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| 00:13.05 | daniel_jackson | sry guys I could talk about the server right now but I have to go to my class I'll be back on later |
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| 01:19.31 | delusional | This is going to be an interesting map... http://cbg.bzflag.org/images/Panzer/artmap/ The Purple Panzer actually contacted mad magazine about using an Alfred E. Neuman image, and they said that they "borrowed" the image from someone else, and have argued and won several cases making it public domain. |
| 01:28.51 | *** join/#bzflag macsforme (n=const@unaffiliated/macsforme) |
| 01:33.31 | Macrosoft | are all those images for that one map?! |
| 01:35.55 | *** join/#bzflag bier_ (n=bier@84.165.51.200) |
| 01:40.04 | delusional | yep |
| 02:19.44 | *** join/#bzflag AAA_awright (n=chatzill@wsip-68-14-251-102.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 02:24.32 | brlcad | woo hoo! |
| 02:24.52 | brlcad | .bz's ISP agreed to let me keep my bandwidth at the same price |
| 02:25.04 | brlcad | so upgrade here we come |
| 02:38.50 | *** join/#bzflag JeffM (n=Jeff@pool-71-109-219-226.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 02:39.57 | brlcad | JeffM: woot! :) |
| 02:40.09 | JeffM | for? |
| 02:40.25 | brlcad | ISP agreed to let us keep our bandwidth at the same price :) |
| 02:40.31 | JeffM | cool |
| 02:40.39 | brlcad | yeah, awesome |
| 02:40.41 | JeffM | did you see the deal I said today? |
| 02:40.47 | brlcad | nah |
| 02:40.56 | JeffM | not for you, but for me |
| 02:41.37 | JeffM | AMD 2000+ 256 megs of ram, 40 gig drive, 100mbs to net, with 1.2tb transfer, for like 38$ a month |
| 02:41.43 | JeffM | is that a decent deal |
| 02:41.48 | brlcad | ah, yeah, missed that line |
| 02:41.55 | brlcad | yeah, that's pretty decent |
| 02:41.57 | JeffM | I can increase the ram for like an exter 75$ setup |
| 02:41.59 | brlcad | assuming they're reliable |
| 02:42.08 | JeffM | I've heard some people have used them with no issue |
| 02:43.29 | brlcad | compared to other ISPs I've had in the past, I've gotten fairly stellar service from sagonet across the board (both dealing with their support folks, setting up deals, maintaining service, scheduled maintenance that doesn't make a big impact, etc) |
| 02:44.04 | brlcad | yeah, you can have a great run even at a crappy place, or a horrible run at a great place if the chips fall just slightly the wrong way |
| 02:44.17 | brlcad | money-wise for the features, that's a pretty good deal |
| 02:44.34 | JeffM | most of the add ons, other then bandwith are all one time setup fees |
| 02:44.36 | brlcad | not far from what .bz originally was |
| 02:44.39 | JeffM | like 10$ an IP |
| 02:44.55 | brlcad | ahh, that's sucky |
| 02:45.01 | brlcad | one time or per-month? |
| 02:45.06 | JeffM | one time |
| 02:45.08 | JeffM | not per month |
| 02:45.12 | brlcad | ah, then not too bad |
| 02:45.20 | JeffM | many places do per month, this is one time stuff |
| 02:45.43 | JeffM | base package is likke 29.95$ a month but only 200gigs transfer |
| 02:45.45 | brlcad | yeah, I get new IPs for free, but I have to be able to justify the need |
| 02:45.52 | JeffM | 8.95 a month more for another 1000 gigs |
| 02:46.00 | JeffM | then .85$ per gig after that |
| 02:46.05 | brlcad | 256MB ram is the worst bit with that config |
| 02:46.15 | JeffM | 75$ one time setup gets it up to 512 |
| 02:47.12 | brlcad | what about to get it to a gb? |
| 02:47.30 | JeffM | not offered on that low end system |
| 02:48.07 | JeffM | if I wanted a gig of ram I could get a system for 69.95$ a month, a 2.5 gig celly, gig of ram, 80 gig drive, and 1000gb transfer |
| 02:48.14 | JeffM | but only a 10 mb connection to the interwebs |
| 02:48.44 | brlcad | ah, that's almost exactly .bz |
| 02:49.20 | JeffM | 20$ more a month to get it to 100mbs |
| 02:49.29 | JeffM | .bz is 10bT or 100bT? |
| 02:49.40 | brlcad | heh, was just going to say that |
| 02:49.50 | brlcad | it's currently 10, but upping to 100 for the upgrade |
| 02:49.56 | JeffM | ahh |
| 02:49.58 | JeffM | interersting |
| 02:49.58 | brlcad | (for additional 15/month) |
| 02:50.07 | JeffM | wonder if we hit that cap on bursts? |
| 02:50.19 | JeffM | and will inceasing that help deal with the bot attacks? |
| 02:50.23 | brlcad | graphs seem to indicate we don't |
| 02:50.33 | brlcad | it's almost always limited by the receiver |
| 02:50.47 | brlcad | because you can see the 10Mbit spikes |
| 02:51.44 | brlcad | increasing it probably will just mean we can use up the 1.25TB a lot faster if we need to ;) |
| 02:51.54 | brlcad | able to stream big files a lot faster perhaps |
| 02:52.30 | brlcad | backups should take a lot less time and not interfere with bzfs' on .bz so much |
| 02:52.48 | JeffM | well mostly I'm also hoping, more bandwith for stuff other then appache when it gets swamped |
| 02:52.59 | JeffM | like ssh sessions into it to get it unswamped :) |
| 02:53.26 | brlcad | apache presently gets swamped cpu-wise, rarely net |
| 02:53.49 | brlcad | and not apache itself, it's was more mysqld .. until that was fixed |
| 02:54.23 | brlcad | ever since I added the table indices, it's actually remained exceptionally responsive now .. mysql is no longer a pig |
| 02:54.41 | brlcad | night and day |
| 02:56.55 | AAA_awright | Surprise! Indexes speed up databases! |
| 02:57.22 | *** join/#bzflag macsforme (n=const@unaffiliated/macsforme) |
| 02:57.34 | AAA_awright | brlcad: You say the .bz ISP, is that opposed to something? |
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| 02:59.51 | brlcad | AAA_awright: it wasn't a surprise, it was more just that nobody had added them or tested them yet (or that that was even the problem) |
| 03:00.23 | brlcad | not sure what you mean by opposed to something |
| 03:03.20 | AAA_awright | Ah, nevermind. There was a Google Tech Talk on optimizing MySQL, by one of the developers of the MySQL engine, that has helped me cut much of the load off the database for Redjacket Stats. |
| 03:03.54 | AAA_awright | Reading the MySQL docs on optimizations helps too (I haven't read much of those though). |
| 03:04.42 | AAA_awright | And I wonder: How much money total is spent on BZFlag-related services? Most of it is probably hosting. |
| 03:07.00 | brlcad | the list server has cost about 70/month over the past couple years, plus a couple hundred in a hardware upgrades -- most of the "money" actually goes into _time_ spent on the server/setup and on-going maintenance (I don't consider my time cheap, much less free) |
| 03:07.39 | brlcad | the secondary one in germany is comprable, though getting more expensive as the dollar weakens every week :) |
| 03:07.45 | brlcad | ~spell comprable |
| 03:08.49 | AAA_awright | I mean all the servers dedicated to BZFlag, by all people... probably in the hundreds, maybe thousand dollars a month? |
| 03:09.01 | brlcad | ahh, yeah perhaps |
| 03:09.27 | Macrosoft | nah, my bandwidth is free... until Feb 5 |
| 03:09.39 | brlcad | average net connection that supports bzflag is probably on average $40-$100 |
| 03:09.59 | brlcad | even the "free" ones on a cable line are funded by those cable internet payments |
| 03:10.32 | brlcad | ~((40.0+100.0)/2.0) * 200.0 |
| 03:10.33 | ibot | 14000 |
| 03:10.43 | brlcad | rough estimate |
| 03:11.26 | Macrosoft | i wonder how much of that is leftover as profit for the isp's |
| 03:11.58 | Macrosoft | my guess would be 10% |
| 03:12.19 | AAA_awright | Except that only 5% of the servers are ever used, and multiple servers are run on one system. |
| 03:12.25 | Macrosoft | ...but i dont know what it costs to maintain a network that large |
| 03:12.57 | Macrosoft | AAA_awright: yes, but they still pay for their connection, even if nobody plays |
| 03:13.17 | AAA_awright | Well yah |
| 03:14.20 | *** join/#bzflag Flash (n=jwmelto@unaffiliated/flash) |
| 03:14.23 | AAA_awright | How many unique IP's are on the list server, then how many of those are dedicated to BZFlag? Multiply by 75. |
| 03:15.29 | AAA_awright | ...Except I don't keep IP's in the servers table. |
| 03:16.11 | AAA_awright | Later everyone. |
| 03:22.52 | brlcad | wow, it's been three years since .bz went on-line |
| 03:26.01 | Macrosoft | sleep... |
| 03:28.28 | Macrosoft | w00t! sig rotation script is working |
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| 04:19.22 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v DTRemenak] by ChanServ |
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| 06:27.07 | brlcad | using the already written serverstats.sh ... |
| 06:34.28 | brlcad | there are 251 reachable servers running right now, 101 unique hostnames, 72 unique IP addresses |
| 06:34.52 | ruskie | :) |
| 06:34.56 | brlcad | ~(72*75) |
| 06:34.57 | ibot | 5400 |
| 06:35.09 | a_meteorite | that's a good amount of dough into hosting |
| 06:36.00 | ruskie | considering that usually there's only like ~10 servers that are really active at any one time...(i.e. more than 2-3 ppl on) |
| 06:36.12 | a_meteorite | yup... |
| 06:36.29 | a_meteorite | course, I bet some of those are free, or they already pay for broadband and host it at home |
| 06:36.47 | a_meteorite | still I bet a good $3-4k is spent on hosting in bzflag. insanely sad. |
| 06:38.08 | brlcad | that's probably several full-time manyears of effort maintaining all those servers too, about 3 years minimum if every server takes up even just two weeks of someone's time to set up and maintain throughout an entire year |
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| 10:59.02 | Winny | losts pf people host on VPSs, so I imagine its alot less then 3000ish |
| 11:12.15 | ruskie | depends... |
| 11:12.18 | ruskie | some vps's aren't cheap |
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| 11:29.33 | daniel_jackson | mode +v |
| 11:29.37 | ruskie | lol |
| 11:29.55 | daniel_jackson | I'm just messing around while I wait |
| 11:31.01 | daniel_jackson | been waiting for hours for constitution |
| 11:31.31 | ruskie | so leave him a memo and go do something usefull... |
| 11:31.50 | daniel_jackson | I am I'm bugging you! lol |
| 11:32.01 | ruskie | lol |
| 11:32.24 | ruskie | to bug me you actually need to be within 20cms of my physical location... |
| 11:32.34 | ruskie | and be lucky if I actually notice you... |
| 11:32.34 | daniel_jackson | oh ok |
| 11:32.43 | daniel_jackson | lol |
| 11:33.55 | daniel_jackson | oh I'll probably take your advise |
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| 20:15.15 | JeffM | brlcad, what time to you leave in the morning? |
| 20:24.44 | Tupone | time for an rc3? |
| 20:25.19 | whodaman- | Any idea when a new stable version of BZ is coming ou |
| 20:25.20 | whodaman- | t |
| 20:25.33 | ruskie | RSN[TM] |
| 20:26.09 | Tupone | no TM on that |
| 20:28.15 | Manu | Tupone: ciao :) |
| 20:28.26 | Tupone | hola Manu |
| 20:28.37 | Manu | today is the date for the RC3 IIRC |
| 20:29.15 | Tupone | yeah, it should be ... but noway to get neither a Mac build nor a fix for Winny |
| 20:30.59 | Manu | I'm not Mac user so I can't help :/ |
| 20:32.18 | L4m3r | anyone know how to do an SVN checkout without getting the top directory? |
| 20:32.46 | L4m3r | say I want to download trunk... can I checkout trunk and get all the files without them being put in a separate "trunk" directory? |
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| 20:36.06 | JeffM | Tupone, I could go for one. |
| 20:36.27 | JeffM | L4m3r, add /bzflag to the URL ;) |
| 20:36.38 | L4m3r | this is my own repo :\ |
| 20:36.52 | L4m3r | and even then I'd still get everything in a bzflag dir :P |
| 20:37.05 | JeffM | you can just keep adding dirs |
| 20:37.16 | JeffM | to get what ever sub path you want |
| 20:37.22 | L4m3r | (man, DreamHost's SVN is slower than SF's) |
| 20:37.42 | L4m3r | but what if there are several sub-paths I want to get at once? |
| 20:37.54 | L4m3r | the wildcard doesn't work |
| 20:38.04 | JeffM | so like if you wanted to get /src and /inc but not /MSVC? |
| 20:38.29 | L4m3r | no, if I wanted to get everything |
| 20:38.35 | L4m3r | but in the current dir |
| 20:38.50 | L4m3r | and not make another subdir on the local drive |
| 20:39.01 | JeffM | huh? |
| 20:39.09 | Manu | L4m3r: you mean mkdir somedir && cd somedir && svn co....? |
| 20:39.22 | JeffM | so you have c:\bzflag\ on your drive and you want to get trunk |
| 20:39.28 | L4m3r | like, say I've got a directory in /home for this project |
| 20:39.30 | JeffM | \\bzflag to go into that dir |
| 20:39.36 | L4m3r | exactly. |
| 20:39.38 | JeffM | with out being c:\bzflag\bzflag |
| 20:39.39 | JeffM | oh |
| 20:39.53 | JeffM | go into the bzflag dir |
| 20:39.58 | JeffM | you using tort? |
| 20:40.05 | JeffM | or command line? |
| 20:40.08 | L4m3r | nah, svn :) |
| 20:40.27 | L4m3r | especially in this class |
| 20:40.41 | Manu | L4m3r: I have trunk/bzflag :) |
| 20:40.55 | JeffM | go into the dir, and then just add bzflag to the URL IIRC |
| 20:41.11 | L4m3r | hm |
| 20:41.15 | JeffM | it'll take whatever is in the URL dir and put that into your CWD |
| 20:41.58 | JeffM | at least that's all I'm doing on tort, and it just puts all the /src /inc, etc into the dir I right click in |
| 20:42.09 | JeffM | no extra /bzflag |
| 20:42.30 | Chestal | L4m3r: I think you can do svn co https://foodledoodle/trunk . |
| 20:42.58 | L4m3r | Chestal: yeah, just tried that and it did the trick, thanks :) |
| 20:43.12 | L4m3r | just add a ./ param and it won't add a dir for you |
| 20:45.16 | Manu | L4m3r: only need the dot (you can omit the slash) :) |
| 20:45.21 | L4m3r | yeah |
| 20:45.26 | L4m3r | just a habit :P |
| 20:53.09 | CIA-25 | BZFlag: 03atupone * r16009 10/branches/v2_0branch/bzflag/ (configure.ac src/date/buildDate.cxx): Mark it rc3 |
| 20:56.21 | Tupone | JeffM: you need to make some other things, like tagging? |
| 20:56.33 | JeffM | you can tag too |
| 20:56.36 | JeffM | :) |
| 20:56.46 | JeffM | I have a bit of real work to do |
| 20:56.48 | Manu | The README file also may be updated I guess |
| 20:56.51 | Tupone | no need for change on project files? |
| 20:56.55 | JeffM | nope |
| 20:57.04 | JeffM | just the installer |
| 20:57.07 | JeffM | I can do that real fast |
| 20:57.24 | Tupone | ahh ok. I pass on it :) |
| 20:58.20 | CIA-25 | BZFlag: 03JeffM2501 * r16010 10/branches/v2_0branch/bzflag/package/win32/nsis/BZFlag.nsi: rc3 |
| 20:58.25 | JeffM | it's a simple change |
| 20:58.32 | JeffM | so tag it and go |
| 20:58.39 | JeffM | I can build a windows verison later tongiht |
| 20:58.44 | JeffM | while I'm packing |
| 20:58.56 | Tupone | going to google? |
| 20:58.59 | JeffM | yes |
| 20:59.20 | Tupone | I guess is very near (compared to Sean) |
| 20:59.35 | JeffM | tomrow |
| 21:00.10 | CIA-25 | BZFlag: 03jujibo * r16011 10/branches/v2_0branch/bzflag/README: Update release version |
| 21:06.48 | L4m3r | who's jujibo? o_O |
| 21:07.30 | Manu | who knows |
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| 21:07.36 | L4m3r | lol |
| 21:07.37 | jujibo | L4m3r: :p |
| 21:08.02 | jujibo | rofl.. someone used Manu :/ |
| 21:08.27 | Tupone | you kicked Tim |
| 21:08.43 | Manu | yes, my mistake :) |
| 21:09.54 | Manu | L4m3r: indeed, time ago I was more active.. ;) |
| 21:10.58 | L4m3r | I just don't know all the SF names |
| 21:11.36 | Manu | I commit as jujibo (my true nick) and play as Manu :) |
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| 21:19.46 | JeffM | Tupone, is it tagged? |
| 21:19.58 | Tupone | not yet |
| 21:21.01 | JeffM | k |
| 21:21.45 | *** topic/#bzflag by JeffM -> http://BZFlag.org || http://cia.vc/stats/project/BZFlag || http://my.BZFlag.org/w/Getting_Help || http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/9453 || http://ohloh.net/projects/189 || http://my.bzflag.org/w/ || 2.0.10rc3 in progress |
| 21:22.42 | Tupone | JeffM: if the last tag you did worked, better you do again. Otherwise I shoudl wonder in the doc to use that copy command |
| 21:22.57 | JeffM | I fear my tags |
| 21:23.12 | JeffM | I'd be more happy if a real svn command line user did it |
| 21:23.24 | JeffM | I make a new dir in tags then do a copy |
| 21:23.36 | JeffM | that dosn't seem to be the best way I think |
| 21:23.47 | Tupone | ok, but just wait. I'm the middle of preparing a package for etracer for gentoo |
| 21:24.00 | JeffM | but one sec, I may have a bug in the build system for plugins |
| 21:24.18 | JeffM | nope, I'm just an idiot :) |
| 21:25.11 | Manu | we can write a script to change versions numbers and to tag :) |
| 21:25.30 | JeffM | I'd rather they be seperate |
| 21:25.39 | JeffM | but if you want to make this tag, please do so |
| 21:26.31 | JeffM | Tupone, do you want me to do the post on the fourms too? |
| 21:27.05 | Tupone | how do you prepare the build? |
| 21:27.10 | JeffM | ? |
| 21:27.11 | Tupone | the tar I mean? |
| 21:27.14 | Tupone | make dist? |
| 21:27.19 | JeffM | I let somone else do it :) |
| 21:27.27 | JeffM | then just update the links |
| 21:27.32 | JeffM | but yes, they come from a make dist |
| 21:27.36 | Tupone | ahh, ok. so I post there |
| 21:27.41 | JeffM | last time constitution did them |
| 21:27.51 | JeffM | yeah just upload them |
| 21:28.04 | JeffM | and I've been removing the old files, when the new ones are in place |
| 21:28.08 | Tupone | I have low upload band |
| 21:28.12 | JeffM | do you want me to do the fourm post? |
| 21:28.17 | Tupone | yeah |
| 21:28.20 | JeffM | k |
| 21:28.28 | JeffM | it's just a copy paste so its fast :) |
| 21:31.48 | JeffM | can somone check over, http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?p=115645#115645 in the admin playground? |
| 21:31.56 | JeffM | should be the same as last time |
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| 21:32.37 | Erroneous | JeffM: windows installer link there still goes to rc2 |
| 21:32.42 | JeffM | yeah I fixed that |
| 21:32.43 | JeffM | reload |
| 21:33.52 | JeffM | Erroneous, if it looks good use your super cow powers to moave it to releases and versions and we are good. |
| 21:34.04 | JeffM | well when somone tags |
| 21:34.40 | JeffM | is anyone taging? |
| 21:34.51 | JeffM | I can try my whackasstag again if need be |
| 21:37.45 | Manu | JeffM: almost done.. k |
| 21:38.27 | JeffM | ok |
| 21:38.39 | JeffM | just wanted to know if you were doing it :) |
| 21:38.48 | JeffM | since you didn't say anything |
| 21:39.27 | Manu | executing... |
| 21:39.34 | CIA-25 | BZFlag: 03jujibo * r16012 10/tags/v2_0_10RC3/: Tag RC3 |
| 21:39.35 | Manu | in the same way you did the last |
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| 21:41.31 | JeffM | there has to be a better way |
| 21:41.37 | JeffM | like just a 'make a tag" command |
| 21:41.39 | JeffM | but thank you |
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| 21:42.11 | JeffM | checking in some scripts to do both a version change, and a tag would not be bad, but I'd make them be seperate scrips |
| 21:42.21 | Tupone | there is no make tag. IMHO we need to add an extra directory in the destination path, We will do, in case, for the 2.0.10 |
| 21:42.24 | JeffM | we version change often with out doing a tag |
| 21:42.31 | Manu | JeffM: yes I agree |
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| 21:46.25 | JeffM | baby got an atom bomb! |
| 21:47.16 | iWinny | orly |
| 21:48.08 | JeffM | forsooth |
| 21:50.29 | JeffM | tho I just realised we forgot to update something :) |
| 21:50.47 | JeffM | something the script can't do |
| 21:51.03 | JeffM | title.png |
| 21:53.51 | JeffM | not that it's a big deal |
| 21:53.53 | CIA-25 | BZFlag: 03JeffM2501 * r16013 10/branches/v2_0branch/bzflag/data/title.png: RC3-tastic |
| 21:55.38 | Manu | heh |
| 21:56.19 | CIA-25 | BZFlag: 03JeffM2501 * r16014 10/branches/v2_0branch/bzflag/data/title.png: just take the number out of the image, and make it be an "rc". if we want a number in it, we should code that in using GL (wavy 3d flag ) |
| 21:56.37 | a_meteorite | new in RC3? |
| 21:56.43 | JeffM | your mom |
| 21:56.58 | JeffM | nothing realy |
| 21:56.59 | a_meteorite | great, I was wondering when she'd lose that weight |
| 21:57.02 | JeffM | I think 2 small fixes |
| 21:57.21 | a_meteorite | is the server crashing constantly fixed? blast007 was saying RC2 was very unstable |
| 21:57.24 | JeffM | a problem with an observer command that could cause issues |
| 21:57.27 | a_meteorite | I kept RC1 and didn't go to RC2 cause of it |
| 21:57.38 | JeffM | I don't know |
| 21:57.41 | JeffM | you can check the logs |
| 21:57.45 | a_meteorite | k |
| 21:57.48 | JeffM | but that isn't enough of a report |
| 21:57.52 | JeffM | just calling it "unstable" |
| 21:58.02 | JeffM | it's not like major things have been rewriten |
| 21:58.06 | a_meteorite | well, I believe he narrowed it down to a specific problem, what that is, I don't know |
| 21:58.26 | JeffM | how do you know its a specific problem if you don't know what it is? |
| 21:58.34 | JeffM | you mean a specific way to cause the crash? |
| 21:58.35 | a_meteorite | because I don't remember |
| 21:58.38 | a_meteorite | yeah |
| 21:58.57 | JeffM | and you don't remember it... |
| 21:59.00 | JeffM | great.. |
| 21:59.04 | JeffM | that's a lot of help |
| 21:59.30 | a_meteorite | hey, being a dev himself I would have imagined he would have fixed it or told ya guys |
| 22:00.07 | JeffM | comunication is key |
| 22:00.29 | JeffM | just hoping that one person has the time to do something is bad |
| 22:00.57 | JeffM | and assuming that one issue is reported to everyone... |
| 22:04.53 | Tupone | a_meteorite: TH cheat intersecting was causing crashes and now is fixed (should be) |
| 22:05.03 | a_meteorite | oh, ok |
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| 22:18.24 | AAA_awright | Checking build. |
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