| 00:05.47 | spatialguru | cool, thx |
| 00:06.09 | *** join/#bzflag Jefenry (n=jeffreyd@pool-71-253-235-164.nrflva.east.verizon.net) |
| 00:06.12 | spatialguru | I was just loading a map image into my web map, but realised it was out of date b/c i'd restarted bzfs several times since :D |
| 00:08.45 | delusional | yeah... -c is definitely the option you want |
| 00:17.35 | *** join/#bzflag cods (n=cods@tuxee.net) |
| 00:18.12 | spatialguru | i've finally got a map working well now with a 1 second update of the web map |
| 00:18.17 | spatialguru | Next challenge, multi tanks :) |
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| 01:03.17 | spldart | LOL's..... |
| 01:03.47 | spldart | Me on "all hands on deck" That's alotta bots! Him "Yeah, I was lonely" hehe |
| 01:04.33 | spldart | btw.. if anyone who admin's or cops on all hands is in here... poll was not working earlier... had a cheater but couldn't start poll ban |
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| 01:11.20 | *** join/#bzflag nn-laptop (n=nn@74.94.43.195) |
| 01:13.05 | nn-bluetooth | hi all |
| 01:13.39 | nn-bluetooth | brad your AHOD Setup is popular right now |
| 01:15.25 | blast007 | nn-bluetooth: someone mentioned that poll bans where broken on the server |
| 01:15.40 | blast007 | there was a cheater on, and they could not poll ban them |
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| 01:16.13 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v trepan] by ChanServ |
| 01:16.58 | blast007 | hi trepan :) |
| 01:17.08 | trepan | hiya |
| 01:19.30 | spldart | Oh... nn... Your serving ahod right now? |
| 01:19.37 | spldart | You might wanna turn off bots hehe |
| 01:20.03 | spldart | Unless that was you ;~) |
| 01:20.39 | spldart | BTW as a anon report. your server bandwidth is ok it would seem |
| 01:20.48 | spldart | Not great but ok |
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| 01:21.40 | Cruel_dog | hi |
| 01:21.44 | Cruel_dog | who here is a bz dev? |
| 01:22.06 | spldart | They are legion |
| 01:22.18 | Cruel_dog | lergion? |
| 01:22.21 | Cruel_dog | legion*? |
| 01:22.26 | spldart | NM |
| 01:22.52 | Cruel_dog | is l4m3r one? |
| 01:23.36 | Cruel_dog | or sportchick? |
| 01:23.36 | L4m3r | [c] mebbe ;) |
| 01:23.36 | Cruel_dog | lol |
| 01:23.36 | blast007 | Cruel_dog: what do you need? |
| 01:23.43 | Cruel_dog | nah ill im, ty |
| 01:23.48 | Cruel_dog | /m l4m3r |
| 01:23.49 | Cruel_dog | gah |
| 01:23.55 | L4m3r | [c] lol |
| 01:23.56 | blast007 | ... |
| 01:24.00 | Cruel_dog | sry |
| 01:24.01 | Cruel_dog | its msg |
| 01:24.21 | blast007 | there are several devs here, Cruel_dog |
| 01:24.50 | blast007 | what do you need? |
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| 01:29.07 | Winny | ... |
| 01:29.12 | Winny | he is so weird. |
| 01:34.46 | Macrosoft | WinnyAFK: what did the priest say when he tried to exorcise a demon in his linux box? |
| 01:35.43 | spatialguru | killall win.exe ? |
| 01:36.33 | spatialguru | mv *.dll /dev/null ? |
| 01:36.44 | blast007 | Macrosoft: we don't care |
| 01:37.32 | spldart | Maybe I shouldn't have made the exorcist joke |
| 01:37.43 | AWOSLappy | Macrosoft: something about FreeBSD? |
| 01:45.28 | CBG | trepan: ping |
| 01:47.03 | spldart | BTW... someone was asking me on an unmetioned server if meteorite was a cheater... IIR the tank name C |
| 01:47.17 | spldart | I said no but mentioned their could very well be an imposter |
| 01:47.53 | trepan | CBG: pong |
| 01:48.16 | CBG | trepan: can I message you? :) |
| 01:48.21 | blast007 | spldart: there is an imposter |
| 01:48.35 | spldart | Glad I threw in the |
| 01:48.39 | trepan | sure |
| 01:48.43 | spldart | <PROTECTED> |
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| 02:05.05 | jude- | hello all |
| 02:05.40 | CBG | someone had to have HELP setting up VISTA ?!! |
| 02:05.47 | CBG | Whatever next!?! |
| 02:06.01 | blast007 | CBG: Vista needs all the help it can get |
| 02:06.05 | jude- | heh |
| 02:06.07 | CBG | damn straight |
| 02:06.12 | jude- | it certainly took its time! |
| 02:06.14 | spldart | IB |
| 02:06.34 | CBG | what do invisible bullets have to do with vista? |
| 02:06.43 | spldart | heh |
| 02:06.53 | jude- | that EULA was pretty scary |
| 02:07.08 | jude- | "you cannot work around the limitations of the Software" was one of the lines |
| 02:07.11 | spldart | Before it was "invisible bullets" it was "In Before"... In this case.. language warning |
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| 02:23.14 | brlcad | donny_baker: imagemagik is/was already loaded |
| 02:23.25 | brlcad | SportChick: pong |
| 02:24.29 | brlcad | daxxar: I'll be your mentor |
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| 04:18.22 | knoppix_ | what are the ./configure optinons to turn off the client and enable plugin support |
| 04:18.45 | blast007 | for 2.0.x or 2.1.x? |
| 04:18.53 | blast007 | both use --disable-client |
| 04:19.04 | blast007 | 2.0.x uses --enable-shared for plugins |
| 04:19.08 | knoppix_ | svn one |
| 04:19.14 | blast007 | both are in SVN |
| 04:19.47 | blast007 | v2_0branch (2.0.x) is compatible with current game servers |
| 04:20.40 | blast007 | 2.1.x uses --enable-plugins |
| 04:20.49 | blast007 | 2.1 is the development version for what will become 2.2 |
| 04:21.11 | blast007 | definately not guarenteed to be in working condition all the time |
| 05:08.28 | TimRiker | x gr en ανοδυνη |
| 05:08.39 | TimRiker | ~x gr en ανοδυνη |
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| 05:33.49 | jude- | hello all |
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| 05:35.04 | blast007 | hi jude- |
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| 06:10.03 | Macrosoft | *primary systems failing: going offline* |
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| 06:57.50 | Thumper_ | jude-: hi |
| 06:57.57 | jude- | hello Thumper_ |
| 06:58.44 | Thumper_ | got a segfault for you :) |
| 06:58.52 | jude- | bring it on |
| 06:58.59 | Thumper_ | start bzworkbench |
| 06:59.04 | Thumper_ | double click one block |
| 06:59.09 | Thumper_ | double click other block and drag |
| 06:59.54 | jude- | no segfault here... |
| 07:00.01 | Thumper_ | Warning: detected OpenGL error 'invalid enumerant' after RenderBin::draw(,) |
| 07:00.01 | Thumper_ | Segmentation fault (core dumped) |
| 07:00.38 | jude- | that's an OpenSceneGraph error |
| 07:00.53 | Thumper_ | ok |
| 07:01.06 | jude- | the only OpenGL enumerant I explicitely use is GL_DEPTH_TEST |
| 07:01.16 | jude- | to disable the depth testing for the 3D cursor |
| 07:01.39 | delusional | jude, I'd like to thank you for the large amount and clarity of the comments in you code. I can almost follow what's going on. here's the stupid question, what exactly is a geode? Is it a term that encapsulates the X/Y/Z coordinates in one term? or does a geode include more than coordinates? |
| 07:01.53 | jude- | a geode is a GEOmetry noDE |
| 07:02.00 | jude- | it's a subclass of osg::Node |
| 07:02.25 | jude- | with a geode you can add osg::Drawables, which can encapsulate osg::Shapes |
| 07:02.30 | jude- | *osg::ShapeDrawables |
| 07:02.42 | jude- | as well as osg::Geometrys |
| 07:02.55 | delusional | ok, good enough |
| 07:02.58 | Thumper_ | jude-: ok it's 3AM... I'm going to bed :) night! |
| 07:03.04 | jude- | good night Thumper_ |
| 07:03.31 | jude- | I use geodes because I can also directly manipulate the geometry data (i.e. vertices, indeces, texture coordinates, etc) |
| 07:04.39 | jude- | delusional: osg::PositionAttitudeTransform encapsulates x/y/z coordinates and attitude, which is a 4D vector that stores both pitch and roll. My Renderable class is a subclass of osg::PositionAttitudeTransform |
| 07:04.45 | delusional | so it's everything that goes into a whole object? |
| 07:05.12 | jude- | as in...? |
| 07:06.19 | delusional | I was googling geode and getting rocks.... now i have geometry node and can research further on my own |
| 07:06.28 | jude- | google "osg geode" |
| 07:06.43 | delusional | yeah.. i was getting a dead end on that term |
| 07:07.13 | jude- | unfortunately, OpenSceneGraph isn't very well documented outside of it's UML diagrams :P |
| 07:10.37 | jude- | delusional: any other questions? :) |
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| 07:11.15 | Thonolan | hellos |
| 07:11.20 | Thonolan | configure: WARNING: Client build has been requested, but GL is not fully available (missing gl.h) |
| 07:11.21 | Thonolan | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:11.38 | jude- | you need OpenGL development files installed |
| 07:11.48 | Thonolan | ah many thanks |
| 07:11.51 | jude- | np :) |
| 07:12.00 | Thonolan | wow thats quick support ;) |
| 07:12.01 | delusional | thankyou, no, I just hadnt put together geode with osg... another five minutes and i would have come up with it myself.. maybe |
| 07:12.29 | jude- | delusional: feel free to ask me anything you need :) |
| 07:13.38 | delusional | how will object naming work? the only thing that REQUIRES a name is teleporters |
| 07:15.09 | jude- | basically, all the BZW object data is stored in a subclass of DataEntry |
| 07:15.19 | jude- | they are stored in string form |
| 07:16.00 | jude- | the update() method in DataEntry is implemented by all derived classes, and it's job is to parse BZW-formatted text and store data in class-specific data constructs |
| 07:16.20 | jude- | one such subclass is bz2object |
| 07:16.26 | delusional | if you could work in somethhing for telporter link tables, that would be quite nice... right now the only way to do tele links is basicly trial and error |
| 07:16.54 | jude- | yeah--teleporter links will be rendered |
| 07:16.58 | delusional | nice |
| 07:17.07 | delusional | quite nice |
| 07:17.16 | jude- | you see, bz2object has a method called makeRenderable(), which turns all of its data into a Renderable to be drawn |
| 07:17.47 | jude- | the teleporter object will just return a mesh of itself, and possibly geometric data modeling links to other teleporters |
| 07:18.37 | jude- | so, any renderable object (all of which are subclasses of bz2object) can represent itself in any way it needs to |
| 07:18.38 | delusional | a lot of people have requested that teles can be laid flat... can't do it now |
| 07:18.48 | jude- | nope |
| 07:18.51 | delusional | z=.125 |
| 07:19.37 | Thonolan | jude you have any idea how the packet called for opengl dev files i need ? |
| 07:19.56 | jude- | Thonolan: first, which OS are you using? |
| 07:20.00 | Thonolan | i use kubuntu 7.10 |
| 07:20.40 | jude- | you'll need to sudo apt-get install libgl-dev |
| 07:21.09 | Thonolan | jude-: i will try |
| 07:22.15 | jude- | delusional: unfortunately I can't do much about that...that's BZFlag's shortcoming when it comes to handling teleporters |
| 07:22.27 | jude- | i.e. the client can only render them vertically |
| 07:22.47 | delusional | well, teles are named differently than everything else... |
| 07:22.57 | delusional | teleporter /y5 |
| 07:23.31 | delusional | I'm not exactly sure how that's gonna work uot. |
| 07:23.56 | jude- | delusional: BZW's text representation of a teleporter provides no way to represent data that controls it's angular orientation aside from it's heading (i.e. rotation around the Z axis) |
| 07:24.56 | jude- | i.e. according to BZFlag, there is no way to lay a teleporter flat |
| 07:25.04 | jude- | because BZFlag doesn't know how |
| 07:25.17 | jude- | so even if BZWB could provide a way to do that, it wouldn't show up that way in the client |
| 07:25.48 | delusional | i know.. im worried about the tele name .. from the manpages... |
| 07:25.50 | delusional | teleporter [name] |
| 07:25.50 | delusional | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:26.06 | jude- | what about it? |
| 07:26.28 | delusional | i think its going to have to be handled differently than the rest |
| 07:26.32 | jude- | nah |
| 07:26.36 | delusional | ok. |
| 07:26.37 | jude- | well, slightly |
| 07:27.14 | jude- | if two or more teleporters are marked as selected, the main menu will show a "link" option |
| 07:27.16 | delusional | you can use a name line for it... but that doesn't work for the linkage table |
| 07:27.46 | jude- | who said anything about using a linkage table? |
| 07:27.53 | jude- | linkage will be handled graphically |
| 07:28.02 | jude- | no configuration dialog needed |
| 07:28.14 | delusional | sounds great, as usual, |
| 07:28.20 | jude- | thanks :) |
| 07:28.23 | delusional | youdaman |
| 07:29.14 | jude- | determining whether or not a teleporter is selected is trivial--just checking the output of DataEntry.getHeader() will give the type of selected object |
| 07:29.38 | jude- | the name happens to be "teleporter", BZWB will dynamic_cast the DataEntry into a Teleporter |
| 07:30.08 | jude- | and then use Teleporter-specific methods to determine the link name and update the list of other Teleporters the selected ones are linked to |
| 07:30.55 | jude- | that all happens behind the scenes; all the user has to do is click "(un)link" from the menu, and the linkage will show up graphically :) |
| 07:31.16 | delusional | I'm happy |
| 07:31.38 | jude- | that's what matters :) |
| 07:31.49 | Thonolan | jude-: thanks again tip was fine |
| 07:31.58 | jude- | Thonolan: np :) |
| 07:32.05 | Thonolan | :) |
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| 07:35.11 | jude- | delusional: here's the sequence of events: (1) The user selects "(un)link". (2) the View class gets from the Selection class (if valid) for all the selected teleporters (if there are less than 2 the whole thing bails). (3) the View class gets the bz2object that corresponds to the selected Renderables from it's internal objMap member. (4) the View dynamic_casts the bz2objects into Teleporters and updates their link tables. (5) the View asks |
| 07:36.58 | jude- | there are some smaller, minor details, but that's the jist of it :) |
| 07:37.01 | delusional | that's more than I need.. I haven't even attempted to compile the app yet, but do read the commits. |
| 07:37.31 | delusional | soon a few of us will put forth a concerted effort to mac-compile it. |
| 07:37.42 | jude- | heh--that entire sequence doesn't even exist as code yet :P |
| 07:38.09 | jude- | delusional: sweet! I don't have a Mac to try it on; you guys are pivotal in getting Mac support working :) |
| 07:38.55 | delusional | next week, probably |
| 07:39.03 | jude- | nice |
| 07:39.23 | jude- | so far, ts has reported that he has gotten it to work |
| 07:39.29 | jude- | ...but that was a while ago :P |
| 07:39.29 | delusional | as far as I can tell... the only dependency is going to be an osg package |
| 07:39.43 | jude- | you're also going to need FLTK dev headers |
| 07:39.47 | delusional | I read that exchange with ts |
| 07:40.06 | jude- | and you'll need OSG 2.0 (which you'll probably need to build from source) |
| 07:40.42 | delusional | there may be other dependencies he already has, that I dont |
| 07:41.09 | jude- | you'll need OpenGL headers and libs, OSG 2.0 headers and libs, and FLTK 1.1.7 headers and libs |
| 07:41.17 | jude- | those are the only extra libs I use |
| 07:41.21 | delusional | opengl I have |
| 07:41.26 | jude- | outside of libstdc++, libglibc, etc. :P |
| 07:43.19 | jude- | also...it runs in X11 |
| 07:43.40 | jude- | just a heads-up on that :P |
| 07:45.20 | delusional | I'll talk to ts |
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| 08:00.31 | delusional | if it was me, I'd force users to give each object a unique name, I'm tired of looking a maps that have "name meshbox_copy_435", that's just me, though |
| 08:01.33 | jude- | would that really be necessary of BZWB can just render the map for users to visualize? |
| 08:02.19 | delusional | that's true.. I'm not looking forward |
| 08:02.28 | delusional | too used to mapping in text |
| 08:02.34 | jude- | heh |
| 08:02.47 | jude- | the goal of this project is to eliminate the need to do everything by text editor |
| 08:03.19 | jude- | each object's config dialog will have a name field, however |
| 08:03.40 | delusional | sounds like a plan |
| 08:03.51 | jude- | but if the user doesn't put one there, an autogenerated one will :P |
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| 09:44.42 | daxxar | Hey chums! |
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| 14:18.22 | ts_laptop | trepan: ping |
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| 15:19.53 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03daxxar * r14494 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzrobots/ (8 files): |
| 15:19.53 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: RCRobotPlayer: Support for 'stored' values for setStop/setResume (reindented some). |
| 15:19.54 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: Added SetResumeReq, SetStopReq. |
| 15:19.54 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: MessageUtilities now has parse and parseSingle, which are template-functions. (Makes it prettier to extend) |
| 15:20.03 | daxxar | Car-commit! |
| 15:22.10 | brlcad | ~daxxar++ |
| 15:22.20 | Winny | ~daxxar++ |
| 15:25.12 | ts_laptop | Does someone know why the texsizes have changed in 2.1 and are different between box and arc in 2.0.x? |
| 15:26.56 | ts_laptop | In 2.0 that means a box and an arc have the same textures but the arc wall texture has a different scaling factor |
| 15:28.46 | ts_laptop | same between meshboxes and boxes |
| 15:29.08 | brlcad | because the code is constantly changing? |
| 15:29.25 | ts_laptop | I would like to change it, to let them fit each other in 2.0.x but...then the existing maps will look different |
| 15:30.32 | ts_laptop | brlcad: Well, I thought there may be a real reason |
| 15:30.51 | ts_laptop | Not like "it went that way" |
| 15:33.00 | ts_laptop | and I'm wondering whether there is auto-stripping when there is no drawinfo specified |
| 15:34.50 | brlcad | if you want to be sure, read the commit messages |
| 15:35.03 | brlcad | see why it was changed at all, that's what they're there for |
| 15:43.50 | ts_laptop | Hrm but I think it's really long ago.. |
| 15:47.30 | ts_laptop | LOL, it was already like this in the initial version of CustomArc.cxx |
| 16:08.50 | brlcad | so then they haven't "changed" it sounds? |
| 16:08.56 | brlcad | just not what you want/expect |
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| 16:12.41 | ts_laptop | brlcad: It doesn't fit the other textures, that's my only concern |
| 16:14.30 | brlcad | so, make it fit, what's the downside? |
| 16:16.28 | ts_laptop | Downside is if I change arc and mesh (internally arc is a mesh) then textures will look differently scaled on those buildings. If I change box then meshes with the texcoords fitting the texcoords of the 2.0.8 boxes will not fit the 2.0.9 boxes |
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| 16:25.18 | brlcad | ts_laptop: there will not be a 2.0.10 release so worrying about compatibility is pointless |
| 16:26.09 | brlcad | the question is still "what is right", looking differently isn't right or wrong. if it can be made consistent so there's fewer exceptions, I'd day that's better |
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| 16:33.59 | Erroneous | worrying about 2.0 at all is pointless, I'd say |
| 16:34.11 | Erroneous | if 2.1 does what's right, it's all good |
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| 16:44.46 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14495 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzrobots/MessageUtilities.h: namespaces don't get the semi |
| 16:51.21 | brlcad | DTRemenak: your help menu fix did fix |
| 16:51.26 | Erroneous | cool |
| 17:00.47 | JeffM | so how are all the GSoC projects commin now that midterms are here? |
| 17:02.19 | JeffM | heard a lot from draxar and jude, how are the others doing |
| 17:03.13 | Erroneous | they all seem to be moving, at least. haven't seen any code from L4m3r yet, but his mentor may have. Epyon is apparently making reaonable progress, just hasn't checked anything in yet. |
| 17:03.47 | JeffM | L4m3r, how ya doin? haven't heard you talk much about it, were you going to use libIRC? |
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| 17:08.30 | trepan | ts_laptop: pong |
| 17:09.56 | ts_laptop | trepan: I'm having understanding problems with drawinfo of bz: Why did you let the mappers specify the stripping and LOD? |
| 17:11.02 | trepan | why not? |
| 17:11.04 | brlcad | ts_laptop: what's the actual problem, that "why" question is so loaded to begin with |
| 17:11.08 | ts_laptop | I would expect an application to do stripping and LOD itself. |
| 17:11.11 | TylerM | v2 branch missing plugin_utils ? |
| 17:11.15 | JeffM | because it's the best way to let ANYTHING be done in the LOD |
| 17:11.23 | JeffM | automatics can't handle all cases |
| 17:11.50 | JeffM | hand striping can be a lot better then atutomatic striping |
| 17:12.09 | ts_laptop | I've seen some cracked polys in the past but not very much |
| 17:12.18 | JeffM | depends on the input geometry |
| 17:12.21 | trepan | when doing normal mapping stuff, i also tend to allow custom tangent/binormals specification instead of using auto-gen'ed versions |
| 17:12.26 | JeffM | I don't think you have seen all possible input geometry |
| 17:12.33 | Erroneous | lod really needs to be done by the mapper, so they can decide what is acceptable. humans notice some details missing, and not others, and it's very difficult for a machine to produce optimal reduced-detail models for this reason |
| 17:12.37 | brlcad | ts_laptop: so are you going to write the automatic lod code? |
| 17:12.53 | trepan | it's nice to add generators to applications first, but best to start with the more flexible approach |
| 17:13.02 | JeffM | for many situations it's faster to go bust out a billboard for an LOD instead of some auto folded thing |
| 17:13.02 | trepan | s/first/later |
| 17:13.09 | ts_laptop | brlcad: I'm trying to understand what it does and why |
| 17:13.21 | JeffM | it does it because it was writen that way |
| 17:13.33 | JeffM | it was the easiest most flexable solution |
| 17:13.41 | JeffM | nothing more |
| 17:13.43 | JeffM | nothing less |
| 17:13.57 | JeffM | you spend too much time looking for deep meaning that isn't there, IMHO |
| 17:14.03 | brlcad | ts_laptop: your questions aren't understanding what, you're only asking why so far and the why questions amount to "why did you name the feature foo instead of bar??" .. entirely fruitless at least the way you're phrasing them |
| 17:14.34 | ts_laptop | Hrm, ok |
| 17:14.46 | JeffM | an automated LOD tool would be great |
| 17:15.00 | trepan | i had one made that went through OSG, iirc |
| 17:15.01 | JeffM | the better question is, "is it better to have that tool be in the map editor, or the server" |
| 17:15.08 | JeffM | that is a valid question |
| 17:15.13 | Erroneous | ts_laptop: if you're interested in lod stuff, you should check out some of the papers published by Peter Schroeder's multiresolution rendering group at caltech. http://www.multires.caltech.edu/research/research.htm |
| 17:15.15 | JeffM | with pros and cons of each way |
| 17:15.27 | trepan | JeffM: both ;-) |
| 17:15.32 | JeffM | trepan, exactly |
| 17:15.45 | JeffM | make one option be auto, and the server does it. and one option to burn it into the map |
| 17:15.50 | JeffM | for hand edits |
| 17:15.55 | JeffM | that is best |
| 17:16.01 | JeffM | just means you make a libLOD |
| 17:16.02 | JeffM | :) |
| 17:17.10 | brlcad | ts_laptop: could just be a language issue, but it's really annoying to get ridiculous "why" questions that really amount to coin flip or level of effort decisions -- asking if there was a technical reason for there not being automatic LOD, for example, would have been a better question |
| 17:17.56 | ts_laptop | trepan: Another question: I heard you made the drawinfos for LouMan's churchyard map, there are very much corners and the drawinfo structures look rather big. Did you automate that? |
| 17:18.32 | trepan | which objects? |
| 17:18.54 | ts_laptop | For example that moving "ghost" |
| 17:19.15 | trepan | don't think i did that one for him |
| 17:20.13 | ts_laptop | Which ones did you do? |
| 17:21.57 | ts_laptop | Let me try to express my problem better: I'm having very much problems trying to use drawinfo, even for a simple box |
| 17:22.11 | ts_laptop | My corners are always bad |
| 17:22.35 | ts_laptop | Is there a tool I can use to automate it? |
| 17:22.55 | brlcad | jude- is working on one :) |
| 17:23.48 | brlcad | though I doubt he'd get to automatic lods |
| 17:23.56 | quine | guys |
| 17:23.59 | quine | i'm really creeped out right now |
| 17:24.05 | quine | my macbook's dvd drive just sang |
| 17:24.10 | quine | three notes |
| 17:24.14 | quine | in quick succession |
| 17:24.27 | quine | a g# f(but a little flat) |
| 17:26.40 | Epyon | quine, be happy it wasn't re - mi - do - do(low) - sol :P |
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| 17:27.25 | quine | i'm afraid i don't understand :\ |
| 17:27.57 | Epyon | Close Encounters of the Third Kind theme :P |
| 17:27.59 | quine | i can hear those notes, but i don't get it |
| 17:28.00 | quine | ahh |
| 17:28.07 | quine | i JUST got that dvd and haven't watched it yet :\ |
| 17:28.25 | brlcad | a classic |
| 17:28.48 | Epyon | well it would surely fream ME out if my DVD sang that xP |
| 17:28.53 | quine | WAIT |
| 17:28.53 | Epyon | freak* |
| 17:28.56 | quine | HOW DID THE DISC GET IN THERE |
| 17:29.14 | quine | oh wait no i was imagining it |
| 17:29.24 | Epyon | You've just entered the zone, where normal things don't happen... |
| 17:29.27 | Epyon | ... very often. |
| 17:29.44 | quine | Epyon |
| 17:29.48 | quine | you're turning into a penguin |
| 17:29.49 | quine | stop it |
| 17:30.15 | Epyon | Sorry, it's just my unnatural desire to eat fish. |
| 17:30.28 | brlcad | Epyon: what is your sf.net user id? |
| 17:30.37 | Epyon | Don't have one :P |
| 17:30.51 | brlcad | gah, seriously? |
| 17:30.53 | Epyon | Epyon's taken :/ |
| 17:31.03 | Epyon | Seriously - I never had the need. |
| 17:31.35 | brlcad | erm, you had the need about a month and a half ago |
| 17:31.52 | Epyon | Well it didn't come up until now, roght? |
| 17:31.54 | brlcad | http://my.bzflag.org/w/Google_Summer_of_Code_Acceptance#Pre-Flight_Checklist |
| 17:31.55 | Epyon | right? |
| 17:32.02 | quine | haha |
| 17:32.25 | Epyon | Duh, "Create a Sourceforge account" true, forgot :( |
| 17:32.35 | JeffM | you need one to be able to commit |
| 17:32.43 | brlcad | please create it |
| 17:32.46 | Epyon | kk |
| 17:32.47 | quine | i just hack away at the source occasionally just for fun :\ |
| 17:33.15 | Epyon | Although knowing me it'll take me ages to decide on an ID cause Epyon's taken ;( |
| 17:33.53 | brlcad | quine: you're baffled by why your own hardware is making noises at you.. i'm not surprised :) |
| 17:34.36 | quine | but no, this was a ridiculous anomaly |
| 17:34.45 | quine | my dvd drive randomly, out of nowhere, buzzed three notes at my face |
| 17:34.54 | quine | so i went to eat breakfast |
| 17:35.08 | Epyon | I'd have to turn down winamp to hear my hardware :/ |
| 17:35.31 | quine | i mean, it even buzzed them in rhythm |
| 17:35.39 | quine | it was just "BZZT BZZT BZZT" |
| 17:35.42 | quine | and then..silence |
| 17:36.06 | ts_laptop | I'm always hearing a "rrrRRRRrrrrRRRRrrrrrRRRRrrr" sound from my laptop fan when the fan is on.. |
| 17:36.27 | quine | ah, my fan would rev |
| 17:36.32 | Epyon | That's a good sign. Bethoven had one of those and look what he did with it xP |
| 17:36.36 | quine | (as in, hitting the sides) |
| 17:36.48 | ts_laptop | I think the fan is either completly broken or it needs oil ;) |
| 17:36.54 | quine | just replace it :] |
| 17:37.22 | Erroneous | ts_laptop: generally fans used in electronics are lubricant-free |
| 17:37.28 | Epyon | duh, now that's wierd. I DO have a sourceforge account o.O |
| 17:37.55 | ts_laptop | Erroneous: Oh, I didn't know that |
| 17:38.02 | Erroneous | Epyon: heh...created a month and a half ago? |
| 17:38.18 | Epyon | Nope, 2 or 3 years old o.O |
| 17:38.39 | Epyon | I wonder if I still remember the password... |
| 17:38.42 | quine | hahaha |
| 17:38.50 | quine | oh man, that happens to me all the time |
| 17:40.26 | brlcad | ooh, mr.ac |
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| 17:41.16 | Epyon | Kewl, I logged in :P |
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| 17:42.56 | Epyon | brlcad, the login's chaos-dev |
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| 18:19.48 | Suspect | [AMSG] Turning my PC off guys, we're due for storms and I have to leave .. I'd rather let my server keep it's uptime instead of only both PCs lasting 5 minutes :P (The server lasts 20 without my PC turned on) |
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| 18:50.00 | quine | yuck |
| 18:50.05 | quine | i don't remember my pointers |
| 18:50.25 | quine | what would char *data[number] do? :\ |
| 18:52.13 | Chestal | it would give you a syntax error ;-) |
| 18:53.02 | Chestal | if you add a semicolon, however, it defines a variable named 'data' which is an array containing number pointers to char |
| 18:53.25 | quine | haha |
| 18:53.32 | Chestal | probably used to point to C-style strings, so you could say it is an array of strings in that sense |
| 18:53.35 | quine | ok, good, that's what i hoped it did |
| 18:53.45 | quine | thanks :] |
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| 19:17.47 | L4m3r | sorry guys, I was sleeping. yes, I'm using libIRC and am in the process of adding IRC functionality to bzfs |
| 19:18.28 | L4m3r | I have to fix libIRC to work properly with the build system before I can commit anything. :P |
| 19:20.03 | donny_baker | sleep, isn't sleep an optional thing for GSoCers ;) |
| 19:20.33 | L4m3r | yes, but my "real" job lists sleep as a dependency. ;) |
| 19:21.40 | TheRedBaron | ~sleep |
| 19:21.50 | ibot | somebody said sleep was overrated, and a poor substitute for caffeine. |
| 19:22.18 | Epyon | me? xP |
| 19:22.24 | L4m3r | life < sleep |
| 19:22.27 | L4m3r | :D |
| 19:23.12 | Epyon | Sleep is a cop-out for people who can't handle caffeine. |
| 19:24.14 | L4m3r | caffeine works fine for coding |
| 19:24.27 | L4m3r | but when you're doing blue-collar work it just doesn't cut it :P |
| 19:25.26 | L4m3r | if I expect to make it though my workday AND stay awake to write some code afterward, sleep is necessary :P |
| 19:25.47 | L4m3r | Caffeine is fascinating from a biological standpoint, though |
| 19:26.25 | AWOSLappy | I have a small simple question. Do you bzflag devers know about SDL_SaveBMP()? I would think it would be a faster way to save screenshots then what you use now, if that isn't what you are using. |
| 19:26.59 | L4m3r | from the name I would guess that requires SDL |
| 19:27.09 | L4m3r | and not all clients use SDL :\ |
| 19:27.40 | AWOSLappy | L4m3r: what else would they use? SDL runs on all your platforms |
| 19:27.50 | AWOSLappy | Win32, Linux, Mac, IRIX, *BSD |
| 19:28.15 | L4m3r | yes, but sometimes it does not play nice |
| 19:28.32 | L4m3r | for a while 2.0.9 with SDL would give me the "no shots fired" bug and messed up sound |
| 19:28.48 | AWOSLappy | wow |
| 19:28.52 | L4m3r | granted using X is a PITA, but it did work, at least |
| 19:29.00 | AWOSLappy | X11!? |
| 19:29.40 | L4m3r | mmhm |
| 19:29.41 | scott | X12?! |
| 19:30.18 | L4m3r | ./configure --with-X or something |
| 19:31.03 | L4m3r | thankfully, it works now. :P |
| 19:31.16 | AWOSLappy | wait...if you're using X11... |
| 19:31.26 | AWOSLappy | that explains it! |
| 19:31.37 | AWOSLappy | that's the reason even without fglrx Linux gets better framerates than Windows! |
| 19:31.54 | L4m3r | LOL |
| 19:32.06 | donny_baker | ~Constitution++ |
| 19:32.23 | L4m3r | actually, no, the reason for that is simply that Windoze caps the framerate at the screen refresh rate, so if you have a half-decent box, linux will always work better |
| 19:33.05 | L4m3r | at least, in terms of the number. Obviously you're not going to see a higher framerate than your screen refresh rate. :P |
| 19:33.59 | AWOSLappy | lol |
| 19:34.04 | AWOSLappy | but windows caps at 20fps |
| 19:34.10 | AWOSLappy | and you can not tell me that I have 20Hz :P |
| 19:35.30 | L4m3r | lol |
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| 19:41.56 | donny_baker | ~Constitution++ |
| 19:42.05 | Constitution | :-) |
| 19:42.18 | Constitution | what did I do? |
| 19:48.32 | quine | blah. |
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| 19:50.49 | donny_baker | post for help instead of ideas |
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| 19:51.02 | Constitution | ah |
| 19:52.54 | TheRedBaron | AWOSLappy: hardware? |
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| 20:20.13 | JeffM | L4m3r, are you going to have anything for the midterm evals that have to be in this week? |
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| 20:30.36 | ts_laptop | donny_baker: Seems like spammers found the wiki :/ |
| 20:30.50 | blast007 | ts_laptop: they already had in the past |
| 20:30.55 | blast007 | we've banned quite a few |
| 20:31.23 | ts_laptop | blast007: Yes, but the frequency seems to raise |
| 20:32.14 | donny_baker | ts_laptop: not really, usually hit us for a day or two and then go away for a while |
| 20:33.01 | TylerM | do you have email confirmation turned on? |
| 20:33.20 | TylerM | I think it is not turned on, because I used it yesterday without being verified |
| 20:33.48 | donny_baker | it is wide open, don't need to be registered to edit |
| 20:34.07 | TylerM | ah, okay |
| 20:34.15 | TylerM | and I here I was registering out of habit ;) |
| 20:37.08 | ts_laptop | donny_baker: Are we going to use ImageMagick for PNG scaling? |
| 20:37.31 | donny_baker | yes, i just need to get into the config |
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| 20:49.53 | ts_laptop | DTRemenak: Heh, your user page at wiki still refers to CVS HEAD :) |
| 20:50.06 | JeffM | why? |
| 20:51.32 | ts_laptop | Someone™ most likely just forgot to update it |
| 20:52.52 | AWOSLappy | Hi guys. |
| 20:53.09 | AWOSLappy | SDL Game programming question thingy coming. |
| 20:53.09 | blast007 | hi AWOSLappy |
| 20:53.31 | AWOSLappy | hi blast007 :) |
| 20:54.13 | AWOSLappy | Okay I have this simple pong-type game. But the paddles dont move when I press the arrow keys. It seems that the key handler is being called, because pressing a junk key yields an "invalid key" message which it should. |
| 20:54.24 | AWOSLappy | And the arrow keys do not yield an invalid key message. |
| 20:54.42 | AWOSLappy | and JeffM you left before I could tell you I fixed it... #undef main :) |
| 20:54.53 | JeffM | AWOSLappy, ah cool |
| 20:54.54 | AWOSLappy | The code is here. http://rafb.net/p/IQd8zn32.html |
| 20:55.08 | JeffM | yeah I looked into it a bit more, seems the windows version of SDL includes a main |
| 20:55.10 | JeffM | when it shoudln't |
| 20:55.21 | JeffM | that should be part of the SDLMAin, and be a seperate thing |
| 20:55.33 | AWOSLappy | JeffM: right. so I kludged it :P |
| 20:55.34 | JeffM | I guess most people just use a winmain on windows so they don't hit that |
| 20:55.36 | JeffM | yeah |
| 20:55.47 | JeffM | I usualy do a #def and do main or winmain |
| 20:55.56 | AWOSLappy | So my question is, if the handler is being called and it is obviously doing something with the arrow keys, why don't the paddles move? |
| 20:56.27 | AWOSLappy | JeffM: Ahh...right...see this is multiplatform so WinMain doesn't work...but I suppose I could do a #define main WinMain |
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| 20:57.27 | JeffM | AWOSLappy, that's why You #def it |
| 20:57.32 | JeffM | only do a winmain on windows |
| 20:57.35 | JeffM | a main on others |
| 20:57.40 | JeffM | I can show you an example if you want |
| 20:57.45 | JeffM | it's not bad |
| 20:57.47 | AWOSLappy | then I have to do a parameter thingy too, though |
| 20:57.51 | JeffM | naw |
| 20:57.54 | AWOSLappy | and deal with HINSTANCEs |
| 20:57.57 | JeffM | windows predefines __WIN32 |
| 20:58.00 | JeffM | naw |
| 20:58.04 | JeffM | you ignore all that |
| 20:58.13 | JeffM | you don't have to do a winproc |
| 20:58.15 | JeffM | just a winmain |
| 20:58.18 | JeffM | it's cake |
| 20:58.22 | JeffM | I can show you if you want |
| 20:58.29 | AWOSLappy | Sure! |
| 21:01.21 | JeffM | just have to upload it |
| 21:01.57 | AWOSLappy | mmkay |
| 21:02.24 | JeffM | http://www.opencombat.net/code/crossmain.cpp |
| 21:02.43 | JeffM | you can do all the same SDL stuff in there and be fine |
| 21:03.03 | JeffM | since SDL will handle the winproc and all that for you |
| 21:03.12 | JeffM | and it can get the instance from the module |
| 21:03.43 | JeffM | the only other thing you'd need to handle is the command line |
| 21:04.00 | JeffM | parse the windows one into argc and argv |
| 21:04.17 | JeffM | if you do command line option, they are rare on windows |
| 21:04.53 | JeffM | I have a class that will handle ether way, as shown in that dashboard example and GPLib |
| 21:05.13 | AWOSLappy | Right. |
| 21:05.23 | JeffM | so it's not too bad to deal with |
| 21:05.31 | JeffM | then you don't get the console screen on windows |
| 21:05.37 | AWOSLappy | right |
| 21:05.45 | AWOSLappy | now, JeffM, any clues about the keyboard thing? |
| 21:05.53 | JeffM | what keyboard thing? |
| 21:06.07 | AWOSLappy | if the handler is being called and it is obviously doing something with the arrow keys, why don't the paddles move? |
| 21:06.21 | JeffM | oh I haven't looked at your code |
| 21:06.25 | JeffM | one sec |
| 21:06.33 | AWOSLappy | The code is here. http://rafb.net/p/IQd8zn32.html |
| 21:06.36 | AWOSLappy | okay |
| 21:08.32 | JeffM | such an odd way |
| 21:08.52 | JeffM | but off the top of my head I'd say it shoudl move it |
| 21:09.08 | JeffM | unless you get the down then the up before you draw |
| 21:09.17 | JeffM | cus your polling ALL events |
| 21:09.28 | JeffM | you could get a down and an up |
| 21:09.33 | AWOSLappy | it worked before I moved the handler to keyHandler() |
| 21:09.35 | JeffM | in the delay time |
| 21:09.43 | AWOSLappy | it was just one big switch() but I thought it was ugly |
| 21:09.49 | AWOSLappy | so I moved the key stuff to keyHandler() |
| 21:10.01 | JeffM | then slap a breakpoint in there and step thru, make sure it calls what you expect |
| 21:13.17 | AWOSLappy | it does seem that it's borked, JeffM |
| 21:13.45 | JeffM | that's what debugers are good for finding ;) |
| 21:13.55 | AWOSLappy | when I press the key down it does trigger both a DOWN and UP event |
| 21:14.43 | donny_baker | ts: imagemagic configured |
| 21:15.12 | AWOSLappy | donny_baker: imagemagick |
| 21:16.14 | JeffM | AWOSLappy, yeah that is a problem with that setup |
| 21:16.28 | JeffM | you may want a key poll instead of an event system |
| 21:16.33 | AWOSLappy | JeffM: so the function is taking too long to return? |
| 21:16.34 | JeffM | for the way your doing it |
| 21:16.41 | JeffM | basicly yeah your waiting too long |
| 21:16.47 | JeffM | and in that time you get more then one event |
| 21:16.53 | JeffM | best to do a key state poll each loop |
| 21:16.58 | JeffM | if it's down, move, if it's up don't |
| 21:17.16 | JeffM | events are better when you TRIGER something on the event |
| 21:17.20 | JeffM | not togle a state |
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| 21:18.06 | AWOSLappy | does SDL provide a key poll thing? |
| 21:18.21 | JeffM | yup |
| 21:18.30 | JeffM | SDL key state or something |
| 21:18.31 | JeffM | let me look |
| 21:18.48 | DarthShrine | SDL_GetKeyState? |
| 21:19.32 | JeffM | yeah probably |
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| 21:21.27 | AWOSLappy | "It will be valid for the whole lifetime of the application and should not be freed by the caller." |
| 21:21.44 | AWOSLappy | does that mean one call to GetKeyState will make the array valid until the app exits? |
| 21:22.13 | tupone | AWOSLappy, from what I know sdl use its own winmain, and you should define main as your main proc. If that is, you forgot to link an SDL provided obj/library called SDLmain |
| 21:22.40 | tupone | that was done for portability |
| 21:22.46 | AWOSLappy | tupone: the win32 linker said "hey idiot you don't have a main" |
| 21:22.55 | JeffM | AWOSLappy, he means you can use the SDLMain |
| 21:22.57 | AWOSLappy | Fedora didn't have a problem with it though |
| 21:23.05 | JeffM | instead of main or winmain |
| 21:23.10 | JeffM | I prefer not to, but it's an option |
| 21:23.11 | tupone | AWOSLappy, read it better |
| 21:23.15 | AWOSLappy | JeffM: oh |
| 21:23.27 | AWOSLappy | tupone: right...SDL #defines main as SDL_main |
| 21:23.42 | JeffM | the SDL_Main is there for cross plat compatability |
| 21:24.17 | JeffM | the windows binary of SDLMain.lib is not linked the way I like it, and it provides little advantage to me when I use the code I showed you, so I never use it |
| 21:24.22 | AWOSLappy | right |
| 21:24.25 | JeffM | but you should be aware that it is an option |
| 21:25.00 | AWOSLappy | I am aware it's an option...at least on Linux... |
| 21:25.00 | tupone | normally you don't have to clutter the code with #ifdef, SDL clutter it for you |
| 21:25.00 | JeffM | AWOSLappy, it's an option on windows |
| 21:25.03 | JeffM | you just replace main with SDL_Main |
| 21:25.06 | JeffM | and link in SDL_main.lib |
| 21:25.16 | AWOSLappy | oh |
| 21:25.22 | JeffM | that's the POINT opf it |
| 21:25.28 | JeffM | same main |
| 21:25.30 | JeffM | all OSs |
| 21:25.38 | JeffM | it's just not a standard OS main |
| 21:25.41 | JeffM | it's an SDL main |
| 21:25.54 | JeffM | and then SDL defines ether a main, or a winmain, or whatever is needed for the target platform |
| 21:26.02 | JeffM | then it calls your SDL_Main |
| 21:26.16 | tupone | I don't think main is redefined on linux |
| 21:26.26 | tupone | but I'm not sure |
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| 21:26.57 | JeffM | they probalby just #def SDL_Main to main |
| 21:27.03 | JeffM | inside the sdlmain |
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| 21:28.34 | tupone | Redefine main() on Win32 and MacOS so that it is called by winmain.c |
| 21:28.47 | tupone | that is a comment in SDL_main.h |
| 21:28.54 | JeffM | fun |
| 21:29.02 | tupone | it means that main is not touched on the other platform |
| 21:29.23 | AWOSLappy | so JeffM's example is fine |
| 21:29.46 | JeffM | they are all "fine" and will work |
| 21:29.55 | JeffM | it just depends on how "clean" you want your client code |
| 21:30.12 | JeffM | I've got my own applicaiton class I derive from, so my #def stuff is buried anyway |
| 21:31.13 | tupone | AWOSLappy, If I understand the modus operandi that SDL want to support, you should forget the winmain in windows or the equivalent in mac. Just use main as entry point, and link what is due by looking at the output of sdl-config --libs |
| 21:31.37 | JeffM | tupone, sdl on windows dosn't use sdl-config |
| 21:31.49 | JeffM | he just would need to add SDL_main.lib to his app IIRC |
| 21:31.52 | tupone | yeah, that is why I wrote "look" |
| 21:31.59 | AWOSLappy | Windows is evil. But Windows is the primary gaming platform of most gamers. So it must be supported. |
| 21:32.20 | JeffM | AWOSLappy, you don't get it, it IS suported by using SDL main |
| 21:32.20 | tupone | AWOSLappy, but "is" supported |
| 21:32.22 | JeffM | SDL does it for you |
| 21:32.36 | JeffM | by calling the nix stle main |
| 21:33.09 | tupone | it provide the argc, argv parameters to a unix style main |
| 21:33.11 | JeffM | I just don't personaly do that, it's my choice, but it is NOT the "SDL way" |
| 21:33.34 | JeffM | I don't do it due to some limitation in SDL |
| 21:33.56 | JeffM | I do it cus I perfer to link my app difrently then SDL |
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| 21:34.33 | JeffM | and I don't like the way sdl_main.lib links it's runtimes |
| 21:34.35 | tupone | AWOSLappy, you can do whatever you want. Just saying that this is not a bug on SDL |
| 21:34.43 | JeffM | or even a limit |
| 21:34.57 | AWOSLappy | Okay. |
| 21:35.36 | AWOSLappy | tbh, JeffM, I am kinda pedantic with what I link to, too |
| 21:35.59 | JeffM | do you even know what I mean by how it links? |
| 21:36.00 | AWOSLappy | right now I have: SDL.LIB and KERNEL32.LIB :P |
| 21:36.08 | JeffM | I don't do it for the number of libs |
| 21:36.12 | AWOSLappy | JeffM: I'm 90% sure I do |
| 21:36.15 | JeffM | but for HOW it links the libs |
| 21:36.17 | AWOSLappy | right |
| 21:36.20 | AWOSLappy | how it links |
| 21:36.32 | JeffM | I prefer my app to be multithreaded and link in the runtimes as DLLs |
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| 21:36.48 | JeffM | sdl_main is single threaded and static |
| 21:37.26 | JeffM | you could rebuild your SDL to be multi threaded and do dynamic runtimes |
| 21:37.34 | JeffM | and then use SDL main if you wanted. |
| 21:37.46 | tupone | hmm, do you mean SDL does not support multithread on windows, even if they provide the primitives for that? |
| 21:38.01 | JeffM | tupone, on windows it's linked as 2 bits |
| 21:38.04 | tupone | that is bug then |
| 21:38.09 | JeffM | no it's not like that |
| 21:38.15 | tupone | 2 bits? |
| 21:38.16 | JeffM | the SDL part, supports threads |
| 21:38.26 | JeffM | there are 2 libs, the dynamic SDL.dll |
| 21:38.34 | JeffM | it's threaded just fine |
| 21:38.56 | JeffM | and since it's a dynamic lib it's going to not have any runtime info |
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| 21:39.14 | JeffM | the sdl_main is a little static lib that was linked single thread, static |
| 21:39.38 | JeffM | and it's a pain to link single thread static libs into an app that is mutlithreaded with dynamic runtimes |
| 21:39.39 | tupone | but that is only to provide a main, that do the argc/argv and call SDL_Main |
| 21:39.59 | tupone | it is just an obj |
| 21:40.03 | JeffM | yeah but whenyou link a static lib, your app needs to match |
| 21:40.05 | JeffM | on windows |
| 21:40.13 | JeffM | there is no sdl_main.dll |
| 21:40.28 | JeffM | just the sdl_main.lib |
| 21:40.55 | JeffM | I think they did static runtime links so you can distribute your app with out the runtime DLLs |
| 21:41.04 | JeffM | for the basic apps that makes sense |
| 21:41.18 | tupone | can you link an obj called SDLmain.o and don't loose the capability you loose with SDL_main.lib |
| 21:41.27 | JeffM | if I had the obj, probably |
| 21:41.34 | JeffM | but I use the premade libs ;) |
| 21:41.39 | tupone | because the library is just an obj |
| 21:41.47 | tupone | that library |
| 21:41.48 | JeffM | I coudl also build the lib to be linked the way I want |
| 21:42.07 | JeffM | but since I bury it in my own application class, that does a lot more then SDL, I don't bother |
| 21:42.17 | JeffM | then I can just update the SDL bins from there bin package, and not reuibld |
| 21:42.21 | JeffM | a lot easier |
| 21:42.35 | JeffM | I'd love it if they changed there default build to multi threaded dynamic runtimes |
| 21:42.38 | JeffM | that'd be great |
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| 21:42.45 | JeffM | with VC8 I think that's all it does now |
| 21:42.48 | JeffM | no more static |
| 21:42.49 | tupone | hmm, there is something I happen to not get :/ |
| 21:42.56 | JeffM | yeah it is a windows only compile thing |
| 21:43.05 | JeffM | basicly there are 4 versions of the rumtimes :) |
| 21:43.31 | JeffM | or is it 8 verisons |
| 21:43.38 | JeffM | it's down to 2 now in the current VC |
| 21:43.47 | AWOSLappy | yeah |
| 21:43.50 | JeffM | so this is all moot cus I'm using an older compiler |
| 21:43.55 | AWOSLappy | msvcrt, msvcrtd at least |
| 21:43.58 | JeffM | yeah |
| 21:44.11 | AWOSLappy | well, I use 7.1 |
| 21:44.20 | tupone | and sdlmain is using the runtime directly? |
| 21:44.21 | AWOSLappy | it's not old, it's just one-gen behind |
| 21:44.36 | JeffM | tupone, SDL main links in the static libs for the runtimes |
| 21:44.42 | JeffM | AWOSLappy, that's just the packages |
| 21:44.48 | JeffM | SDL main isn't a dll |
| 21:45.19 | JeffM | it's a static lib that was linkked staticly with it's own copy of the VC runtimes. |
| 21:45.50 | JeffM | so you can get double defs of libs |
| 21:45.57 | JeffM | its just cus that part of windows dev was stupid |
| 21:46.15 | tupone | are you sure? I got was only an obj included in a library without any other linked obj. But I'm surely wrong |
| 21:46.32 | JeffM | on nix, I'm sure you got an obj |
| 21:46.50 | tupone | onunix probably I don't have |
| 21:46.58 | JeffM | yeah cus it dosn't do anything |
| 21:47.03 | JeffM | I have sdl_main.lib |
| 21:47.25 | JeffM | sorry SDLMain.lib |
| 21:47.30 | tupone | I can't build sdl_main.lib to see what is in :/ |
| 21:47.49 | JeffM | I just never use it, cus it dosnt' do anythign I need or care about :) |
| 21:48.01 | JeffM | GraphicalApplicaton does all my work ;) |
| 21:48.08 | tupone | But probably we should say SDL guys to not build it and use SDLMain.o |
| 21:48.10 | JeffM | or GUIGraphicalApplicaiton |
| 21:48.21 | JeffM | tupone, with VC8 it dosn't matter |
| 21:48.54 | JeffM | they had to pick a build system to go with, they picked one. |
| 21:49.06 | JeffM | no mater what the code gen would be wrong for somone |
| 21:49.12 | JeffM | they picked the common one |
| 21:49.35 | JeffM | it's just part of how windows works, we are used to it :) |
| 21:49.38 | tupone | I'm sure lot of people use SDL for windows |
| 21:49.53 | AWOSLappy | ya know I always find it interesting how easy it is to digress on IRC :P |
| 21:49.54 | JeffM | yeah and I'm sure there link method works fine for most of those people |
| 21:49.58 | tupone | and mostly will do the SDL way |
| 21:50.06 | JeffM | I'm doing a DIFERENT link then the sdl samples do |
| 21:50.11 | JeffM | becuase I use other libs |
| 21:50.33 | JeffM | if you do everything SDL, using like SDL sound, and SDL net, etc.. it'll work fine out of the box |
| 21:50.46 | JeffM | and that is what they are set up for |
| 21:50.54 | JeffM | I'm only using SDL for window setup and input |
| 21:50.55 | tupone | I give up :/ Not my platform |
| 21:51.16 | JeffM | also , I haven't updated in a while, so they may have changed there defualt builds |
| 21:51.38 | JeffM | since VC consolodated all those options |
| 21:52.24 | AWOSLappy | JeffM: SDL has network!? |
| 21:52.32 | tupone | SDL_net |
| 21:52.35 | JeffM | SDL_net does |
| 21:52.36 | AWOSLappy | wows |
| 21:52.40 | tupone | but is not as good as you imagine |
| 21:52.41 | JeffM | net and sound are seperate libs |
| 21:52.46 | JeffM | sdl sound is ok |
| 21:52.51 | AWOSLappy | I wrote my own multiplatform socket encapsulation class in C++... |
| 21:52.53 | JeffM | sdl net is a decent sockets wraper |
| 21:53.00 | tupone | just an interface to socket |
| 21:53.02 | tupone | yeah |
| 21:53.05 | JeffM | it's not horible |
| 21:53.12 | JeffM | dosn't do anything fancy, but it's clean and functional |
| 21:53.35 | JeffM | I personaly use raknet and fmod for net and sound respectivly |
| 21:53.37 | AWOSLappy | I've also "extended" the class to do HTTP and FTP protocols |
| 21:53.51 | JeffM | AWOSLappy, there is a little thing called "libCurl" that can do that ;) |
| 21:54.06 | JeffM | GPLib has a URL manager |
| 21:54.13 | JeffM | handle it all up for ya |
| 21:54.40 | JeffM | it's a rework of what tupone started for bzflag |
| 21:54.42 | tupone | yeah, raknet is good, just not compatible with LGPL |
| 21:55.14 | JeffM | I'm less of a license sickler ;) |
| 21:55.41 | JeffM | tho IIRC I'm using an older raknet, that I think is lgpl |
| 21:55.46 | JeffM | and I moded the heck out of it |
| 21:55.51 | JeffM | or maybe it's not |
| 21:55.56 | JeffM | I don't recall |
| 21:56.48 | JeffM | ahh it's full GPL |
| 21:57.57 | JeffM | tho some files mention another license |
| 21:58.58 | tupone | yeah, it is GPL |
| 21:59.25 | tupone | or you can "buy" some right |
| 21:59.30 | JeffM | yeah |
| 21:59.42 | JeffM | you can buy a closed source license |
| 22:00.04 | JeffM | I always release source so... |
| 22:01.12 | tupone | well, just saying that we cannot include in bzflag with our licensing scheme |
| 22:01.29 | JeffM | you can't link GPL into LGPL? |
| 22:01.39 | tupone | and the result is GPL |
| 22:01.43 | JeffM | ahh |
| 22:01.57 | JeffM | even if it's dynamic? |
| 22:02.23 | tupone | well, if it's dynamic ... good question. Depends on the wording they use |
| 22:02.28 | TimRiker | looks like the old one was available under GPL, but the current is not. http://web.archive.org/web/20050125213120/http://rakkarsoft.com/ |
| 22:02.30 | JeffM | and you have full source for your use of it |
| 22:02.56 | TimRiker | dynamic linking to gpl, still requires that the rest be gpl. |
| 22:03.01 | JeffM | ahh |
| 22:03.18 | Constitution | I seem to be getting a link error when building on OS X, "undefined symbols: _glXGetCurrentContext"... does that mean it can't find the OpenGL, X11, or am I just really confused? |
| 22:03.30 | Constitution | *those libraries |
| 22:03.32 | JeffM | and if your not, there is just a possiblity that somone who uses your code, can get sued by the GPL license holder? |
| 22:04.28 | TimRiker | well, as we are lgpl (and some bsdish things) we are compatible with the gpl. so we could use it, but we'd be under the gpl and not the lgpl when linked with raknet. |
| 22:04.46 | tupone | e.g. libSDL is GPL, but they say (don't remember where) that you can link dynamically their library, without any constraint |
| 22:04.50 | JeffM | so what would that "mean" in real terms? |
| 22:05.22 | JeffM | wouild it change how anyone could use the code? |
| 22:05.23 | tupone | JeffM, nobody can use bzflag library in a closed source (read console) game |
| 22:05.40 | TimRiker | tupone: yeah? http://www.libsdl.org/license.php claims lgpl. |
| 22:05.49 | JeffM | tupone, ahh for that I personaly don't care then, I wante everyone to release source :) |
| 22:06.09 | tupone | TimRiker, I was wrong then. :) |
| 22:06.20 | TimRiker | heh. happens to the best of us. |
| 22:06.21 | JeffM | wonder if raknets new license is lgpl compatable |
| 22:06.42 | TimRiker | JeffM: not from what I see. |
| 22:06.46 | JeffM | ahh |
| 22:06.55 | JeffM | it's creative commons |
| 22:07.10 | tupone | SDL-1.3 ? hmmm |
| 22:07.25 | TimRiker | it's creative-commons non-commercial. that's the hitch. |
| 22:07.43 | TimRiker | the non-commercial clause and the lgpl don't get along. |
| 22:07.46 | JeffM | ahh lgpl can be done comerical |
| 22:07.54 | JeffM | is there a non comerical LGPL? |
| 22:07.58 | TimRiker | no |
| 22:08.18 | JeffM | can somone make one :) |
| 22:08.48 | TimRiker | sure, you can make the you-must-buy-my-dog-to-use-this license if you like. |
| 22:08.54 | JeffM | well that point may as well just license your own stuff under the same CC lincese |
| 22:09.51 | JeffM | you honestly think you could sell bzflag? |
| 22:09.56 | TimRiker | cause that console release is always just around the corner, right? :/ |
| 22:09.59 | JeffM | IIRC that was tried once, didn't fly |
| 22:10.04 | JeffM | yeah.... |
| 22:10.26 | JeffM | for a conosle you'd be better off making a new project |
| 22:11.03 | JeffM | cus to be brutaly honest, no first party would give you license. the only hopewould be XNA |
| 22:11.19 | JeffM | and be a live arcade title |
| 22:11.27 | JeffM | but I don't think you want to redo it in directX ;) |
| 22:11.39 | TimRiker | patches welcome. :) |
| 22:11.42 | JeffM | hence why it'd be best to just implement it in another engine like torque |
| 22:12.00 | JeffM | bzflag would be cake in torque |
| 22:12.49 | JeffM | you could open source the script and resources of it |
| 22:12.59 | JeffM | that'd be the real "game" part |
| 22:13.16 | TimRiker | there are other net libraries that would work. I don't see the need to change the license. |
| 22:13.34 | JeffM | I don't think anyonew was sugesting it for bzflag |
| 22:13.52 | JeffM | were were just discussing SDL and I mentioned that I dont' use SDLNet, I use raknet for my stuff |
| 22:14.06 | TimRiker | well, have to reboot into that other OS now to update my n800. the flashing app is broken on newer linux kernels. :( |
| 22:14.14 | JeffM | tho I could probalby port my wraper to anything |
| 22:14.24 | JeffM | ahh you got an n800 |
| 22:16.12 | brlcad | hm, that'd be an interesting branch.. trying brl-cad's libpkg on bz, very simple command-callback api like bz would need |
| 22:16.32 | JeffM | to do what? |
| 22:17.06 | brlcad | nothing really, other than test out performance and maybe gain some robustness |
| 22:17.33 | JeffM | I mean what would the commands and the API do? |
| 22:17.41 | JeffM | client stuff? server stuff? input stuff? |
| 22:17.53 | brlcad | simple tcp/udp encapsulation of "packages" client/server protocol stufff |
| 22:18.00 | JeffM | ahh networking |
| 22:18.05 | brlcad | ah, yeah, sry |
| 22:18.07 | JeffM | that was the part you didn't say ;) |
| 22:18.17 | brlcad | yeah, stupid name |
| 22:18.20 | brlcad | network packages |
| 22:18.30 | JeffM | ahh |
| 22:18.43 | JeffM | like the connection and packet managers of GPX |
| 22:18.55 | JeffM | tho it dos't know the protocll |
| 22:19.06 | JeffM | it just makes sure you don't blow over buffers and stuff |
| 22:19.26 | brlcad | basically wraps up "objects" that you send across the wire, they have a simple type/id and their encapsulated content |
| 22:19.29 | JeffM | raknet has a nice network synced class thingy, and a RPC deal |
| 22:19.48 | tupone | we can use CORBA for communications |
| 22:19.57 | brlcad | you then define whatever protocol using those packages, if you want it to be ping-pongish or streaming, or whatever |
| 22:19.58 | JeffM | what's that? |
| 22:19.58 | AWOSLappy | ah-ha! thingy! it IS a technical term! |
| 22:20.36 | AWOSLappy | CORBA...I don't remember exactly what it is but I remember it is *bad* evil |
| 22:21.10 | tupone | CORBA is an OMG standard . OMG stand for "Oh My God ... is huge" |
| 22:21.35 | AWOSLappy | TheRedBaron: RADEON 7000 / IGP 340m |
| 22:22.34 | AWOSLappy | so it's a OMGIH standard? |
| 22:23.22 | tupone | Object Management Group |
| 22:23.57 | Chestal | heh, Corba isn't that bad, only the C++ binding smells a bit funny. |
| 22:26.35 | tupone | but is huge, maybe a http://www.zeroc.com/ is more light, but still not applicable to bzflag IMHO |
| 22:26.54 | brlcad | corba is pretty bad, overkillish for most purposes |
| 22:26.57 | Chestal | ICE is nice, I played with it around a little some years ago |
| 22:28.21 | Chestal | in comparison with fully fledged web service stuff, basic corba is tiny now |
| 22:28.26 | brlcad | HLA is another bastardized-CORBAish standard that should be heavily avoided :) |
| 22:28.28 | Chestal | (and fast, too :-) |
| 22:28.57 | Chestal | but I am not really a fan of CORBA; it's just that most alternatives are way worse |
| 22:29.15 | tupone | brlcad, is DIS better ? |
| 22:29.43 | brlcad | dis? |
| 22:30.06 | brlcad | ooh, dis.. |
| 22:30.10 | tupone | :) |
| 22:30.12 | brlcad | hla replaced dis like a decade ago |
| 22:30.22 | tupone | yep, but not yet |
| 22:30.34 | tupone | most hla are gateway of dis |
| 22:31.00 | brlcad | because getting governments/contractors/businesses to change the way they interact is painful |
| 22:31.04 | brlcad | and expensive :) |
| 22:32.04 | tupone | is not so bad getting a DIS interface to bzflag |
| 22:37.09 | brlcad | wow, we have 79 open patches |
| 22:37.31 | brlcad | that's like a full release or two worth of changes |
| 22:37.47 | JeffM | assuming they are all acceptable patches |
| 22:38.09 | brlcad | true, i'm sure about a 1/3rd outright aren't acceptible at all |
| 22:38.22 | brlcad | some would work, but need to be rewritten |
| 22:38.47 | brlcad | i've started on a few from time to time (of the harder ones) |
| 22:39.31 | brlcad | got 2/3rds done with one of the oldest, but didn't finish .. stupid rendering bugs |
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| 23:01.57 | jude- | hello all |
| 23:02.20 | Winny | hey jude- |
| 23:02.25 | L4m3r | ~heyjude |
| 23:02.25 | ibot | Hey, Jude-, go ahead and make it bad. |
| 23:03.42 | AWOSLappy | haha |
| 23:03.45 | AWOSLappy | that never gets old |
| 23:04.06 | L4m3r | ooh, jude-, another random idea you've probably thought of already |
| 23:04.23 | L4m3r | add a texture browser for images.bzflag.org ;) |
| 23:04.32 | jude- | we'll see |
| 23:05.00 | L4m3r | just a thought, not even really a request |
| 23:05.32 | jude- | I'm more concerned about getting the editor working first :) |
| 23:05.37 | L4m3r | true :) |
| 23:08.41 | CBG | editor? working? whatcha wanna do that for |
| 23:08.42 | CBG | ! |
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| 23:13.42 | Epyon | A kingdom for a ingame BZF ruler -_- |
| 23:14.28 | brlcad | Epyon: you now have commit access, so don't be shy |
| 23:14.34 | brlcad | commit early, commit often |
| 23:14.39 | JeffM | IIRC you can show current tank cords |
| 23:14.48 | Epyon | JeffM, how? |
| 23:14.50 | brlcad | as to where and how, that can still be discussed, but don't let it hold you up |
| 23:14.51 | Epyon | That would help. |
| 23:14.56 | JeffM | a debug option IIRC |
| 23:15.11 | JeffM | check the hud renedere |
| 23:15.16 | JeffM | if not add one, should be cake |
| 23:15.17 | brlcad | and of course, refresh up on DEVINFO and try not to break stuff |
| 23:15.18 | Epyon | brlcad, I want something semi-playable for the first commit., |
| 23:15.26 | JeffM | Epyon, why? |
| 23:15.30 | brlcad | Epyon: fight that |
| 23:15.34 | JeffM | yeah that's bad |
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| 23:15.42 | JeffM | it's not show and tell, it's colaboration |
| 23:16.11 | brlcad | we need to see activity and the code as it develops, interact on the development .. the bigger that delay, the more chance for surprises |
| 23:16.11 | JeffM | commits don't cost money |
| 23:16.19 | JeffM | it's a dev branch... |
| 23:16.21 | JeffM | so who cares |
| 23:16.25 | Epyon | Also I need to add all those headers and footers :P (is there a "guide" for that, or should I just grab the nearest bzf source file as a reference :P) |
| 23:16.26 | brlcad | if you think it'll mostly break stuff, then work on a branch |
| 23:16.28 | JeffM | hell commit at the end of every day |
| 23:16.53 | Epyon | brlcad, I couldn't break anything because I work on a standalone :P |
| 23:17.02 | brlcad | Epyon: existing sources are generally the best starting point just so you're consistent though there's _always_ room for improvement (and some aren't so hot) |
| 23:17.04 | JeffM | then there is no reason to commit as you do stuff |
| 23:17.12 | JeffM | at the very least, that gives you SVN as a backup |
| 23:17.35 | brlcad | s/to commit/to NOT commit/ as you do stuff |
| 23:17.48 | brlcad | you can rarely commit too frequently |
| 23:18.00 | JeffM | maybe every line would be too much ;) |
| 23:18.04 | Epyon | I know, I know all the reasons :P |
| 23:18.12 | JeffM | then do it |
| 23:18.15 | brlcad | i probably push that limit more than most.. and even then it's rarely ever a problem |
| 23:18.30 | brlcad | it's more a problem (by far) to be infrequent and/or too big |
| 23:18.36 | brlcad | the bigger the commit, the harder to review |
| 23:19.06 | JeffM | the more commits you do the higher you go in the CIA list too :) |
| 23:19.11 | brlcad | 30 100 line commits is far easier than 1 3000 line commit imho |
| 23:19.17 | Epyon | For example recently I had to throw out a huge chunk of code, just because it prooved unbearable :/ |
| 23:19.43 | brlcad | that's what I want to see, that shows the reasoning, the development progress |
| 23:19.52 | Epyon | Unfortunately this one was due to my bad memory of C++ -_- |
| 23:20.00 | brlcad | so I don't have to ask a week later, wtf did you remove a huge chunk of code |
| 23:20.15 | brlcad | even if you added and removed it a dozen times while testing |
| 23:21.56 | brlcad | Epyon: I really would expect every one of the GSoCers in particular to at least commit once per day while you're working if not even more frequently than that -- consider it a development constraint |
| 23:23.21 | Epyon | Okay, I promise to commit often ... AFTER the first commit, okay? :) |
| 23:23.32 | Epyon | And you can hold me on my word |
| 23:23.33 | Erroneous | the code ypu drop in svn doesn't have to be perfect, we know it's a work in progress |
| 23:23.38 | JeffM | Epyon, why not commit now? |
| 23:23.42 | JeffM | just do it |
| 23:24.01 | brlcad | jude-: hehe |
| 23:24.05 | Epyon | NEVER commit non-working code xP (one of the laws of commiting code xP) |
| 23:24.07 | brlcad | you should, your commits are massive :) |
| 23:24.11 | Erroneous | Epyon: pffft |
| 23:24.12 | jude- | lol |
| 23:24.13 | Epyon | Okay, I made that up :P |
| 23:24.27 | jude- | I have the same problem as Epyon: I don't like to commit incomplete/buggy features :P |
| 23:24.35 | JeffM | that is only realy a rule for stable release fixes for us |
| 23:24.43 | Erroneous | in general you should try not to commit code that doesn't compile...but broken is fine in trunk |
| 23:24.44 | JeffM | your dev, AND a seperate project, commit |
| 23:24.47 | JeffM | commit all the time |
| 23:25.00 | brlcad | Epyon: that's the policy for some projects, but not so much for bz -- at least not to such an extreme -- and if you know outright that it'll be a while before it'll function, then just make a branch |
| 23:25.03 | Epyon | Actually ATM it doesn't compile :/ |
| 23:25.04 | brlcad | branches in svn really are simple |
| 23:25.19 | JeffM | Epyon, so what? it's dev |
| 23:25.23 | Epyon | I've made a big refactor in the coordinate system, and I'm cleaning it up. |
| 23:25.34 | brlcad | ts will be sure to tell you where the compile fails |
| 23:25.40 | JeffM | indeed |
| 23:26.46 | Epyon | Also, I'd like to finalize the file structure before commiting. |
| 23:26.53 | brlcad | seriously, committing code isn't about finalizing |
| 23:27.09 | brlcad | it's always a work in progress |
| 23:28.34 | brlcad | that's one of the characteristics of collaborative open source development (that survives) .. pretty extensive exposure to your development practices, refactorings, redesigns, etc |
| 23:28.35 | purple_cow | what do you mean "separate header files in C++" ? |
| 23:28.55 | brlcad | i think he means one header per class |
| 23:29.02 | Epyon | purple_cow, the separate .h and .cxx files |
| 23:29.10 | brlcad | ahh |
| 23:29.12 | purple_cow | as opposed to what?Z |
| 23:29.19 | Epyon | Opposed to Pascal ;] |
| 23:29.20 | purple_cow | keeping your entire program in one file? |
| 23:29.25 | JeffM | 42 meg source files |
| 23:29.42 | brlcad | he would have loved it four years ago when bzfs was one 50k line file |
| 23:29.44 | bryjen | s/files/file/ |
| 23:29.56 | Epyon | nah, as opposed to single file with header included per unit. |
| 23:30.11 | purple_cow | having a separation between definition and implementation is one of the reasons why you can incrementally build a program |
| 23:30.45 | Epyon | purple_cow, um, do you KNOW how pascal units are structured? |
| 23:31.34 | Epyon | Anyway, most people agree that c++'s build system is broken (compared to pascal for example), but nothing can be about that because of backwards compatibility |
| 23:31.48 | purple_cow | C++'s build system? |
| 23:31.52 | purple_cow | what the heck are you talking about? |
| 23:32.05 | Epyon | hmm, I don't know wheter I use the word "build" correctly. |
| 23:32.11 | Epyon | Makefiles, headers etc. |
| 23:32.17 | JBdiGriz | Is that the canonical "most people"? |
| 23:32.18 | JeffM | those are seperate things |
| 23:32.31 | JeffM | makefiles are part of gcc |
| 23:32.36 | JeffM | well part of make |
| 23:32.42 | JeffM | commonly used by gcc |
| 23:32.49 | JeffM | headers are part of C |
| 23:33.15 | JBdiGriz | JeffM: Are you feeling okay, make is used by gcc? |
| 23:33.33 | Epyon | the big difference that usualy you can compile a pascal program by typing "fpc main.pas", without the need of .h files, nor makefiles. |
| 23:33.37 | brlcad | JBdiGriz: you find a place for Friday? :) |
| 23:34.06 | brlcad | Epyon: you can do that with C/C++ programs too if you structure them that way, but it's just generally very limited to toy apps |
| 23:34.27 | JBdiGriz | brlcad: There is a wonderful place, but it's pretty far outside of town. |
| 23:35.09 | brlcad | I should have a car friday so I don't much care where it is |
| 23:35.55 | brlcad | something northwards might save those coming from up coast a few minutes |
| 23:36.18 | JBdiGriz | It's definitely towards the north, but also a ways east. |
| 23:36.24 | brlcad | what was the name of that shack we went to last time? |
| 23:36.30 | brlcad | crabby dicks? |
| 23:36.43 | JeffM | JBdiGriz, sorry "with" :) |
| 23:36.46 | JeffM | that's a better term |
| 23:37.02 | JBdiGriz | http://www.stoneworldbistro.com/ |
| 23:37.04 | JeffM | make actualy calls gcc I know that |
| 23:37.39 | JBdiGriz | JeffM: I know you know that. That's why I was wondering if you were feeling okay. |
| 23:37.43 | AWOSLappy | JeffM: just wondering if you've heard of / use a program called Gobby? |
| 23:37.48 | JeffM | Epyon, I know the pain your going thru, I had some troubles "geting" it when I swaped from pascall to C, but trust me it's LOT Better |
| 23:38.01 | JeffM | AWOSLappy, nope |
| 23:40.28 | JeffM | what does it do? |
| 23:40.48 | brlcad | Epyon: back to the original topic.. please, please commit .. today .. early tomorrow at the *very* latest -- doesn't matter how much or what the quality/status of the code is, more just getting the ball rolling |
| 23:41.14 | brlcad | if you need a branch created for you, just say the word and any one of us can make one for you if you're not familiar with how to do that with svn |
| 23:41.50 | brlcad | same goes for L4m3r ... :-) |
| 23:41.53 | JeffM | it would suck to have people get booted from the GSoC just cus they fear the commit and want clean code |
| 23:42.19 | Epyon | Actually I'd appriciate tommorow a tip with svn, especialy where to put the files. |
| 23:42.38 | Erroneous | if it's eventually going to be a plugin, it should go in plugins (even if it's not yet) |
| 23:42.43 | JeffM | are they part of the bzflag source tree now? |
| 23:42.48 | JeffM | on your local machine? |
| 23:43.10 | Erroneous | if you're going to leave it standalone, it should go in its own module |
| 23:43.13 | Epyon | Nope |
| 23:43.14 | brlcad | if it's eventually going to be part of the server, it probably should go in src/bzfs or src/game |
| 23:43.30 | Epyon | so many options o.O |
| 23:43.37 | JeffM | make it standalone |
| 23:43.40 | JeffM | we can move it later |
| 23:43.43 | JBdiGriz | brlcad: Are you thinking of Dick's Last Resort? |
| 23:43.44 | brlcad | if it's entirely standalone, it can go in its own dir (though I wouldn't be so keen to standalone for your particular task goal) |
| 23:43.49 | brlcad | JBdiGriz: ah, that's it |
| 23:43.51 | Epyon | JeffM, that was my initial idea |
| 23:43.58 | JeffM | then just do it |
| 23:44.02 | JeffM | moving stuff in svn in easy |
| 23:44.05 | Erroneous | we can always move it, that's one of the nice things about svn |
| 23:44.07 | JeffM | just get SOMETHING in there |
| 23:44.12 | brlcad | yeah |
| 23:44.23 | Epyon | k' I'll do it tommorow |
| 23:44.27 | JeffM | I stress on the "it would suck for people to get booted" cus that may happen |
| 23:44.31 | JBdiGriz | brlcad: For something like that, we could just meet downtown and wander around the gaslamp district. |
| 23:45.00 | JeffM | JBdiGriz / brlcad what time of day are we lookin at doin this? |
| 23:45.32 | JBdiGriz | I believe you have the longest to drive. What would fit your schedule? |
| 23:45.38 | JeffM | what day is it? |
| 23:45.42 | JeffM | a friday? |
| 23:45.44 | JeffM | or a weekend day? |
| 23:46.15 | Erroneous | JeffM: Epyon is already quite aware that I'll need to fill out the midterm eval stuff soon, and that I need to be able to actually see some code first :) |
| 23:46.28 | JBdiGriz | Friday, August 10. |
| 23:46.49 | JeffM | Erroneous, were you thinking of ditching work early? |
| 23:46.51 | JeffM | on that day? |
| 23:47.14 | Erroneous | hadn't thought it through yet |
| 23:47.21 | Erroneous | sounds pretty likely though |
| 23:47.28 | JeffM | yeah, or traffic will suck |
| 23:47.42 | JeffM | so my choices are, rid the bike down there, just to see if I can. |
| 23:48.03 | JeffM | drive the truck with danny boy here, cus his car kinda scares me :) |
| 23:48.14 | JeffM | or see if there is any sort of train |
| 23:48.14 | Erroneous | my car is fine :) |
| 23:48.20 | JBdiGriz | I would have thought you would be carpooling with Erroneous/SportChick |
| 23:48.24 | JeffM | I'm sure it is, but it scares me still :) |
| 23:48.26 | Erroneous | not the same car, remember :) |
| 23:48.28 | JeffM | ahh yeah sportchick |
| 23:48.40 | JeffM | Erroneous, not the same car as like last week? |
| 23:48.43 | JBdiGriz | The train will drop you off in the middle of downtown. |
| 23:48.46 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14496 10/branches/ftgl/README: see, it's trivial.. commit early, commit often. (change documents the external deps) |
| 23:48.56 | JBdiGriz | Getting back afterwards might be an issue. |
| 23:49.07 | Erroneous | JeffM: same as last week, not the same one I've had problems with |
| 23:49.09 | JeffM | well we should check with sporty then, maybe we could meet them and drive down |
| 23:49.18 | JeffM | Erroneous, it still scares me :) |
| 23:49.19 | Erroneous | just drove this one 900 miles a week and a half ago or so |
| 23:49.24 | brlcad | bike as in motorcycle or road bike? |
| 23:49.30 | JeffM | motorcyle |
| 23:49.33 | JBdiGriz | We can arrange some floorspace for people who aren't able to make it back that evening. |
| 23:49.36 | brlcad | ah, whew |
| 23:49.44 | JeffM | I'd like to get up to being able to ride to AZ on the moto |
| 23:49.55 | JeffM | so SD would be a decent test |
| 23:50.13 | JeffM | Erroneous, it reminds me of my first car ;) |
| 23:50.24 | JeffM | more of an emiotional scar thing |
| 23:50.34 | brlcad | heh |
| 23:50.37 | Erroneous | ahhh |
| 23:50.48 | JeffM | also for some reason I hate riding in cars, I need to be driving |
| 23:51.11 | JeffM | wonder what time the train comes back |
| 23:51.17 | JeffM | cus that coudl be fun |
| 23:51.38 | jude- | O.o |
| 23:51.40 | JeffM | heh |
| 23:51.46 | JeffM | it still stable? |
| 23:52.14 | Erroneous | seems to be |
| 23:52.48 | Erroneous | unless you let the installer upgrade the hard disk drivers |
| 23:52.50 | Erroneous | then it crashes |
| 23:53.03 | jude- | .....processes.....in.....single.....address.....space...... |
| 23:53.28 | JeffM | jude-, its for a specific app we need that only runs in classic |
| 23:54.06 | blast007 | brlcad: is this change to bzfs_LDFLAGS an error? http://bzflag.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/bzflag/branches/v2_0branch/bzflag/src/bzfs/Makefile.am?r1=12643&r2=14424 |
| 23:54.10 | JeffM | hmm latest train outa there is 6PM |
| 23:54.14 | blast007 | it breaks plugin support |
| 23:54.15 | JeffM | that won't do |
| 23:54.47 | blast007 | I'm not sure if there was a specific reason behind the change |
| 23:55.24 | brlcad | blast007: doubt it was intentional |
| 23:55.33 | blast007 | k |
| 23:55.34 | brlcad | just not watching the branch closely |
| 23:56.02 | blast007 | I'll commit it back to -export-dynamic |
| 23:56.10 | brlcad | should probably be both |
| 23:56.16 | blast007 | ah |
| 23:56.19 | blast007 | didn't try that |
| 23:56.29 | brlcad | yeah, that's what's on head |
| 23:56.49 | blast007 | ok |
| 23:56.52 | blast007 | I'll give it a shot |
| 23:57.40 | brlcad | gah, jude- what's your sf id? |
| 23:57.45 | jude- | judecn |
| 23:57.55 | brlcad | ah, hrmph .. must not be added |
| 23:58.25 | jude- | don't I already have commit access? |
| 23:58.35 | brlcad | yes you do |
| 23:58.47 | brlcad | i'm going through some of the trackers |
| 23:58.53 | jude- | ahhh |
| 23:59.12 | brlcad | i couldn't assign you a tracker that was relevant to you |
| 23:59.21 | jude- | oh |