes a few characters of data to change a tank's vector |
| 02:47.18 | AAA_awright | Could the client send out a few different types of packets to say only one type of data changed? If you are not changing your z position, why send that data to the client? |
| 02:48.05 | AAA_awright | That could cut down the total data sent by 1/3, there is lots of redundant data sent in MsgPlayerUpdateSmall even. |
| 02:51.45 | DTRemenak|RDP | how often does a tank turn whilst standing still? |
| 02:53.11 | AAA_awright | Or moving in a straight line? Dodging is just that. |
| 02:54.41 | DTRemenak | dodging is usually S-curved |
| 02:55.05 | DTRemenak | and dodging is exactly when you want to receive MORE update packets :) |
| 02:56.19 | AAA_awright | I'd say about 1/8 of the time you only need to update x,y,and speed. That means use the last known heading and z. |
| 02:56.47 | AAA_awright | Another 6/8 of the time you do not need to send any z data. |
| 02:57.20 | AAA_awright | On some maps there is no jumping, so you are sending 4 unneeded characters with every packet. |
| 03:03.29 | Think_Differentl | AAA_awright, another question, why optomize for dialup when most people have a high speed connection? |
| 03:03.49 | DTRemenak | Think_Differentl: it's always better to transmit less data |
| 03:03.57 | DTRemenak | reduces server load, for one thing |
| 03:04.07 | Think_Differentl | but the server load is not that high to begin with. |
| 03:04.14 | DTRemenak | and there are people who don't have broadband |
| 03:04.20 | DTRemenak | heh, server bandwidth IS high |
| 03:04.24 | AAA_awright | Think_Differentl: That is silly, if you optimize it, people with broadband are still going to get the completed packet faster. |
| 03:04.48 | AAA_awright | Lowers latency. By 1/100 of a ms maybe, but it cuts down still. |
| 03:05.04 | AAA_awright | It is more about bandwidth on the server side. |
| 03:05.18 | Think_Differentl | meh |
| 03:06.58 | DTRemenak | the balance that has to be achieved with player updates is size versus complexity. we could make all the variables independent, but code complexity would skyrocket |
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| 03:34.48 | blast007 | AAA_awright: sucky dialup should not be playing games |
| 03:35.06 | blast007 | the dialup I had wasn't *that* bad, but I'm in town |
| 03:35.28 | blast007 | I think I only had around 180ms lag to a server in germany |
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| 04:40.46 | Constitution | ~DTRemenak++ |
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| 07:50.44 | a_meteorite | ruskie: you got an eee?! |
| 07:52.11 | ruskie | yup |
| 07:52.16 | ruskie | bought it yesterday... |
| 07:52.24 | ruskie | still need to clear off all the crap of xandros from it... |
| 07:53.12 | a_meteorite | can you post pictures? :) |
| 07:53.31 | ruskie | atm not... am @work... |
| 07:53.42 | ruskie | when I get home I'll take pics of it running bzflag :) |
| 07:56.40 | ruskie | stupid setup... they don't allow to remove pre-installed software like: skype, amarok, unrar etc... |
| 07:57.00 | a_meteorite | :\ |
| 07:58.22 | ruskie | but I already planned to replace it with something else anyway :) |
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| 14:24.26 | whodaman- | What happens when your inbox is full? |
| 14:24.43 | whodaman- | oldest messages just delete themselves when new ones come? |
| 14:36.47 | donny_baker | whodaman-: usually new mail is refused |
| 14:37.42 | whodaman- | k |
| 15:00.36 | blast007 | whodaman-: email, or your PM inbox on bzbb? |
| 15:01.03 | blast007 | for your PM inbox, old ones get deleted |
| 15:02.29 | whodaman- | k |
| 15:02.40 | whodaman- | Yeah, inbox for PMs on BZBB |
| 15:02.55 | blast007 | are you getting close to it being full? |
| 15:08.00 | whodaman- | blast007, like 80% |
| 15:08.06 | whodaman- | I just did "delete all" |
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| 15:22.36 | Cybodog | Howdy. Got a new install of debian sid, sound works, but I get nada in bzflag. What sound servers does bzflag use? |
| 15:24.26 | Thumper_ | Cybodog: under options for audio settings mine is blank and works fine |
| 15:24.37 | Cybodog | audio settings show sound volume unavailable |
| 15:24.44 | Cybodog | hmm |
| 15:24.47 | Thumper_ | do you have anything under driver? |
| 15:24.51 | Cybodog | no |
| 15:24.55 | Thumper_ | hmm |
| 15:25.07 | Thumper_ | not sure but I think it uses alsa by default |
| 15:25.24 | Thumper_ | my bzflag says "Audio Driver: alsa" |
| 15:25.26 | Thumper_ | when it starts up |
| 15:25.35 | Cybodog | ya, I think I am missing some alsa thingy or I need to re-install bzflag |
| 15:25.39 | Thumper_ | in the message window |
| 15:25.56 | Cybodog | message window, you mean where players chat? |
| 15:26.01 | Thumper_ | yes |
| 15:26.09 | Thumper_ | when you start bzflag it reports that before you do anything else |
| 15:26.33 | blast007 | might be an SDL for alsa |
| 15:26.36 | Cybodog | says audio driver not avail. |
| 15:26.46 | blast007 | did you build with SDL? |
| 15:26.57 | Cybodog | I installed .deb from debian |
| 15:27.02 | blast007 | oh |
| 15:27.03 | Thumper_ | Cybodog: check your config file - if it states anythingn about sound in there just delete those lines |
| 15:27.19 | Cybodog | config file as in .bzflag? |
| 15:27.24 | Thumper_ | .bzf/2.0/config |
| 15:27.31 | Cybodog | looking |
| 15:27.44 | Thumper_ | (or comment them out) |
| 15:28.30 | Thumper_ | grep -i sound ~/.bzf/2.0/config |
| 15:28.34 | Thumper_ | returns only a single line for me |
| 15:28.37 | Thumper_ | #set remoteSounds 1 |
| 15:29.05 | Cybodog | Iknow that is set I read it in the gui |
| 15:30.06 | Cybodog | renaming .bzf and testing a clean config file |
| 15:31.41 | Cybodog | no joy. I am missing something. |
| 15:31.46 | Thumper_ | :/ |
| 15:32.16 | Thumper_ | are you using sdl ? |
| 15:32.20 | blast007 | iirc, isn't SDL used to open audio? |
| 15:32.25 | Cybodog | I will remove and re-install the package, perhaps something changed during the install. |
| 15:32.27 | blast007 | Thumper_: he's using the package, which depends on SDL |
| 15:32.34 | blast007 | http://packages.debian.org/unstable/games/bzflag |
| 15:32.38 | Cybodog | I don't know, I will look and find SDL |
| 15:32.48 | Thumper_ | blast007: ok |
| 15:33.07 | Cybodog | could be a bad bzflag package also, I can go and get the one from testing. |
| 15:33.26 | Thumper_ | I just build from scratch - haven't tried the debian pacakge |
| 15:33.31 | Cybodog | but I do have libsdl1 installed |
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| 15:33.42 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v SportChick] by ChanServ |
| 15:33.46 | Cybodog | and libsdl1.2debian-alsa |
| 15:34.05 | blast007 | hmm |
| 15:34.06 | Cybodog | hey sportchick, have not killed you in a long time (RedDog) |
| 15:34.33 | Cybodog | I will now re-install package and work from there. |
| 15:37.08 | blast007 | heh, I was gonna test it on my VM... but I realized I didn't add an audio device ;) |
| 15:37.20 | Cybodog | doh! |
| 15:37.39 | Cybodog | this happens now and again, but I can never remember WHAT fixes it, it happens so seldom |
| 15:41.01 | Cybodog | fixed |
| 15:41.15 | Cybodog | fyi, here is the fix for at least debian: |
| 15:41.30 | Cybodog | libsdl1.2debian-alsa was installed |
| 15:42.20 | Cybodog | I installed libsdl1.2.debian-all and it (package manager) uninstalled the first and replaced it with the 2nd. |
| 15:42.27 | Cybodog | alsa -reload |
| 15:42.40 | Cybodog | sound was turned off in options>settings |
| 15:42.46 | Cybodog | turned it on, it all works. |
| 15:44.04 | Cybodog | thanks for assisting. |
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| 15:48.02 | Cybodog | blast, what do you use for vm? |
| 15:48.30 | blast007 | VMWare |
| 15:48.39 | Cybodog | server or workstation? |
| 15:48.45 | blast007 | both |
| 15:48.53 | Cybodog | ahh, evaling workstation |
| 15:48.58 | blast007 | I have server on the lappy, and workstation on the Core 2 Duo |
| 15:49.00 | blast007 | no |
| 15:49.09 | Cybodog | no, I am |
| 15:49.11 | Cybodog | :) |
| 15:49.13 | blast007 | oh ;) |
| 15:49.19 | blast007 | version 6? |
| 15:49.21 | blast007 | I have 5.5 |
| 15:49.30 | Cybodog | server does not seem to have an X64 version. Yes, 6 |
| 15:49.49 | Cybodog | bzflag blows up faster on x64! |
| 15:51.21 | Cybodog | any luck installing server on x64? |
| 15:51.59 | blast007 | VMWare server 2.0 beta has an x64 edition |
| 15:52.08 | blast007 | for linux |
| 15:52.18 | blast007 | but I didn't like 2.0 |
| 15:52.21 | Cybodog | have you evaled it yet? oh |
| 15:52.35 | blast007 | it only had the web based access, and used up more resources |
| 15:52.41 | Cybodog | I see. |
| 15:52.44 | blast007 | I prefer the nice client |
| 15:52.51 | Cybodog | that is what I wanted to know |
| 15:52.54 | blast007 | (I don't run it on linux) |
| 15:53.04 | Cybodog | workstation is workable. |
| 15:53.16 | blast007 | right now I use VMWare Server to run scratchbox, so I can build stuff for my Nokia |
| 15:53.16 | Cybodog | run it on linux, you mean the client? |
| 15:53.25 | blast007 | my host OS is Windows XP |
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| 15:53.40 | Cybodog | nothing wrong with that, even if I hate it! |
| 15:53.46 | blast007 | :) |
| 15:54.08 | Cybodog | just a personal preference, like I don't like watermelon. Not my religion. |
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| 19:12.40 | JeffM | is it sad to be happy when you have ONLY 125 compilation errors? |
| 19:29.42 | spldart | heh.. I guess it's a matter of perspective |
| 19:35.46 | scott | is the glass half empty or half full? |
| 19:36.10 | ruskie | it's just half :) |
| 19:36.26 | scott | heh |
| 19:37.51 | *** join/#bzflag Dessy (n=Dessy@88.134.130.106) |
| 19:39.29 | CBG | The glass is twice as big as it needs to be. -- The physicist. |
| 19:41.02 | spldart | All the talk the other day about setting up a webserver...I lost control and set one up @ work :-\ hehe. Now I need to find a cute/funny 'not found' page to put up |
| 19:41.35 | ruskie | used js to moan about how it will soon be put out ofit's missery :) |
| 19:41.45 | spldart | Is there any extra risks to leaving my dir's shown in apache? |
| 19:41.57 | spldart | hehe |
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| 19:48.16 | spldart | I got it.. I need a confused looking penguin for a 404 page |
| 19:51.49 | a_meteor_work | spldart: the linux tux penguin is sufficient then |
| 19:53.54 | menotume | spldart ... http://bzleague.com/xxx |
| 19:54.02 | menotume | just chnage the text to suit your needs |
| 19:54.03 | spldart | 0_o |
| 19:54.54 | spldart | That's the funnies |
| 19:55.25 | menotume | and, http://www.webune.com/forums/images/avatars/gallery/cute/tux-penguin-avatar.gif |
| 19:55.56 | menotume | ah, or ... http://homingpenguin.com/img/Tux-G2s.png |
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| 20:05.45 | spldart | Geez... Is it really this easy to remote adminster a server?!?! |
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| 20:06.42 | EtiroeteM | I started a trend :o |
| 20:07.10 | Winny | EtiroeteM, I regged my backwards name like 6 months ago |
| 20:07.16 | whodaman- | Yeah |
| 20:07.23 | EtiroeteM | spldart: :o |
| 20:07.52 | Mxed | And I was there before you ;) |
| 20:07.53 | EtiroeteM | Ooops |
| 20:08.05 | EtiroeteM | <PROTECTED> |
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| 20:13.08 | *** topic/#bzflag is http://BZFlag.org || http://cia.vc/stats/project/BZFlag || http://my.BZFlag.org/w/Getting_Help || logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/#bzflag || http://ohloh.net/projects/189 || http://my.bzflag.org/w/ || 2.0.10 is out || http://www.linkedin.com/e/gis/45019/37A4F10F2697 |
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| 20:21.03 | *** topic/#bzflag is http://BZFlag.org || http://cia.vc/stats/project/BZFlag || http://my.BZFlag.org/w/Getting_Help || logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/#bzflag || http://ohloh.net/projects/189 || http://my.bzflag.org/w/ || 2.0.10 is out || http://www.linkedin.com/e/gis/45019/37A4F10F2697 |
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| 20:36.58 | a_meteor_work | L4m3r: UCLA not liking you using IRC? ;) |
| 20:37.22 | L4m3r | dunno |
| 20:37.24 | L4m3r | client cut out randomly |
| 20:37.48 | a_meteor_work | heh |
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| 21:14.43 | Winny | being in so many channels is fun. Clicking them when new messages come in is like playing wack-a-mole. |
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| 21:52.02 | Winny | JeffM: you can delete my forum section, I no longer need it. |
| 21:53.44 | JeffM | what one is that? |
| 21:53.57 | Winny | http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewforum.php?f=100 |
| 21:55.18 | JeffM | k |
| 21:57.16 | Winny | can also delete the "bzflagr.hosted" group if you want... no need for it any more. |
| 21:57.27 | JeffM | geting out of it all? |
| 21:57.33 | whodaman- | Are we deleting groups now? |
| 21:57.53 | Winny | No, all the servers on me+Const's box are going to their own forum |
| 21:57.55 | JeffM | it's not a bad idea before we do the import for the group manager. |
| 21:58.00 | JeffM | ahh |
| 21:58.05 | JeffM | how's that machine working out? |
| 21:58.29 | Winny | it's nice |
| 21:58.41 | Winny | only issue was when the datacenter lost power, heh |
| 21:59.25 | Constitution | yeah, it's a nice server |
| 21:59.30 | JeffM | cool |
| 21:59.43 | CBG | as good as mofos? :) |
| 21:59.44 | Dessy | wich? O_o |
| 21:59.54 | Winny | Dessy: our dedicated server |
| 22:00.04 | whodaman- | Dessy, bzflagr.net fairserve.net |
| 22:00.04 | JeffM | mofo is still on xlhost right? |
| 22:00.05 | Constitution | CBG: probably about equivalent ;) |
| 22:00.05 | Winny | Burritotume! |
| 22:00.09 | Constitution | maybe not quite so powerful |
| 22:00.12 | CBG | :) |
| 22:00.14 | Dessy | ah winny :) |
| 22:00.18 | JeffM | Constitution, you got the 50$ celly? |
| 22:00.24 | Constitution | or powerfull, if you're JeffM ;) |
| 22:00.25 | CBG | not like bzfs is cpu needy... |
| 22:00.28 | Constitution | JeffM: yes |
| 22:00.32 | JeffM | so your cheaper |
| 22:00.37 | Winny | they poped us up to the 1gb model, though, IIRC |
| 22:00.39 | CBG | unless there's been a new release sine the 90's..? ;) |
| 22:00.47 | JeffM | but service wise you shoudl be VERY similar |
| 22:00.49 | Constitution | yeah they gave us more RAM and a faster proc |
| 22:00.54 | JeffM | cool |
| 22:01.09 | JeffM | you ahve the 320 gig drive? |
| 22:01.16 | Constitution | 120GB |
| 22:01.16 | Winny | 120 I think |
| 22:01.22 | Constitution | they upped that as well |
| 22:01.35 | JeffM | hmmm who had 320's |
| 22:01.36 | Dessy | wich provider is that? Is there any homepage aviable? |
| 22:01.39 | Dessy | :P |
| 22:01.44 | JeffM | sagonet |
| 22:01.56 | Winny | http://www.sagonet.com/index.html |
| 22:02.06 | JeffM | ahh 320 was for the 70$ one I was comparing |
| 22:02.23 | JeffM | the only thing I am hestant on sagonet is the bandwith overages |
| 22:02.27 | Winny | it's sort of a mis-matched box, it looks like |
| 22:02.39 | JeffM | 0.50$ a gig can add up fast |
| 22:03.06 | Winny | but do you plan to use a TB? ;) |
| 22:03.10 | JeffM | no |
| 22:03.25 | JeffM | but if I do by accedent, under xlhost it's cheaper |
| 22:03.38 | JeffM | xlhost sells it in 1tb chunks |
| 22:03.56 | JeffM | so it's only like 75$ a tb |
| 22:04.01 | Winny | I hosted MW2, Constitution hosts quite a few people, and we got to 500gb last month, I think... |
| 22:04.15 | JeffM | part of me wants to host an eq server |
| 22:04.31 | CBG | EQ? |
| 22:04.31 | L4m3r | unless you're planning on getting digg raped, I'd not worry too much :P |
| 22:04.46 | JeffM | basicly when sagonet goes over 1.25tb, zlhost is cheaper |
| 22:04.50 | Winny | hehe |
| 22:04.52 | JeffM | xl |
| 22:05.11 | *** join/#bzflag Dessy_ (n=Dessy@88.134.130.106) |
| 22:05.21 | Dessy_ | ugh |
| 22:05.25 | Dessy_ | lost connection |
| 22:05.41 | Dessy_ | a bit too expensive for me |
| 22:06.05 | JeffM | tho looks like sago has a cheaper one now |
| 22:06.09 | whodaman- | Dessy, you pay like $70/month? |
| 22:06.09 | JeffM | 1.7 gig celly for 46$ |
| 22:06.36 | Dessy_ | hm |
| 22:07.36 | Winny | Burritotume, you there, or hiding? |
| 22:07.37 | Constitution | JeffM: iirc you can buy additional TBs of bandwith from sagonet for $75/mo |
| 22:07.44 | Constitution | if you buy it in advance |
| 22:07.48 | JeffM | yeah |
| 22:08.00 | JeffM | it's 50$ a month in advance from xlHost |
| 22:08.07 | JeffM | 75 if you go over |
| 22:08.27 | JeffM | so it's just cheaper |
| 22:08.41 | JeffM | they also have more ram in the default packages ( as advertised ) |
| 22:09.03 | Dessy_ | i have running a AMD Athlon 64 3500+, 1024 MB ram, 2x 160 Gb hdd 1000 GB Traffic for $70 |
| 22:09.08 | JeffM | for 70$ I can get a 2.4 gig P4, gig of ram, 80 gig drive |
| 22:09.23 | JeffM | Dessy_, where is that at? |
| 22:09.38 | *** join/#bzflag spldart (n=vircuser@c-98-197-19-35.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 22:09.41 | Dessy_ | http://www.webtropia.com its a german site |
| 22:09.57 | JeffM | is that were bz.de is? |
| 22:10.30 | dessy | no |
| 22:10.34 | dessy | links-clan.net |
| 22:10.47 | JeffM | I mean ALSO where bzflag.bz is ;) |
| 22:11.00 | JeffM | brlcad got a german server |
| 22:11.11 | dessy | i dont know |
| 22:11.34 | Winny | how many servers does that guy have? :p |
| 22:11.39 | JeffM | 2 |
| 22:12.07 | Winny | for some reason I thought he had more |
| 22:12.38 | dessy | oh i forgot to say i have too plesk for that price |
| 22:12.50 | dessy | *plesk too* |
| 22:12.59 | Winny | ick |
| 22:13.04 | dessy | ick? |
| 22:13.06 | dessy | :P |
| 22:13.15 | whodaman- | ick = b???h |
| 22:13.30 | whodaman- | bilingual ftw. |
| 22:13.40 | Winny | ick = meh |
| 22:13.51 | dessy | after 1 TB traffic u must pay? |
| 22:14.39 | JeffM | some cut you off and let you by more, some just keep the bill rolling |
| 22:14.53 | JeffM | sagonet charges you per gig over your limit |
| 22:15.01 | JeffM | xlhost lets you buy another tb |
| 22:15.28 | Winny | but do they let you pay with your soul? |
| 22:15.39 | spldart | You have one? |
| 22:15.41 | spldart | :-p |
| 22:15.55 | Winny | no, I sold it :( |
| 22:15.55 | JeffM | naw just 75$ |
| 22:16.15 | Winny | but these shoes I got in return are extra cozy |
| 22:16.41 | dessy | winny u read the german site? :P |
| 22:17.11 | Winny | define read ;p |
| 22:17.22 | dessy | lol :D |
| 22:19.17 | dessy | I think on webtropia.com are better offers ( I think :P) |
| 22:19.57 | JeffM | europe generaly has better prices yes |
| 22:20.12 | dessy | :) |
| 22:20.14 | JeffM | brlcad pays a lot less for the german server then the US |
| 22:20.21 | JeffM | but for me I don't want a german server |
| 22:20.35 | JeffM | the majority of my uses will be US side. |
| 22:21.11 | dessy | :) |
| 22:21.20 | dessy | is there a Serial Console aviable? |
| 22:21.22 | dessy | dont see it |
| 22:21.25 | JeffM | why do I care? |
| 22:22.34 | JeffM | I'm never going to go to it |
| 22:22.39 | JeffM | that's what the ISP's job is |
| 22:22.50 | dessy | :P |
| 22:24.08 | dessy | sometime u need it :P |
| 22:24.28 | JeffM | how woudl I personaly need it? |
| 22:24.46 | JeffM | the ISP is in florida |
| 22:24.52 | ts | JeffM: In history it was different with the prices..but we got a lot of competition in europe lately |
| 22:25.04 | JeffM | ts, ahh |
| 22:25.11 | JeffM | well it's cheaper now, and has been for a while |
| 22:25.18 | JeffM | our prices are coming down, but not as fast |
| 22:26.04 | JeffM | I ponderend a german server, I just don't want the 2x latency |
| 22:26.10 | spldart | Whose best for something like small web/bzflag server right now? |
| 22:26.22 | ts | 2x latency? |
| 22:26.38 | JeffM | ts, it's a lot further from me to germany, then me to floriday |
| 22:26.41 | JeffM | so there is more latency |
| 22:26.43 | spldart | Here-europe-here again latency |
| 22:26.49 | JeffM | world = big place remember ;) |
| 22:26.52 | ts | 200ish is not from me to CA at least. |
| 22:27.05 | ts | From me to CA is like 180 |
| 22:27.16 | JeffM | ts, that's your route, since I am the one looking at the server, I used my pings, not yours |
| 22:27.32 | JeffM | ts, and what is your ping to the german server ?;) |
| 22:27.36 | ts | That could be... |
| 22:27.50 | ts | JeffM: bzf.guleague.org is 6ms away |
| 22:28.04 | JeffM | ping bzflag.bz and bzflag.de |
| 22:28.40 | JeffM | spldart, you can get some virtual servers prety cheap |
| 22:28.42 | ts | 121ms vs 9ms |
| 22:28.45 | JeffM | in the 20ish a month |
| 22:28.50 | JeffM | ts, see bit of a difrence |
| 22:29.08 | dessy | i have 132 for bz.bz and 15 for bz.de |
| 22:29.17 | ts | Not that important as long it's not time critical |
| 22:29.19 | JeffM | and the price difs arn't THAT big |
| 22:29.28 | JeffM | so I'd rather have the lower latency |
| 22:29.37 | JeffM | and not have to do curreny conversions, etc.. |
| 22:29.52 | ts | I see the difference in irssi, my text feels laggy |
| 22:30.02 | spldart | 20ish a month? Is it enough to host a moderate bzfs server throughput plus small apache server? |
| 22:30.14 | JeffM | ts, how many west cost US servers do you regulary play BZflag on? |
| 22:30.34 | ts | Uhh...I think 0 nowadays |
| 22:30.43 | JeffM | spldart, yeah they usualy throw in 2-600 gigs of transfer so it's usualy fine |
| 22:31.06 | Constitution | spldart: check out vpsland |
| 22:31.09 | JeffM | ts, and if the point of geting the server was for YOU to play games on it with your friends, would you want one close to you, or far from you? |
| 22:31.26 | Constitution | a VPS isn't ideal for bzfs, but they seemed to work decently well |
| 22:32.03 | ts | JeffM: As I said..if it is not time critical I would get the cheap one. Games require fast reactions, so they are having different needs. |
| 22:32.29 | JeffM | if all I needed was doc hosting, I'd just ask brlcad to use the german server ;) |
| 22:32.44 | JeffM | but I had said befor that I was thinking of runnign an eq server |
| 22:32.44 | Winny | Constitution, god no |
| 22:32.54 | Winny | VPSLand's VPS crashed every freaking week on me |
| 22:33.01 | JeffM | but also I think some bzfss would run on it as well |
| 22:33.06 | ts | JeffM: eq? |
| 22:33.06 | Constitution | and you were pulling 25GB/day |
| 22:33.18 | JeffM | ts, everrquest |
| 22:33.23 | Winny | Constitution, so? |
| 22:33.27 | ts | Ah |
| 22:33.27 | JeffM | http://www.eqemulator.net/main.php |
| 22:33.28 | Winny | I was barely using any CPU |
| 22:33.52 | JeffM | spldart, just search for virtual private hosting |
| 22:33.57 | JeffM | you should see a lot of things |
| 22:35.14 | spldart | vps looks appealling |
| 22:35.36 | spldart | I could get my feet wet with the lowest plan and they offer debian which I'm very confy with |
| 22:37.08 | JeffM | the ping to XL host for me is a lot better too |
| 22:37.28 | JeffM | like under 30 |
| 22:40.22 | Constitution | JeffM/blast007: what is our target authentication method for the BZBB? do we eventually want to use weblogin? |
| 22:40.33 | JeffM | ldap |
| 22:40.45 | JeffM | bzbb will always be able to direclty access the core system |
| 22:40.49 | JeffM | and just be a node on it |
| 22:40.56 | Constitution | hm, ok |
| 22:41.00 | JeffM | weblogin is for non project sites |
| 22:41.19 | JeffM | or systems that for some reason can't access the core auth network |
| 22:41.43 | Constitution | I was just looking into writing a weblogin auth module for phpbb |
| 22:41.50 | JeffM | why? |
| 22:41.54 | Constitution | for the forum on our server |
| 22:42.00 | JeffM | we don't need it |
| 22:42.03 | Constitution | Winny's and mine |
| 22:42.03 | JeffM | but OTHERS may |
| 22:42.04 | Constitution | ok |
| 22:42.09 | JeffM | ahh yeah for you |
| 22:42.10 | JeffM | sure |
| 22:42.12 | JeffM | that makese sense |
| 22:42.21 | JeffM | cus your untrusted ( no offense ) |
| 22:42.25 | JeffM | our fourms will never need it |
| 22:42.33 | JeffM | but having that mod available will be VERY nice |
| 22:42.37 | JeffM | for others |
| 22:43.16 | JeffM | our goal is to have all our offical project websites just be nodes in whatever distributed auth network we end up with |
| 22:43.25 | JeffM | so they would be the same as the list servers, etc. |
| 22:44.13 | Constitution | yeah that should all become very interesting if/when we go multi-node with the services |
| 22:44.35 | JeffM | if we don't go multi-node there is no point in changing |
| 22:44.42 | JeffM | our current system works for single node |
| 22:44.45 | Constitution | true |
| 22:44.49 | JeffM | with all it's single node problems |
| 22:45.05 | JeffM | ldap was picked because it can go multi-node |
| 22:45.17 | JeffM | and since phpbb can do ldap that just makes the job easier for that part |
| 22:45.24 | Constitution | ah |
| 22:45.24 | JeffM | for us |
| 22:45.39 | JeffM | but for external sites they will need some weblogin type interface |
| 22:46.03 | JeffM | since I don't think we'll be just throwing out ldap access to just anyone |
| 22:48.14 | blast007 | the wiki can go LDAP pretty easily too |
| 22:48.35 | blast007 | when I tested, it was adding one file, and a few lines in the configuration |
| 22:49.04 | blast007 | even supported multiple domains (we'd only have one more than likely) |
| 22:49.41 | JeffM | cool |
| 22:50.47 | blast007 | I was testing with a Server 2003 AD, not OpenLDAP, so it might vary ;) |
| 22:56.14 | brlcad | blast007: perchance did you test drupal with ldap as well? |
| 22:57.23 | brlcad | i've done some tests over the past few days for the site and have been having trouble getting things to work right |
| 23:00.11 | *** part/#bzflag LongDon (n=LongDon@host-091-097-061-028.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 23:00.24 | blast007 | brlcad: I don't believe I did |
| 23:01.49 | brlcad | it actually has a nice configuration panel for both reading and writing the data in ldap |
| 23:02.10 | brlcad | but then that's where things are a bit wonky for me.. pretty sure it's something I've left out or an not doing right, but can't find it |
| 23:02.23 | JeffM | so it could be used as the user manger :) |
| 23:05.01 | *** join/#bzflag zee812 (n=188c7a62@gateway/web/cgi-irc/zeebrothers.net/x-4149effa7bb1edec) |
| 23:05.06 | brlcad | yeah, that's why I was digging on the drupal+mediawiki+phpbb 'megasite' as it's one of the few that actually manages the ldap data (and has one of the better plugin models) |
| 23:05.28 | brlcad | strengths of each, content/user management, wiki, forums |
| 23:08.22 | Burritotume | not what you breaking brlcad ? |
| 23:08.22 | Burritotume | :P |
| 23:08.26 | Burritotume | Firefox can't find the server at my.bzflag.org. |
| 23:08.42 | JeffM | that is probably you not firefox |
| 23:09.33 | whodaman- | Winny, great match! :p |
| 23:09.39 | Burritotume | sry, offline |
| 23:09.44 | Winny | ah |
| 23:09.45 | Winny | :p |
| 23:09.51 | Burritotume | ignore msg above if it went thru |
| 23:09.59 | *** join/#bzflag whodaman- (n=whodaman@pdpc/supporter/student/whodaman-) |
| 23:10.04 | Burritotume | and yes, i am TRYING to ignore winny |
| 23:10.09 | Winny | yes! |
| 23:10.11 | Winny | I knew it! |
| 23:11.22 | whodaman- | Winny, wanna match in a bit? |
| 23:11.28 | Winny | dinner soon |
| 23:11.36 | whodaman- | after? |
| 23:12.04 | Winny | k |
| 23:12.40 | *** join/#bzflag SpazzyMcGee (n=Spazzy_M@unaffiliated/spazzymcgee) |
| 23:39.17 | *** join/#bzflag spldart (n=vircuser@c-98-197-19-35.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 23:53.23 | *** join/#bzflag CupcakeM (n=cupcakem@hlfxns01bbg-142177232071.ns.aliant.net) |
