| 00:03.50 | *** join/#bzflag trovao (n=trovao@201.78.240.251) |
| 00:05.56 | battousai1373 | Hello. It's me again. I just submitted my proposal (in the nick of time!), but I forgot to mention the screen name I've been using here to talk to the mentors. If anyone cares, the name on my proposal is Theodore Robert Rivera (oh noes!!! I just gave out my name on teh intarweb!). |
| 00:06.31 | poolio | Hey! My name is Theodore Robert Rivera and I also submitted a proposal for GSoC! |
| 00:06.46 | trovao | :) |
| 00:06.59 | battousai1373 | lmao |
| 00:07.18 | inchworm | won't be laughing when the bill comes... |
| 00:07.20 | inchworm | ;) |
| 00:07.23 | poolio | stevens institue of tech? |
| 00:07.23 | battousai1373 | ...I mean...that's an alias...<.<...>.> |
| 00:07.53 | battousai1373 | yeah, for a little while. |
| 00:08.43 | poolio | I just got waitlisted, tear =( |
| 00:08.59 | battousai1373 | They said they offered game design as a degree of study...They lied. |
| 00:09.34 | poolio | Hah, sorry. |
| 00:11.39 | battousai1373 | eh, not your fault. I don't regret it (except for tuition...ouch). |
| 00:11.56 | iFeghali | trovao: im ready for battle |
| 00:14.29 | *** join/#bzflag Sir_Pants (n=Sir_Pant@67-42-80-2.tukw.qwest.net) |
| 00:21.07 | brlcad | SportChick: deadline was extended yet again |
| 00:21.21 | SportChick | really?! |
| 00:21.30 | SportChick | now when, brlcad? |
| 00:21.38 | brlcad | they have another 15 hours |
| 00:21.43 | SportChick | wow |
| 00:21.56 | inchworm | is there such a thing as a hard deadline? |
| 00:26.22 | battousai1373 | Well, I suppose I could flesh out my personal info some more. Maybe I'll include my social security number, credit card numbers w/ pins, bank account information, etc., just to save people like poolio the trouble. |
| 00:26.45 | battousai1373 | inchworm*... sorry |
| 00:26.52 | inchworm | hehe |
| 00:27.01 | inchworm | i thought i was going to get away with that one too |
| 00:27.29 | battousai1373 | sorry to disappoint |
| 00:27.38 | inchworm | you should be |
| 00:27.49 | battousai1373 | I hope you won't be too spiteful. |
| 00:27.50 | inchworm | harumph! |
| 00:27.57 | inchworm | ;) |
| 00:27.58 | battousai1373 | my poor wallet... |
| 00:28.02 | trovao | iFeghali: where are you? |
| 00:29.17 | battousai1373 | hmm...I guess I didn't have to skip two classes to get that in on time, huh? |
| 00:30.59 | *** join/#bzflag a_meteorite (n=a_meteor@unaffiliated/ameteorite/x-000000001) |
| 00:31.10 | battousai1373 | oh well...not much I can do now... |
| 00:32.27 | *** join/#bzflag Arsage2 (n=lee137@pool-71-98-108-220.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 00:36.25 | *** join/#bzflag Sir_Pants (n=Sir_Pant@67-42-80-2.tukw.qwest.net) |
| 00:37.55 | *** join/#bzflag gl2tosl2 (n=leif@71-215-255-135.mpls.qwest.net) |
| 00:40.56 | *** join/#bzflag Flash (n=jwmelto@unaffiliated/flash) |
| 00:48.36 | iFeghali | trovao: u there ? |
| 00:48.49 | iFeghali | trovao: im always kicked due to high lag |
| 00:49.28 | *** join/#bzflag Links2004[Links] (n=Links200@mnhm-590c295c.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 00:51.38 | *** join/#bzflag Murtagh (n=479328d4@bz.bzflag.bz) |
| 00:53.02 | *** join/#bzflag chot (n=Miranda@karthago.rot.sgsnet.se) |
| 00:55.36 | chot | hi! i was speaking to brlcad at summer-discuss (google summer of code discussion) and i have an idea for the Network Testing and Simulation Environment project which he urged me to ask in this channel to get feedback on my idea. |
| 00:56.06 | chot | anyway, my idea is to create a proxy program that the client connects through to get to the server |
| 00:56.33 | chot | and this proxy program would then be able to induce all kinds of network errors such as lag and packet loss |
| 00:57.36 | chot | this program would be controllable at runtime, and perhaps (if theres a need for it) it would support some kind of predefined actions, like "lag for 5 sec then packet loss for 3 sec" |
| 00:58.00 | *** join/#bzflag a_temp_dist (n=a_temp_d@about/essy/alarming/a-temp-dist) |
| 00:58.56 | chot | if needed the program migth even listen to specific messeges from the client and or server |
| 01:09.04 | *** join/#bzflag Arsage2 (n=lee137@pool-71-98-108-220.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 01:12.23 | spldart | poke the whole world... let the sun shine in and oceans run out. |
| 01:18.15 | spldart | Speaking of suns... When is that pesky little thing goin to burn out?!?! |
| 01:22.46 | DTRemenak | spldart: 'nother couple billion years by most estimates |
| 01:23.01 | spldart | Don't got that kinda time |
| 01:23.22 | spldart | Ahh |
| 01:23.37 | spldart | Thank you :) |
| 01:23.45 | inchworm | i'm cold |
| 01:23.56 | inchworm | someone turn up the heat |
| 01:23.57 | spldart | *squint* |
| 01:24.32 | inchworm | ahh, warmth |
| 01:24.44 | spldart | Watch the UV side effects |
| 01:25.40 | gl2tosl2 | how much for a cubic meter? |
| 01:26.57 | spldart | LOL! Pogovina just asked over her shoulder... JeffM isn't in the room is he? |
| 01:39.54 | KTL | Results 1 - 10 of about 626 for pogovina. |
| 01:45.51 | A-Delusion | .... as the sun burns it's gravity lessens, and it expands, the sun may have 10 billion years of burn left, but it's diameter will be greater than earth's current orbit, in about 5 billion years |
| 01:46.19 | spldart | Well there's something to look forward to. |
| 01:46.46 | inchworm | but if the gravity weakens the earth and other planets will move away |
| 01:47.18 | A-Delusion | it also cools, |
| 01:47.36 | inchworm | so we better get this global warming thing going of we are to survivie! |
| 01:47.53 | inchworm | s/of/if/ |
| 01:48.09 | *** join/#bzflag rob1n (n=rob1n@unaffiliated/rob1n) |
| 01:48.23 | spldart | Feed the Cows! Save the humans! |
| 01:50.26 | *** join/#bzflag Theme97 (n=Theme97@about/essy/phpwriter/Theme97) |
| 01:51.04 | spldart | If it does we will hop again to venus ;-) |
| 01:55.46 | KTL | a planet with lots of people its dark underground sitting in front of lighting screens playing bzflag. |
| 01:55.52 | KTL | *in its |
| 01:57.07 | spldart | Nothing better than playing bzflag on a 12' screen :-D |
| 01:57.17 | *** join/#bzflag JBdiGriz (n=JBdiGriz@adsl-63-199-246-191.dsl.sndg02.pacbell.net) |
| 01:57.18 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o JBdiGriz] by ChanServ |
| 01:57.25 | KTL | i allready had a lanparty with a laptop the size of half a page |
| 01:57.29 | KTL | terrible |
| 01:57.35 | KTL | starcraft, not bzflag |
| 01:58.31 | spldart | Have an account? |
| 01:58.50 | KTL | i seem to be logged in, it keeps the session open even after weeks, yes |
| 01:58.53 | KTL | no art :D |
| 01:59.38 | spldart | No... Art... ? |
| 01:59.45 | KTL | i don't produce art |
| 02:00.02 | KTL | ok since today i got my raytracer working so maye that can count |
| 02:00.16 | *** join/#bzflag jprvita (n=joaopaul@201-27-231-197.dsl.telesp.net.br) |
| 02:12.08 | *** join/#bzflag ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 02:12.08 | *** topic/#bzflag is http://BZFlag.org || http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/BZFlag || http://my.BZFlag.org/wiki/index.php/Getting_Help || Paste to http://bzflag.pastebin.ca || http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/9453 || http://ohloh.net/projects/189 || http://fisheye1.cenqua.com/browse/bzflag/bzflag || BZFlag is participating in GSoC: http://my.bzflag.org/w/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC students -- please include your irc nick in your proposal |
| 02:12.08 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o ibot] by ChanServ |
| 02:13.08 | menotume | yay, startcraft. was way ahead of it's time |
| 02:15.15 | *** join/#bzflag ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 02:15.15 | *** topic/#bzflag is http://BZFlag.org || http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/BZFlag || http://my.BZFlag.org/wiki/index.php/Getting_Help || Paste to http://bzflag.pastebin.ca || http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/9453 || http://ohloh.net/projects/189 || http://fisheye1.cenqua.com/browse/bzflag/bzflag || BZFlag is participating in GSoC: http://my.bzflag.org/w/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC students -- please include your irc nick in your proposal |
| 02:15.15 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o ibot] by ChanServ |
| 02:25.47 | KTL | i just discovered starcraft some weeks ago |
| 02:25.57 | KTL | got instantly addicted |
| 02:26.29 | KTL | but it irritates me that the zerg, the coolest of all, are so weak |
| 02:27.01 | KTL | and that you can not sell buildings |
| 02:31.02 | menotume | well, zerg can be good |
| 02:31.51 | KTL | they only win by crashing lots of troups on the opponent |
| 02:31.53 | menotume | build up the spider-things (i forget what they're called - been a hilwe) |
| 02:31.58 | KTL | lurkers |
| 02:32.02 | menotume | :) |
| 02:32.20 | KTL | they are good, but then some small airforce with an observer passes by |
| 02:32.38 | menotume | make lots of them :) |
| 02:32.43 | KTL | troops of zerglings and hydralisks get smashed by siege tanks |
| 02:32.46 | menotume | they can attack ground and air |
| 02:32.57 | menotume | ya, seige tanks are gret :) |
| 02:33.01 | KTL | protoss has carrier fleets, terrans have cruiser fleats too |
| 02:33.04 | menotume | light armour, but powerful |
| 02:33.06 | KTL | and valkyries |
| 02:33.34 | KTL | against those things a zerg can not do much, maybe some specialized pricy units can do a thing |
| 02:34.21 | menotume | ya, zergs aren't too useful, i don't waste resources on building them up |
| 02:34.46 | DTRemenak | send three or four units out and take on a whole zerg army. 'twas just way cooler, and not as much of a clickfest. |
| 02:34.51 | menotume | it's been so long, time to re-install that game :) |
| 02:35.04 | menotume | and broodwars |
| 02:35.12 | KTL | if you have to win by quantity, and your quantity is smashed against the first opponent you meet, then you have nothing left when the third opponent comes by |
| 02:35.45 | spldart | OMG! |
| 02:35.54 | KTL | 30 hydralisks waiting underground |
| 02:36.25 | menotume | bserver and guarians take them right ourt :) |
| 02:36.43 | menotume | observer and guadrians take them right out |
| 02:37.14 | menotume | gaurdians - sooo powerful :) |
| 02:37.23 | KTL | i heard the green cloud from the terran observers can not affect nearby troops if the affected beast digs in |
| 02:38.08 | KTL | and protoss is way to strong with that little naugthy floating djerk summoning lightnings on my fleets |
| 02:38.43 | KTL | dark templar is that unit called iirc |
| 02:38.49 | DTRemenak | mmm |
| 02:38.54 | DTRemenak | archons and templars ftw |
| 02:39.33 | *** join/#bzflag hugomelo (n=hugo@143.106.7.170) |
| 02:41.55 | menotume | ya, dark templar, steal other units |
| 02:42.03 | menotume | or, the other teplar |
| 02:42.09 | *** join/#bzflag lodxcol (n=lodxcol@c-69-249-178-98.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 02:42.15 | KTL | that is the rad claud guy, another one |
| 02:42.23 | KTL | red cloud |
| 02:42.33 | menotume | i don't remember |
| 02:42.49 | menotume | i used to play that about every year, for a month or so, then uninstall |
| 02:43.03 | KTL | in multiplayer i should have some of these ready to steal someones fleet |
| 02:43.03 | menotume | has been a coulke yeras now |
| 02:44.10 | DTRemenak | dark archons are the ones who steal units iirc |
| 02:44.27 | DTRemenak | two dark templars + some time -> one dark archon |
| 02:44.33 | menotume | ok, i'll buy that :) |
| 02:44.34 | KTL | they are created by melting 2 other units together ah |
| 02:44.51 | DTRemenak | but it's been a long time since I've played too |
| 02:44.52 | KTL | mmm ... maybe i would keep the dark templars, i've seen what they could |
| 02:44.56 | *** join/#bzflag Sir_Pants (n=Sir_Pant@67-42-80-2.tukw.qwest.net) |
| 02:45.08 | DTRemenak | dark templars can do their own array of serious damage :) |
| 02:45.34 | menotume | nstealing other units is great, not only do you gain, but they lose |
| 02:45.44 | KTL | doesn't it affect your maximal amount of troups |
| 02:45.56 | DTRemenak | normal (high) archons are cool too |
| 02:45.57 | KTL | "supply limit reached" :) |
| 02:45.59 | menotume | i htink so |
| 02:46.18 | menotume | iirc, in broodwars, you could 'steal' maybe 5 above your limit |
| 02:46.26 | DTRemenak | yeah, just a few over |
| 02:46.43 | DTRemenak | usually enough to be able to maintain a defensive perimeter around the archon itself |
| 02:46.52 | DTRemenak | capture more as they died off |
| 02:47.30 | menotume | ok, i now HAVE to look for that disk tonight :) |
| 02:47.37 | KTL | gnegnegne |
| 02:48.08 | DTRemenak | hehe |
| 02:50.43 | DTRemenak | arbiter + hallucinations of arbiters = fun |
| 02:50.55 | menotume | starcraft is one of the few useful things for my win box :) |
| 02:51.00 | KTL | i only saw a screenshot |
| 02:51.03 | DTRemenak | did I mention I liked protoss? :) |
| 02:51.08 | menotume | hehe |
| 02:51.11 | KTL | :) |
| 02:51.22 | menotume | yes, the caonnons are good |
| 02:51.42 | menotume | base defense |
| 02:51.48 | DTRemenak | yup |
| 02:51.53 | KTL | a fully upgraded terran is a problem |
| 02:52.25 | menotume | that game was so well thought out, and balanced |
| 02:52.44 | menotume | now adays half the games are just 'unplayable', just have 'flash' |
| 02:52.49 | KTL | but i recently thought about the effectiveness of a short supply war, the moment you have no money to build drones anymore, and your drones are gone, you are stuck |
| 02:53.08 | menotume | yep, end of game |
| 02:53.12 | menotume | :) |
| 02:53.20 | KTL | in other games you would be able to sell something |
| 02:54.54 | menotume | i used to like to play 'random map' (or whatever they called it) as protoss, make dark templar thingys, and steal drones |
| 02:55.03 | menotume | end up having all 3 technologies |
| 02:55.28 | KTL | if you have the money and time to develop it all .. |
| 02:55.32 | menotume | ya |
| 02:55.54 | menotume | that was my little challange, to make it interesting :) |
| 02:55.55 | KTL | upgrading terran weapons wont upgrade your other types i guess |
| 02:55.59 | KTL | :P |
| 02:56.00 | menotume | no |
| 02:56.06 | menotume | got to build them all up |
| 02:56.48 | KTL | euhm ... your terran soldiers get better if you do ... zerg research for example? |
| 02:57.56 | KTL | ah i go to bed, allmost 5 in the morning for me, will continue working at my raytracer tomorrow |
| 02:58.01 | KTL | night all |
| 03:02.15 | Thumper_ | ~bzflist |
| 03:03.06 | Thumper_ | menotume: does it fix itself or does someone have to kick it ? |
| 03:05.09 | *** part/#bzflag hugomelo (n=hugo@143.106.7.170) |
| 03:05.57 | *** join/#bzflag essy (n=essy@freenode/staff/sportchick) |
| 03:05.58 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v essy] by ChanServ |
| 03:06.02 | *** join/#bzflag Guu (n=supybot@bz.bzflag.bz) |
| 03:09.23 | *** join/#bzflag JBdiGriz (n=JBdiGriz@adsl-63-199-246-191.dsl.sndg02.pacbell.net) |
| 03:09.24 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o JBdiGriz] by ChanServ |
| 03:13.13 | *** join/#bzflag Blue-Eyes (n=Blue@host12-218-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 03:14.12 | essy | ~ping bzflag.bz |
| 03:14.25 | ibot | pong bzflag.bz |
| 03:15.27 | essy | ~query bzflag.bz |
| 03:15.35 | essy | ~bzfquery bzflag.bz |
| 03:16.12 | blast007 | ~bzflist |
| 03:16.21 | blast007 | hmm |
| 03:16.29 | essy | blast007: to ping a non-game server? |
| 03:16.33 | essy | I want to ping the dns |
| 03:16.55 | blast007 | the server is responding to ping |
| 03:17.03 | essy | just not to me :( |
| 03:17.10 | blast007 | but not to SSH |
| 03:17.18 | essy | yeah I noticed |
| 03:17.30 | essy | and m.b.o. seems to be down |
| 03:17.37 | essy | at least the wiki portion is |
| 03:19.09 | blast007 | ~bzflist |
| 03:20.28 | a_temp_dist | I can load the pages in a browser |
| 03:21.05 | essy | blast007: are you sure it's not cached? |
| 03:21.11 | blast007 | I can't load them in my browser here, but I can from my dedicated |
| 03:21.14 | blast007 | via telnet |
| 03:21.29 | blast007 | and by elinks |
| 03:22.02 | essy | I can't load these: http://my.bzflag.org/w/Ideas or http://my.bzflag/org/w/Google_Summer_of_Code |
| 03:22.23 | blast007 | I can't get to it from home |
| 03:22.30 | essy | hrm |
| 03:22.36 | essy | blast007: where is home, again? |
| 03:22.41 | essy | and where CAN you get to it from? |
| 03:22.59 | blast007 | I can get to it from my dedicated server in Ohio |
| 03:23.12 | a_temp_dist | must be a dns problem then - because they load for me |
| 03:23.12 | essy | but not from...? |
| 03:23.23 | essy | bah |
| 03:23.24 | Thumper_ | can't ping bzflag.bz from here |
| 03:23.25 | a_temp_dist | i can get them from MN |
| 03:23.34 | blast007 | resolves to 66.111.56.50 here |
| 03:23.39 | blast007 | ~nslookup bzflag.bz |
| 03:24.51 | a_temp_dist | ~nslookup my.bzflag.org |
| 03:24.51 | blast007 | who broke teh interwebs!? |
| 03:25.50 | a_temp_dist | http://66.111.56.50/w/Google_Summer_of_Code - does NOT load for me |
| 03:27.40 | *** join/#bzflag brlcad (n=sean@bz.bzflag.bz) |
| 03:28.39 | JBdiGriz | That's strange, because I'm looking at that page right now. |
| 03:28.57 | inchworm | Works for me too |
| 03:29.01 | inchworm | by name |
| 03:29.07 | lodxcol | doesn't work here |
| 03:29.12 | elg | timeout here |
| 03:29.23 | *** join/#bzflag JeffM2501 (n=JeffM@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/JeffM2501) |
| 03:29.24 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ |
| 03:29.30 | Thumper_ | --- bzflag.bz ping statistics --- |
| 03:29.30 | Thumper_ | 61 packets transmitted, 0 received, 100% packet loss, time 60014ms |
| 03:29.53 | JBdiGriz | Of course, the URL with the host my.bzflag/org might cause a problem in the lookup. |
| 03:29.55 | *** join/#bzflag Hannibal (n=Hannibal@pool-71-113-209-249.herntx.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 03:30.05 | essy | I still can't ssh in |
| 03:30.12 | essy | I wonder if I could if I tried using the iP instead |
| 03:30.31 | JBdiGriz | Which URL are you using? There is a problem with one of them. |
| 03:30.41 | blast007 | I got in via SSH by tunneling through my dedicated server ;) |
| 03:30.51 | inchworm | ping bzflag.bz works here |
| 03:30.54 | essy | Jeff, I can't get into anything with bzflag.z |
| 03:30.59 | essy | err, bzflag.bz |
| 03:31.07 | Thumper_ | ok some routes are broken |
| 03:31.10 | JBdiGriz | Is Jeff around? |
| 03:31.16 | JeffM2501 | yes |
| 03:31.36 | JeffM2501 | nor can I |
| 03:31.46 | essy | grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, I can't get to ANY of my servers |
| 03:31.52 | a_temp_dist | --- 66.111.56.50 ping statistics --- 10 packets transmitted, 10 packets received, 0% packet loss |
| 03:31.55 | essy | can't get into bluescreenofdeath either :( |
| 03:32.03 | JeffM2501 | cus it's donw |
| 03:32.04 | JeffM2501 | down |
| 03:32.14 | essy | oh, I got into that one...just very slow |
| 03:32.43 | JBdiGriz | What's down? I'm able to access the my.bzflag.org web server. |
| 03:32.52 | JeffM2501 | I'm not |
| 03:32.54 | Thumper_ | bzflag.bz is working but some routes to it are broken |
| 03:32.57 | JeffM2501 | prolly some route somewhere |
| 03:33.01 | JeffM2501 | itll come back |
| 03:33.02 | Thumper_ | Toronto->bzflag.bz is down |
| 03:33.06 | Thumper_ | xlhost->bzflag.bz works |
| 03:33.12 | JeffM2501 | we'll live |
| 03:33.37 | JBdiGriz | 11 hops from here to there |
| 03:34.07 | JeffM2501 | prolly just a router from one of the hosts ISPs |
| 03:35.04 | JBdiGriz | There are problems with accessing through Level3.net. |
| 03:35.53 | essy | from the UK: |
| 03:35.54 | essy | 53 packets transmitted, 51 received, 3% packet loss, time 61316ms |
| 03:35.54 | essy | rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 123.452/366.364/619.022/83.076 ms |
| 03:36.04 | JeffM2501 | wlecome to the interweb :) |
| 03:36.21 | menotume | no gu matches without ls :( |
| 03:36.39 | *** join/#bzflag essy_ (i=greece@host-87-74-16-26.bulldogdsl.com) |
| 03:38.41 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v SportyGal] by ChanServ |
| 03:39.19 | *** join/#bzflag essy (i=greece@freenode/staff/sportchick) |
| 03:39.20 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v essy] by ChanServ |
| 03:41.18 | menotume | heh, that works, ssh to dub, ssh to bzflag.bz |
| 03:41.29 | blast007 | hehe |
| 03:42.09 | menotume | eww, stopped working |
| 03:43.13 | LagChick | ~lart menotume |
| 03:43.13 | ibot | chops menotume in half with a free Solaris 7 CD |
| 03:43.15 | LagChick | you killed it :( |
| 03:43.43 | LagChick | omg, this hotel connection is slower than my phone :( |
| 03:44.31 | *** join/#bzflag blast007bz (n=blast@bz.bzflag.bz) |
| 03:44.57 | blast007bz | :) |
| 03:45.13 | LagChick | how'd you do it, blast? |
| 03:45.38 | blast007 | XLHost can get to it |
| 03:45.54 | blast007 | so I ssh'ed to XLHost, set up a tunnel to .bz, and used that |
| 03:45.58 | Thumper_ | me2 |
| 03:46.06 | blast007 | of course, doesn't need the tunnel |
| 03:46.21 | blast007 | could just run the ssh client on the XLHost server |
| 03:50.23 | blast007 | ~bzflist |
| 03:50.51 | *** join/#bzflag Manu (n=jujibo@about/essy/JujiboHunter/Manu) |
| 03:50.51 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v Manu] by ChanServ |
| 03:51.12 | lodxcol | woot |
| 03:51.22 | *** join/#bzflag BlueEyes (n=Blue@host17-218-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 03:52.18 | SportChick | \/ |
| 03:52.21 | SportChick | \o/ |
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| 05:48.25 | jude- | the suspense is killing me |
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| 06:07.13 | jude- | so, the accepted proposals will be posted April 11th? |
| 06:13.58 | Epyon | jude-, it will be like DEFCON - everybody dies xD |
| 06:16.31 | jude- | Epyon: given the traffic on this channel, I'd say they're already dead :P |
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| 06:49.29 | Epyon | You have been automaticaly kicked for teammate killing. I s*ck at this game :P |
| 06:51.49 | L4m3r | Epyon: you do not have to censor your language any more than you would on, say, network television, FYI ;) |
| 06:54.23 | DTRemenak | Epyon: don't shoot players who are the same color as you ;) |
| 06:54.37 | DTRemenak | it's like the gangs in some cities (is that an inappropriate comment?) |
| 06:59.22 | Epyon | L4m3r, my first reply on this channel was "watch your language" :P |
| 06:59.35 | L4m3r | ha! |
| 06:59.54 | Epyon | DTRemenak, it's just that my team-mates keep getting into the line of fire at long shots :/ |
| 06:59.59 | DTRemenak | hehe |
| 07:00.06 | DTRemenak | yeah, blame it on your teammates |
| 07:00.15 | DTRemenak | probably all of whom have played longer than you have :P |
| 07:00.19 | Epyon | Any dodge tips? I see it coming, and usualy still get hit :/ |
| 07:00.24 | DTRemenak | S-pattern |
| 07:00.34 | DTRemenak | don't be where the shot is |
| 07:00.41 | Pommes | lol |
| 07:00.44 | Epyon | I mean those that I see :P |
| 07:01.01 | Epyon | I do reverse and left/right and still get hit :| |
| 07:01.22 | DTRemenak | Epyon: guides section at http://shellshock.bzflag.bz/ |
| 07:01.35 | DTRemenak | the s-pattern is the equivalent of strafing |
| 07:01.46 | Epyon | DTRemenak, thanks, that's exactly what I was looking for :> |
| 07:01.59 | L4m3r | and use radar |
| 07:02.04 | DTRemenak | Epyon: .bz has been responding rather slowly today, so I'm not sure how well that will work for you |
| 07:02.15 | DTRemenak | but dutchrai wrote some kickin' guides a while back |
| 07:02.22 | L4m3r | then you'll see all the shots. it helps a LOT if you go into GUI options and make radar shots larger. |
| 07:02.31 | Epyon | I need to learn to play the game better in case my application gets accepted :P |
| 07:02.42 | DTRemenak | heh, in case |
| 07:02.57 | Epyon | L4m3r, yeah, that would help |
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| 07:03.26 | L4m3r | people who do the crazy non-jumping ducati stuff hardly use the window at all |
| 07:03.54 | L4m3r | I think SportChick said radar takes up 2/3 of her screen |
| 07:04.25 | Epyon | reminds me of GLTron -- sure there was a cool 3D display, yet the only thing I looked at was the radar xD |
| 07:05.31 | Epyon | BTW, mouse movement is prefered towards keyboard? |
| 07:05.45 | L4m3r | depends on player preference |
| 07:05.53 | L4m3r | mouse is more precise but I find it awkward |
| 07:06.29 | L4m3r | I find that the keyboard works fine for me with strategic use of the "slow keyboard motion" key |
| 07:06.46 | L4m3r | precise enough for 98% of cases, I've found |
| 07:07.15 | CIA-17 | BZFlag: 03atupone 07v2_0_cs_branch * 10bzflag/ (14 files in 7 dirs): |
| 07:07.15 | CIA-17 | BZFlag: Doing teleporter - the border. Trying to do the oldway, and then informing CS. |
| 07:07.15 | CIA-17 | BZFlag: Too many triangles to rethink, otherwise. |
| 07:07.16 | CIA-17 | BZFlag: Going to port back to this all the stuff done |
| 07:07.52 | DTRemenak | Epyon: vast majority of players prefer mouse (or joystick) |
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| 08:23.38 | daxxar | Mornin'. :) |
| 08:26.29 | Epyon | mornin' :P |
| 08:28.41 | daxxar | =) |
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| 11:43.44 | bz23 | hello Guys |
| 11:44.27 | MM | please join www.maxdemon.co.nr |
| 11:44.32 | MM | please join www.maxdemon.co.nr |
| 11:44.33 | MM | please join www.maxdemon.co.nr |
| 11:44.34 | MM | please join www.maxdemon.co.nr |
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| 12:16.21 | daxxar | Hrm. Spambots that flood themself off. Real smooth. |
| 12:21.05 | SportChick | heh |
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| 15:04.45 | A-Delusion | join ##bzw |
| 15:05.01 | A-Delusion | woops |
| 15:08.43 | *** topic/#bzflag by DTRemenak -> http://BZFlag.org || http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/BZFlag || http://my.BZFlag.org/wiki/index.php/Getting_Help || Paste to http://bzflag.pastebin.ca || http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/9453 || http://ohloh.net/projects/189 || http://fisheye1.cenqua.com/browse/bzflag/bzflag || BZFlag is participating in GSoC: http://my.bzflag.org/w/Google_Summer_of_Code |
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| 15:25.32 | CIA-17 | BZFlag: 03t-s * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/bzfsAPI.cxx: Fix compiler error regarding urlEncode |
| 15:30.18 | donny_baker | DTRemenak: concerning topic change - on my client the '.' at the end of the topic is included in the GSoC link and thus points to a page that doesn't exist |
| 15:30.41 | donny_baker | don't know if that is the way others see it, just thought you should know |
| 15:31.03 | TheRedBaron | DTRemenak: include a space at the end of the GSoC link, that should fix it |
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| 16:38.58 | JeffM2501 | so how'd we make out after the deadline? |
| 16:46.53 | Erroneous | total of 40 |
| 16:47.14 | JeffM2501 | yeah not too bad |
| 16:47.33 | JeffM2501 | another editor app that wasn't horible, but not the best |
| 16:47.54 | JeffM2501 | I assume somone fixed my screwup in head? |
| 16:48.13 | Erroneous | screwup? |
| 16:48.24 | JeffM2501 | had () ( void ) after a function |
| 16:48.34 | Erroneous | cool |
| 16:49.13 | Erroneous | and no, I don't think anyone has fixed it |
| 16:50.01 | JeffM2501 | ts did |
| 16:50.06 | JeffM2501 | thank you ts |
| 16:50.19 | JeffM2501 | I had fixed 2.0.x but I had forgoten 2.1 :( |
| 16:52.50 | JeffM2501 | the other DR enhancement is well writen |
| 16:53.40 | ts | np |
| 16:53.53 | JeffM2501 | if we got our top 7 ( like you think we'll get ) I'd be happy |
| 16:54.00 | JeffM2501 | even top 5 |
| 16:54.10 | JeffM2501 | I think that would even make purple_cow happy |
| 16:55.03 | JeffM2501 | and we'd not even have to have more then one branch for em |
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| 16:59.46 | JeffM2501 | Erroneous, if we did have an engine branch for like the ogre guy, would it be possible to automate merges from the mainline into it? |
| 16:59.54 | JeffM2501 | so that he'd have to deal with our regular code changes? |
| 17:00.06 | Erroneous | no, there's no real automatic merging |
| 17:00.09 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 17:00.14 | Erroneous | unless we wanted to check in conflicts |
| 17:00.15 | JeffM2501 | but we could do it every so often |
| 17:00.17 | JeffM2501 | heh |
| 17:00.21 | Erroneous | we could have HIM do it :P |
| 17:00.22 | JeffM2501 | no tha'ts not nice |
| 17:00.25 | JeffM2501 | yes we can |
| 17:00.30 | JeffM2501 | that was the next option |
| 17:00.47 | Erroneous | it's not all that difficult if you're used to commandline cvs |
| 17:00.55 | JeffM2501 | I can't agree with somone's -2 for that simple concept |
| 17:00.57 | Erroneous | dunno how it is with tortoise |
| 17:01.12 | Erroneous | what simple concept? |
| 17:01.26 | JeffM2501 | code drops instead of using a repository |
| 17:06.59 | *** join/#bzflag Quyenvo (n=quyenvo4@58.186.67.139) |
| 17:08.58 | JeffM2501 | ok, so we got like what 2 weeks to go left handed? |
| 17:09.17 | Erroneous | heh |
| 17:09.33 | JeffM2501 | I mean it sounds like we are shoting for SOME engine |
| 17:09.40 | JeffM2501 | so may as well do it, as you said yesterday |
| 17:10.17 | JeffM2501 | just means swaping the maps on read, and then the winding order in GL |
| 17:10.23 | JeffM2501 | and input of course |
| 17:10.55 | JeffM2501 | it should not be bad, we just may have to hit all the math and normal calcs |
| 17:11.37 | JeffM2501 | yeah but I'd rather have that bustage in something EVERYONE can fix :) |
| 17:11.58 | JeffM2501 | then screwing up the people just working on engines, that will each have to find and fix that bustage seperately |
| 17:12.32 | JeffM2501 | or we let them try to shove there enngines into right hand and see how they each solve it |
| 17:13.02 | Erroneous | heh |
| 17:13.10 | JeffM2501 | I'm sure they could apply a -1 scale in X to each engine and get fake right hand |
| 17:13.20 | JeffM2501 | but then that breaks all there model loaders as the windings are wrong |
| 17:13.40 | Erroneous | could always use our own model loaders |
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| 17:13.46 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 17:13.59 | JeffM2501 | but then you loose one feature of the engine, just cus we don't want to swap to left hand |
| 17:14.14 | Erroneous | yup |
| 17:14.18 | JeffM2501 | it may work out to the same amount of work |
| 17:14.46 | JeffM2501 | and it ain't bad for all of us to get more familiar with our geometric and positional pipelines. |
| 17:15.24 | JeffM2501 | bz uses a right hand coordiante system |
| 17:15.26 | JeffM2501 | damn near every 3rd part 3d engine does left hand |
| 17:15.29 | Epyon | lol! |
| 17:15.36 | JeffM2501 | cus direct 3d does left |
| 17:15.38 | Epyon | Now EVERYTHING makes sense xD |
| 17:15.38 | Erroneous | yup, they're all wrong |
| 17:15.47 | Erroneous | because of microsoft |
| 17:15.49 | JeffM2501 | so if we are looking to use SOME engine |
| 17:16.09 | Quyenvo | excuse me |
| 17:16.10 | JeffM2501 | then it may be a benifit for us to convert our internal stuff to left hand, BEFORE that engine work happens. |
| 17:16.26 | Quyenvo | I see bzflag on google summer code |
| 17:16.26 | JeffM2501 | that's what I'm sayin |
| 17:16.30 | JeffM2501 | you do |
| 17:16.52 | Epyon | Quyenvo, you have reflexes of a chessmaster :) |
| 17:17.13 | JeffM2501 | Epyon, be nice, he may not be applying |
| 17:17.13 | Quyenvo | uhm |
| 17:17.24 | Quyenvo | yah |
| 17:17.28 | Quyenvo | i'm not |
| 17:17.30 | JeffM2501 | did you have a question on Quyenvo |
| 17:17.36 | JeffM2501 | on it even :) |
| 17:17.44 | JeffM2501 | we are on SoC indeed |
| 17:17.49 | Epyon | JeffM2501, nah, it's just it's funny with all the GSOC discussion :> |
| 17:17.59 | Quyenvo | I wanna know how to learn game programming |
| 17:18.01 | JeffM2501 | it's still not nice to him |
| 17:18.09 | JeffM2501 | Quyenvo, cool |
| 17:18.10 | Quyenvo | and i'm here to ask |
| 17:18.14 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 17:18.22 | Quyenvo | how can I start |
| 17:18.30 | JeffM2501 | what programing languages do you know/are interested in. |
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| 17:18.34 | Quyenvo | C++ |
| 17:18.40 | JeffM2501 | how much of it do you know? |
| 17:19.08 | Epyon | Quyenvo, http://nehe.gamedev.net/ |
| 17:19.33 | JeffM2501 | that is a good place for openGL stuff, but 3d does not a game make. |
| 17:19.40 | Epyon | And go through all those tutorials :) |
| 17:19.41 | JeffM2501 | you have to start at the begining :) |
| 17:19.42 | Quyenvo | I just have 2 year on CPP |
| 17:19.45 | Quyenvo | thanks |
| 17:19.45 | JeffM2501 | cool |
| 17:19.53 | JeffM2501 | Epyon, you are jumping the gun |
| 17:19.56 | Epyon | JeffM2501, most people nowdays want to do 3d only anyway. |
| 17:19.58 | JeffM2501 | it's best to learn simple gameplay first |
| 17:20.09 | JeffM2501 | Epyon, what they want isn't allways best to learn from |
| 17:20.31 | JeffM2501 | I find it best to start small, make a simple 2d game, so you get the idea of how all the events work, sound, input, etc.. |
| 17:20.38 | JeffM2501 | then move into 3d once you have a real game concept |
| 17:20.52 | JeffM2501 | or start by moding existing games, so you see how they work |
| 17:20.59 | JeffM2501 | a game is a LOT more then just openGL or 3d calls |
| 17:21.05 | JeffM2501 | a huge amount |
| 17:21.12 | Epyon | JeffM2501, there are two kinds of people, determinated and not -- both types usualy want to do 3d games only -- the not determinated will go to that site, do a few tutorials and say, ah hell, who cares. |
| 17:21.31 | Epyon | The others will go there, do a few tuts, and then understand that they need to start small :) |
| 17:21.38 | JeffM2501 | yeah but they do those tutorials, and they still havent'e learned anything about making an actual game |
| 17:21.47 | JeffM2501 | they should do those AFTER they get the basics. |
| 17:22.00 | Epyon | My advice is doing a roguelike game - it's a realy good way to learn game design. |
| 17:22.08 | JeffM2501 | dude, engouh with your rougelike |
| 17:22.19 | Epyon | But it's true that I'm biased, and not all people can stand ASCII :P |
| 17:22.23 | JeffM2501 | I'd say asteroids in SDL :) |
| 17:22.30 | JeffM2501 | it's got all the basics |
| 17:22.37 | JeffM2501 | real input, real sound, basic graphics |
| 17:22.43 | JeffM2501 | drawing on the screen, etc.. |
| 17:22.52 | JeffM2501 | simple movement |
| 17:22.54 | Epyon | what about engine design? ;_ |
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| 17:23.01 | JeffM2501 | that's a totaly seperate issue |
| 17:23.16 | JeffM2501 | if you have 18 months you can do 1 of 2 things, make a game or make an engine |
| 17:23.16 | Epyon | ... and one that is not covered anywhere :/ |
| 17:23.18 | JeffM2501 | pick 1 |
| 17:23.30 | JeffM2501 | cus you don't have to make an engine to make a game anymore |
| 17:23.36 | JeffM2501 | use a 3rd party one |
| 17:23.53 | Epyon | true. |
| 17:24.14 | JeffM2501 | it's very rare for a comerical game company to make there own engine |
| 17:24.23 | JeffM2501 | epic the only one I know of |
| 17:24.24 | Epyon | To bad that trying to do something original you'll end up doing a game engine anyway :/ |
| 17:24.29 | JeffM2501 | id have even been farming out the game part. |
| 17:24.54 | Epyon | id does make engines, and sell them afterwards :P |
| 17:24.56 | JeffM2501 | epic gets away cus they have 3 departements |
| 17:25.06 | JeffM2501 | yes, but id did not make the game part of doom3 or quake 4 ;) |
| 17:25.10 | JeffM2501 | they farmed those out |
| 17:25.15 | JeffM2501 | so they could JUST do engines |
| 17:25.17 | Epyon | heh ;] |
| 17:25.22 | Epyon | true ;] |
| 17:25.22 | JeffM2501 | that's what I'm saying |
| 17:25.26 | JeffM2501 | one team does one or the other |
| 17:25.44 | JeffM2501 | if you make an engine it's worth a lot to many others |
| 17:25.50 | Epyon | But if Quyenvo is still listening we might have just confused him even more :P |
| 17:26.00 | JeffM2501 | welcome to the game industry ;) |
| 17:26.09 | JeffM2501 | Open source gaming is rather difrent tho |
| 17:26.16 | JeffM2501 | cus you can get longscale timelines |
| 17:26.28 | JeffM2501 | and not a whole lot of inovation |
| 17:26.37 | Epyon | Err? |
| 17:26.49 | JeffM2501 | lots of older projects still going on, or people working on comerical engines that go OS |
| 17:26.58 | Epyon | I thought *commercial* games have a complete lack of innovation :P |
| 17:27.08 | JeffM2501 | where is the open source WoW? |
| 17:27.14 | JeffM2501 | or fear? |
| 17:27.16 | Epyon | Plaqneshift? |
| 17:27.26 | JeffM2501 | dosn't even compare |
| 17:27.48 | JeffM2501 | how many players does it have? |
| 17:27.54 | Epyon | well, neither does anything compare to Q4 :P |
| 17:27.58 | JeffM2501 | exactly |
| 17:28.03 | Quyenvo | yah |
| 17:28.07 | Epyon | so that's an invalid argument |
| 17:28.11 | Quyenvo | very confused |
| 17:28.18 | Epyon | lol, told so :p |
| 17:28.28 | JeffM2501 | Quyenvo, it all comes down to waht you want to learn first, the game part, or the 3d part. |
| 17:28.32 | Quyenvo | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:28.32 | JeffM2501 | that's the argument |
| 17:28.47 | JeffM2501 | the 3d part will not realy show you how to make a game, just to draw prety pictures. |
| 17:29.07 | Quyenvo | I donn know what I want |
| 17:29.09 | JeffM2501 | my recomendation is to make a simple game first |
| 17:29.15 | Quyenvo | cos Im newbie |
| 17:29.19 | JeffM2501 | copy another game, so you get the feel of how it all works |
| 17:29.25 | Epyon | Quyenvo, this is probably the best general article on game development I read, but probably JeffM2501 will scold me again: |
| 17:29.26 | Epyon | http://www.gamedev.net/reference/articles/article892.asp |
| 17:29.31 | JeffM2501 | make your own tetris |
| 17:29.36 | JeffM2501 | or your own space invaders |
| 17:29.40 | JeffM2501 | so you get some confidence |
| 17:29.50 | Epyon | ... duh, or maybe he wont :) |
| 17:29.55 | Epyon | (scold me) |
| 17:30.03 | JeffM2501 | actual that says to make tetris first :) |
| 17:30.08 | JeffM2501 | so no, that's just saying what I said. |
| 17:30.09 | Quyenvo | yah |
| 17:30.13 | JeffM2501 | start simple |
| 17:30.16 | JeffM2501 | then get flashy |
| 17:30.19 | Quyenvo | so please tell me |
| 17:30.29 | JeffM2501 | are you looking for a step by step? |
| 17:30.34 | JeffM2501 | or just general hints? |
| 17:30.34 | Quyenvo | where i can get the thing really simmple |
| 17:30.38 | JeffM2501 | you have to make it |
| 17:30.39 | Quyenvo | yah |
| 17:30.41 | JeffM2501 | you don't "get it" |
| 17:30.44 | Quyenvo | step step :D |
| 17:30.48 | JeffM2501 | that won't happen |
| 17:31.04 | Quyenvo | tell me more |
| 17:31.10 | JeffM2501 | go here, and spend the 40$ and make a crap FPS if you don't want to learn, http://t3dgm.thegamecreators.com/ |
| 17:31.23 | JeffM2501 | the more is what you figure out as you code |
| 17:31.38 | JeffM2501 | how much work are you willing to put into it? |
| 17:31.49 | Quyenvo | I really wanna to learn |
| 17:32.36 | JeffM2501 | then I'd start looking at like the SDL examples to see how they move things around |
| 17:32.36 | Quyenvo | when you ask step by step i thought that is getting start |
| 17:32.48 | JeffM2501 | there are no step by steps |
| 17:32.58 | JeffM2501 | there are books on it |
| 17:33.06 | JeffM2501 | they will simply show you examples |
| 17:33.17 | JeffM2501 | do you want to start by making your own simple game? or modifying others? |
| 17:34.01 | Quyenvo | uhm modifying |
| 17:34.11 | JeffM2501 | then pick your game and dive in :) |
| 17:34.12 | Quyenvo | is that a good way to learn |
| 17:34.20 | JeffM2501 | it's on way |
| 17:34.27 | Quyenvo | or make my own simmple game |
| 17:34.28 | JeffM2501 | depends on what you learn from better |
| 17:34.32 | JeffM2501 | that is your choice |
| 17:34.37 | Quyenvo | ah how about book |
| 17:34.38 | JeffM2501 | you will have to decide that |
| 17:34.42 | JeffM2501 | that is also another option |
| 17:34.50 | JeffM2501 | each method works better or worse for difrent people. |
| 17:34.59 | JeffM2501 | http://lazyfoo.net/SDL_tutorials/index.php <- basic 2d stuff |
| 17:34.59 | Epyon | BTW, "Hi guys, I want to make a game, it will be a fantasy 3D MMORPG, I had a C++ class already" <-- I love that quote (from gamedev.net) :P |
| 17:35.28 | Epyon | Quyenvo, find a simple game, compile it, run. Make changes, compile it, run... |
| 17:35.30 | JeffM2501 | or you pick some engine to use, like ogre, or CS |
| 17:35.47 | JeffM2501 | they have sample proejcts that you can modify |
| 17:36.25 | Epyon | JeffM2501, that's not easy for newbies -> engines usualy have their own complicated API, that is not newbie friendly (at least if the engine is powerful) |
| 17:36.43 | JeffM2501 | depends on the engine |
| 17:36.47 | Quyenvo | yeah |
| 17:36.50 | JeffM2501 | I'm just offering example |
| 17:36.59 | JeffM2501 | he'll have to make his( her ) own choice. |
| 17:37.00 | Epyon | At least OGRE and CS are not self-explanatory. |
| 17:37.00 | Quyenvo | that not easy for me :( |
| 17:37.02 | JeffM2501 | that's part opf it |
| 17:37.10 | JeffM2501 | then start simple, with sdl |
| 17:37.23 | Epyon | wait wait... |
| 17:37.46 | Epyon | I've got the answer for you Quyenvo :) |
| 17:38.02 | Quyenvo | Jeff ! that mean I will be start on SDL |
| 17:38.33 | Epyon | Cone3D is down, dammit :( |
| 17:38.57 | JeffM2501 | sdl is simple 2d so it as a simpler API |
| 17:39.15 | Quyenvo | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:39.19 | JeffM2501 | Epyon, there is no single answer, he has to make his own descissions, that's part of the learning process. |
| 17:39.25 | Epyon | http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Apl%3Aofficial&hs=b3Z&q=+site%3Acone3d.gamedev.net+cone3d+gfxsdl&btnG=Search |
| 17:39.27 | JeffM2501 | you can't simpley be told how to make games. |
| 17:39.54 | Epyon | The cone3d site is down, but you can still access it via "Cached" |
| 17:40.16 | Epyon | It teaches step by step how to do a horizontal shooter with C++ and SDL |
| 17:41.46 | Quyenvo | I think first of all I need to be how to do with the simple things and create my own simple game |
| 17:42.05 | JeffM2501 | Quyenvo, honestly tho, this isn't the best channel to ask in, we are not a game tutorial, but a very old game. There are probably better places for research |
| 17:42.10 | Quyenvo | after that I will be modify some Open Project |
| 17:42.20 | JeffM2501 | none of the people here wrote bzflag from the begining. |
| 17:42.36 | Epyon | Quyenvo, then check the tutorials I've linked too. |
| 17:42.39 | Epyon | to* |
| 17:42.44 | Quyenvo | sorry Jeff |
| 17:42.53 | Quyenvo | I lke the BZ |
| 17:43.16 | Quyenvo | when I saw the Idea that make bz with orge or CS |
| 17:43.36 | Quyenvo | that is a great idea |
| 17:43.44 | JeffM2501 | oh it was a good place to get ideas sure, I'm just saying for further research there are better places that will give you better info. |
| 17:44.02 | JeffM2501 | Epyon, that is becoming rather apperant |
| 17:44.42 | Epyon | JeffM2501, I know but I can't help it - except admitting it :/ |
| 17:44.56 | JeffM2501 | I think you just get rather excited |
| 17:45.04 | JeffM2501 | breathe then type :) |
| 17:45.07 | Quyenvo | one last thing Jeff |
| 17:45.11 | JeffM2501 | and know there are many ways todo things. |
| 17:45.31 | Epyon | JeffM2501, I'm the blind crusader type, so it's hard ;] |
| 17:45.49 | Quyenvo | do you give me any comment on what the book you have read |
| 17:46.06 | JeffM2501 | no I don't do books |
| 17:46.55 | Epyon | Quyenvo, there are plenty tutorials on the web tough |
| 17:47.01 | Epyon | like here - http://www.gamedev.net/reference/list.asp?categoryid=35 |
| 17:48.15 | Quyenvo | oh thanks Ep |
| 17:56.40 | Raziel | <Epyon> BTW, "Hi guys, I want to make a game, it will be a fantasy 3D MMORPG, I had a C++ class already" <-- I love that quote (from gamedev.net) :P <--- I've had read in other forums about a guy that was new to programming and wanted to make a MMORPG in Visual Basic... |
| 17:57.29 | JeffM2501 | it's common |
| 17:57.29 | Raziel | it's insane |
| 17:57.31 | JeffM2501 | read any engine fourm and you'll see it |
| 17:57.37 | JeffM2501 | tis the nature of youngins |
| 17:57.40 | Epyon | Raziel, it's absolutely common, but that one seemed like the essence of it for me :) |
| 17:57.57 | Raziel | uh, real world is scary :\ |
| 17:59.45 | Epyon | real world is scarier, I hope I won't run out of ammo to find that out xD |
| 18:01.25 | Raziel | xD |
| 18:02.49 | *** join/#bzflag Dessy (n=Dessy@88.134.210.139) |
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| 18:04.46 | KTL | if i decide to code in c++, then there are allways people here at the university asking "why c++?" as if they all want to say "use java" (or rubby or whatever), good that i don't listen to people :) |
| 18:05.01 | KTL | always, one l |
| 18:07.28 | ruskie | :) |
| 18:11.32 | KTL | btw, i don't know about good c++ programming practice around a very basic issue: should i use aliasses for objects or pointers? (of course i have to make sure that the object's memory is taken care of) |
| 18:12.07 | brlcad | aliases? |
| 18:12.13 | KTL | iType& t |
| 18:12.59 | brlcad | references |
| 18:12.59 | KTL | Type & i; |
| 18:12.59 | KTL | ok yes |
| 18:12.59 | brlcad | aliasing is something rather different |
| 18:13.20 | brlcad | the answer is "it depends" .. there are good and bad uses of references |
| 18:13.20 | KTL | int a = 5; int & b = a; b = 6; ... a will be 6 no? |
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| 18:22.00 | *** part/#bzflag Quyenvo (n=quyenvo4@58.186.67.139) |
| 18:26.33 | Erroneous | KTL: generally speaking, I use pointers to basic types (where pointer math makes sense) and references to objects (where it doesn't). I'll also tend to drift towards pointers if I think it makes the code more clear (explicit dereferences are good for readability in many cases). |
| 18:35.57 | KTL | mmm tnx |
| 18:36.35 | Erroneous | using pointers also tends to remind me that I need to deallocate things, but that's just be a personal preference. |
| 18:36.36 | Erroneous | a lot of people will encourage you to use more references, since they're a bit safer (what with not being able to pass null or mistyped objects) |
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| 18:38.02 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o JBdiGriz] by ChanServ |
| 18:39.55 | KTL | I tend make std::map's that map pointers to some value, if i placed the object itself in the container then it could be copied if together with the container, that's a reason why i like to jump on pointers |
| 18:40.08 | KTL | and suppose i wanted an object in a container like a vector |
| 18:40.42 | KTL | then i may have to copy it at instantiation |
| 18:42.31 | KTL | or i do myset.insert(my_new_objects_type(args)), and then ... if i want to do something with my newly created instance, then i have to query my set again for it |
| 18:42.44 | KTL | s/i/if/ |
| 18:45.24 | KTL | oww ... /me discovers that the insert on a std::set has a return pair<iterator, bool> |
| 18:45.47 | Erroneous | what, you don't like pairs? :) |
| 18:46.19 | KTL | i like pairs :) |
| 18:46.54 | KTL | i can consider putting more stuff into containers again |
| 18:47.03 | *** join/#bzflag a_meteorite (n=a_meteor@unaffiliated/ameteorite/x-000000001) |
| 18:47.18 | Erroneous | they're handy. watch for the speed penalty though. |
| 18:47.36 | KTL | but following pointers also costs speed ? |
| 18:48.04 | Erroneous | dereferences are very fast (register copy iirc) |
| 18:48.28 | donny_baker | JeffM2501: any chance of begging you to refresh the beta build of 2.0.9... pretty please :) |
| 18:48.40 | JeffM2501 | how much money you got? |
| 18:48.47 | blast007 | hehe |
| 18:48.48 | JeffM2501 | oh 2.0.9? |
| 18:48.50 | JeffM2501 | why? |
| 18:48.58 | JeffM2501 | it's not beta |
| 18:49.05 | donny_baker | well if that's what your looking for, I'm definatly not the one to ask :) |
| 18:49.07 | a_meteorite | JeffM2501: I noticed that for ideas, switching to enet for the protocol was suggested. Is that still a goal? |
| 18:49.23 | JeffM2501 | a_meteorite, enet or raknet would be my prefrence |
| 18:49.29 | a_meteorite | Ah |
| 18:49.36 | JeffM2501 | to get the winsock cruft out of the main code |
| 18:49.37 | donny_baker | I meant out on beta.bzflag.bz |
| 18:49.44 | JeffM2501 | donny_baker, why? |
| 18:49.48 | a_meteorite | I looked at enet, I liked it a lot. |
| 18:49.53 | JeffM2501 | enet is simple |
| 18:49.58 | JeffM2501 | tho low on features |
| 18:49.58 | Erroneous | stl containers are generally more expensive...since stuff turns into function calls, for one, and since usually you end up using algorithms rather than indices to find data |
| 18:50.00 | donny_baker | JeffM2501: for the favorites functionality |
| 18:50.01 | a_meteorite | yeah |
| 18:50.01 | JeffM2501 | raknet has more features |
| 18:50.13 | JeffM2501 | donny_baker, and you can't build? |
| 18:50.33 | donny_baker | could, if I set it up, just thought I would ask |
| 18:50.38 | JeffM2501 | I'd rather not |
| 18:50.41 | donny_baker | ok |
| 18:50.57 | Erroneous | and some of the most convenient features of stl containers (i.e. dynamic allocation) are some of the heaviest performance penalties |
| 18:51.08 | JeffM2501 | it's suposed to be dead, I' breaking my own rules enough puting api changes in it |
| 18:51.22 | donny_baker | hehe... not a problem :) |
| 18:54.14 | *** join/#bzflag jwir3 (i=joh03135@pepper.itlabs.umn.edu) |
| 18:55.04 | TheRedBaron | ~bribe JeffM2501 with cake |
| 18:55.24 | ibot | ACTION slaps theredbaron and calls the cops to turn in theredbaron for trying to bribe JeffM2501 with cake |
| 18:55.25 | JeffM2501 | that just makes me not want to do it even more |
| 18:55.45 | TheRedBaron | hrm, that backfired immensely |
| 18:55.56 | JeffM2501 | worked frine from my POV |
| 18:56.12 | a_meteorite | ooh, yeah, raknet is pretty nice |
| 18:57.03 | Erroneous | KTL: if you see anything in bzflag where we do X near an stl container (like copying vector counts into temp variables) even though Y would be simpler, the reason is probably speed. or else someone was drunk/incompetent/sleep deprived/etc. feel free to ask. I'm assuming that you aren't aware of a lot of the performance implications...might be a bad assumption, but it's usually the case... |
| 18:57.05 | Erroneous | ...for people with a strong javaish background. |
| 18:57.37 | *** join/#bzflag Blue_Eyes (n=Blue@host17-218-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 19:00.06 | Erroneous | careful about using examples from bz, remember the comment about drunk/incompotent/sleep deprived...there's lots of that in therer :) |
| 19:00.29 | KTL | incompetent ? :) |
| 19:00.54 | KTL | you do look at what patches from outsiders look like i hope? |
| 19:01.02 | KTL | :D |
| 19:02.08 | Erroneous | KTL: in order not to rag on anybody else, I'll use myself as an example...I think I had barely a couple thousand lines of c experience (and virtually no c++) when I started committing |
| 19:02.24 | Erroneous | and yes, we do review patches |
| 19:04.47 | jwir3 | I patch reviews |
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| 19:06.27 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v tupone_laptop] by ChanServ |
| 19:10.44 | a_meteorite | hmm, is raknet's license even compatible with the lgpl? it's under cc-attribution-noncommercial ( http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/2.5/ ) |
| 19:10.49 | *** join/#bzflag moriah (i=d8ada652@gateway/web/cgi-irc/zeebrothers.net/x-eb04bc53bd39ba78) |
| 19:11.07 | *** part/#bzflag moriah (i=d8ada652@gateway/web/cgi-irc/zeebrothers.net/x-eb04bc53bd39ba78) |
| 19:11.22 | a_meteorite | cause the lgpl allows selling... and the cc license doesn't |
| 19:14.27 | Erroneous | lgpl is not gpl, it can be linked with non-free code |
| 19:15.42 | a_meteorite | ah |
| 19:15.44 | Erroneous | not that we would |
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| 19:33.34 | jwir3 | hey tupone_laptop |
| 19:33.44 | tupone_laptop | hi |
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| 19:50.41 | brlcad | Erroneous: so long as it's not patent-encumbered ;) |
| 19:51.09 | purple_cow | JeffM2501: what's this about "not more than one branch"? |
| 19:53.19 | JeffM2501 | they don't overlap |
| 19:53.54 | JeffM2501 | so they should be able to work in one branch so they can have to deal with others' changes and merges and stuff. |
| 19:54.52 | *** join/#bzflag LongDon (n=LongDon@dialin-213-170-173-081.ewetel.net) |
| 20:05.04 | purple_cow | er |
| 20:05.21 | JeffM2501 | you think they should have there own branches for each one? |
| 20:05.25 | purple_cow | we probably want to be able to merge one person's stuff to trunk |
| 20:05.37 | JeffM2501 | true |
| 20:05.49 | purple_cow | brlcad sez we'll have svn by then |
| 20:05.52 | JeffM2501 | tho many of them are somewhatexteranl |
| 20:05.57 | purple_cow | which makes branches both easy and cheap |
| 20:06.07 | Erroneous | hm, he says that huh? :) |
| 20:06.07 | JeffM2501 | inddeed |
| 20:06.21 | JeffM2501 | purple_cow, you want to do the conversion? |
| 20:06.27 | JeffM2501 | you ARE also a project admin ;) |
| 20:06.39 | a_meteorite | woot svn |
| 20:06.47 | JeffM2501 | techicnaly you are our "sires" |
| 20:07.00 | purple_cow | our what? |
| 20:07.15 | JeffM2501 | CRS->Tim -> purple cow ->me/brlcad |
| 20:07.19 | Erroneous | I think he was saying "who's your daddy" |
| 20:07.23 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 20:07.39 | JeffM2501 | he who gave us our powers |
| 20:07.43 | purple_cow | hehe |
| 20:08.05 | JeffM2501 | everyone is cool with it, it just has to be done |
| 20:08.12 | JeffM2501 | and the notifications setup |
| 20:08.46 | purple_cow | JeffM2501: sure, I can do that |
| 20:08.52 | *** join/#bzflag ATD_ (n=a_temp_d@about/essy/alarming/a-temp-dist) |
| 20:08.59 | JeffM2501 | I don't think it needs any real setup on bzflag.bz |
| 20:09.13 | purple_cow | setup on bzflag.bz? |
| 20:09.14 | JeffM2501 | so it's all just sf work, and a notice on the mainpage for everyone to swap :) |
| 20:09.34 | JeffM2501 | I dont' think there is anyting on the bzflag.bz server that is automaticly pulling from cvs |
| 20:09.37 | JeffM2501 | that would have to beupdated |
| 20:09.53 | purple_cow | oh, ok |
| 20:09.59 | purple_cow | you weren't suggesting we move the repository there |
| 20:10.04 | JeffM2501 | no no no |
| 20:10.55 | *** join/#bzflag Links2004[Links] (n=Links200@mnhm-590da6fa.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 20:10.55 | JeffM2501 | just any links we have now to CVS that may need to be updated from external servers |
| 20:10.55 | purple_cow | bbiab |
| 20:10.55 | JeffM2501 | and the mailing list and CIA are it as far as I know |
| 20:10.56 | blast007 | masterban? |
| 20:11.07 | JeffM2501 | wasn't ever set up automatic |
| 20:11.12 | JeffM2501 | I manualy copy it |
| 20:11.16 | blast007 | oh |
| 20:11.24 | JeffM2501 | that is something to check tho |
| 20:11.31 | JeffM2501 | to see if we CAN automate it |
| 20:12.06 | a_meteorite | make masterban at m.b.o. a php script that downloads it from a url? (cvs/svn checkout) |
| 20:12.23 | a_meteorite | or even a cron script that just downloads the file would make it easy |
| 20:12.40 | JeffM2501 | masteban is hosted by SF, not mybo |
| 20:12.45 | a_meteorite | ah |
| 20:12.50 | JeffM2501 | if I moved it, I'd move it into the list. |
| 20:13.22 | JeffM2501 | since we have to contact the list to auth, we'd just send ip/hostmask, and it can tell the game server if it's masterbaned as well |
| 20:13.34 | JeffM2501 | so a new return code TOKEN_HELL_NO |
| 20:13.39 | Thumper_ | JeffM2501: brlcad said something recently that he syncs the masterban every 10 minutes or something from CVS |
| 20:13.46 | a_meteorite | heh |
| 20:13.51 | JeffM2501 | Thumper_, ahh |
| 20:13.54 | Thumper_ | so it's supposed to pick up new commits |
| 20:13.56 | JeffM2501 | ok, well we can upate that then |
| 20:14.16 | JeffM2501 | that should be as easy as just changing the command called |
| 20:14.42 | Thumper_ | should be :) |
| 20:14.46 | JeffM2501 | and that is on SF, where the cow has full access, I wasn't sure what level of account he had at bz.bz |
| 20:26.20 | brlcad | Thumper_: it's every hour |
| 20:26.36 | brlcad | sourceforge won't allow any more frequently via cron |
| 20:27.02 | JeffM2501 | is there anyway to have some sort of special rule that runs when a file is updated? |
| 20:27.04 | brlcad | though I could probably finagle something remote more frequently, at risk of getting blocked |
| 20:27.43 | JeffM2501 | just update when it changes or something |
| 20:27.49 | brlcad | Erroneous: yes, I says that :) |
| 20:28.05 | Erroneous | brlcad: good to hear |
| 20:28.12 | brlcad | it's just not been a priority, then gsoc deadlines and whatall |
| 20:28.19 | Erroneous | brlcad: I heard something about logging too... :P |
| 20:28.42 | brlcad | that's a quite different form of procrastination :) |
| 20:29.07 | Erroneous | hehe |
| 20:29.41 | brlcad | or if cow wants to do the deed, I isn't going to stoppage |
| 20:30.09 | JeffM2501 | I say use the cow while we got him :) |
| 20:34.43 | JeffM2501 | only in soviet rusia |
| 20:34.47 | *** join/#bzflag Killer123 (n=5ac8f8c3@bz.bzflag.bz) |
| 20:34.54 | Killer123 | hello |
| 20:35.05 | JeffM2501 | hello |
| 20:35.05 | Killer123 | can anyone tell me is there a way to test my server? |
| 20:35.13 | JeffM2501 | connect to it? |
| 20:35.22 | Killer123 | yeah but for the public |
| 20:35.31 | JeffM2501 | have someone connect to it |
| 20:35.44 | Killer123 | can you use the ibot? |
| 20:35.52 | JeffM2501 | it won't do a full connection |
| 20:35.54 | JeffM2501 | but yes |
| 20:35.58 | JeffM2501 | bzfquery |
| 20:36.03 | Killer123 | cheers |
| 20:36.08 | JeffM2501 | /msg ibot bzfquery yourserver:port |
| 20:36.14 | Killer123 | bzfquery bzserve.game-host.org:5154 |
| 20:36.15 | JeffM2501 | IIRC |
| 20:36.20 | JeffM2501 | you have to tell the bot to do it |
| 20:36.49 | Killer123 | ok |
| 20:37.46 | a_meteorite | ~bzfquery bzserve.game-host.org:5154 |
| 20:37.46 | donny_baker | I connected just fine |
| 20:39.43 | Killer123 | thanks for your help |
| 20:39.43 | Killer123 | bye |
| 20:40.24 | ts | ~bzflist |
| 20:40.46 | ts | ~bzfquery bzflag.ziodara.net:5154 |
| 20:43.35 | ts | TimRiker: ibot does not show the player count of servers using cvs head correctly. In game client the player count is correct. |
| 20:44.31 | *** part/#bzflag donny_baker (n=donny_ba@about/essy/vvvvv/donnybaker) |
| 20:47.05 | JeffM2501 | the bot hasn't been updated for the new proto |
| 20:47.09 | JeffM2501 | that usualyhappens after release |
| 20:48.15 | TimRiker | ts: patches welcome |
| 20:49.54 | JeffM2501 | TimRiker, is the bzflag ibot code built into the infobot core direclty? or some sort of external module that is loaded/merged in? |
| 20:50.13 | TheRedBaron | ~pw |
| 20:50.27 | ibot | somebody said patches welcome was a common response by maintainers of Open Source products. It's roughly means "We don't have much time on our hands, so if you write that feature and send it to us we will likely roll it in. If you don't have the time to write it, we don't either. Stop asking for it." |
| 20:50.38 | JeffM2501 | yeah we know TheRedBaron thanks. |
| 20:53.58 | *** join/#bzflag TD-Linux (n=TD-Linux@about/essy/indecisive/TD-Linux) |
| 21:02.14 | ts | TimRiker: Heh, I don't even know whether ibot is open source |
| 21:03.36 | JeffM2501 | it is |
| 21:03.39 | JeffM2501 | infobot |
| 21:03.51 | JeffM2501 | or blootbot, don't know what name stuck :) |
| 21:07.10 | ts | it's so strange..2 servers have obs and 1 is showed with 8 players, the other one with 48 players. Like team configuration of server is involved. |
| 21:07.33 | *** join/#bzflag cosmol (n=dave@71.86.121.200) |
| 21:07.39 | brlcad | DTRemenak i assigned you just temporary, just to let them know that he's also on our list |
| 21:08.27 | Erroneous | heh, ok |
| 21:09.14 | Erroneous | we should probably get together with them and him and discuss it |
| 21:09.59 | brlcad | i had already discussed with him briefly after he submitted |
| 21:10.04 | brlcad | he let me know about the TP submission |
| 21:10.16 | Erroneous | ok |
| 21:10.25 | Erroneous | he have any preference? |
| 21:10.27 | brlcad | and I told him then that he's probably going to be in our running easily |
| 21:10.35 | brlcad | he seemed to prefer bz at the time |
| 21:11.07 | brlcad | but then they might be trying to sway him with gifts and promises of glory |
| 21:11.33 | Erroneous | hehe |
| 21:11.41 | brlcad | "elongation guaranteed, satisfy your every desire, buy now!" |
| 21:12.11 | Erroneous | hey, we have elongation too...just look at the shots in 2.1 ;) |
| 21:12.57 | JeffM2501 | GM was a miniwang for a while |
| 21:14.29 | brlcad | hehe |
| 21:14.32 | TD-Linux | what does the latest GM look like? still that bitty teardrop? |
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| 21:16.04 | TimRiker | JeffM2501: there is a perl module in blootbot/src/Modules/BZFlag.pl |
| 21:16.36 | TD-Linux | well, when I looked at the source, it was a pretty lame teardrop made with two trifans, but still :) |
| 21:16.42 | TimRiker | ts: ibot is a blootbot. and yes it's open source. |
| 21:16.45 | TimRiker | ibot: ibot |
| 21:16.46 | ibot | hmm... ibot is a blootbot written in perl run by TimRiker on his server. logs on http://ibot.rikers.org/<chan>/ , ibot, jbot, apt are all the same process. It uses sqlite, but mysql or other SQL storage is also supported. |
| 21:16.53 | TimRiker | ibot: blootbot |
| 21:16.55 | ibot | from memory, blootbot is an IRC bot written in perl descended from infobot. Hosted on SF. Patches welcome, submit on SF or mailto:Tim@Rikers.org, or http://blootbot.sourceforge.net/ , I am a blootbot |
| 21:16.55 | JeffM2501 | TimRiker, should we keep a copy in bz tree in misc so we can keep it updated? |
| 21:17.06 | JeffM2501 | then those that have commit access to bz can just update |
| 21:17.11 | JeffM2501 | like ts there ;) |
| 21:17.13 | JeffM2501 | no patches needed |
| 21:17.48 | *** part/#bzflag TheRedBaron (n=kalen@fl-71-49-1-173.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 21:17.57 | TimRiker | heh. if anyone is interested in fixing and _testing_ it. they will need the blootbot sources. |
| 21:18.49 | JeffM2501 | thankfully those are freely avaialable :) |
| 21:19.14 | TimRiker | yes. and so since They(tm) tested it there, generating a patch is easy. |
| 21:19.37 | TimRiker | and I'd likely add any interested parties to the blootbot project anyway. |
| 21:19.58 | TimRiker | blootbot has moved to svn by the way. |
| 21:29.32 | CIA-17 | BZFlag: 03atupone 07v2_0_cs_branch * 10bzflag/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Getting material from texture name |
| 21:45.40 | *** join/#bzflag Hannibal (n=Hannibal@pool-71-113-209-249.herntx.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
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| 21:46.37 | CIA-17 | BZFlag: 03atupone 07v2_0_cs_branch * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/SceneBuilder.cxx: |
| 21:46.37 | CIA-17 | BZFlag: Reverting most of the changes, as they are now done at lower level. |
| 21:46.37 | CIA-17 | BZFlag: Pyramids are lost. Hope they emerge soon |
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| 21:56.47 | romfis | menotume??? |
| 21:59.47 | SportChick | romfis!!!! |
| 22:00.15 | romfis | SC!!! |
| 22:00.36 | SportChick | wie gehts?! |
| 22:00.50 | romfis | gut |
| 22:00.54 | romfis | good |
| 22:01.05 | romfis | i have what fpr meno! :P |
| 22:01.27 | romfis | fpr - for |
| 22:02.10 | SportChick | oh? |
| 22:02.15 | SportChick | ~lart menotume |
| 22:02.15 | ibot | stabs menotume |
| 22:02.23 | romfis | can you that? http://pics.bzleague.com/ |
| 22:02.25 | SportChick | romfis: er ist tot |
| 22:02.32 | romfis | LoL SC |
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| 22:03.15 | SportChick | romfis: ich sehe http://pics.bzleague.com |
| 22:03.18 | SportChick | warum? |
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| 22:03.26 | romfis | i made a new version |
| 22:03.53 | SportChick | wo? |
| 22:04.00 | romfis | hihi |
| 22:04.12 | *** join/#bzflag me1 (n=mkumykov@pool-71-184-81-71.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 22:04.25 | SportChick | romfis: wo ist die neue version? :p |
| 22:04.32 | romfis | http://tankers.bzflag.eu/ |
| 22:04.34 | romfis | here |
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| 22:05.11 | SportChick | romfis: hehe |
| 22:05.23 | romfis | good? |
| 22:05.28 | romfis | or bad? |
| 22:05.38 | romfis | the version and style |
| 22:07.24 | SportChick | good, but all the pictures need to be moved |
| 22:07.40 | romfis | and see T42 team... |
| 22:08.19 | romfis | moved to? |
| 22:08.45 | SportChick | oh, just many of the players have changed teams :) |
| 22:09.02 | SportChick | hehe |
| 22:09.04 | SportChick | ~romfis++ |
| 22:09.11 | *** part/#bzflag me1 (n=mkumykov@pool-71-184-81-71.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 22:09.22 | romfis | yes, but i can change, in future |
| 22:09.47 | romfis | and my new pic is on T42 :P |
| 22:12.22 | romfis | SC... greetings from berniebee...! |
| 22:12.55 | SportChick | BERNIE!! |
| 22:12.55 | SportChick | romfis: tell him to submit HIS photo :) |
| 22:12.55 | romfis | is on brad58 |
| 22:13.01 | SportChick | romfis: I have a broken shoulder :( |
| 22:13.11 | SportChick | ich kann spielen nicht |
| 22:13.12 | romfis | ok |
| 22:13.25 | romfis | i can HIX photo questions |
| 22:13.33 | romfis | *HIS |
| 22:15.23 | romfis | ok i going of here form IRC |
| 22:15.30 | romfis | on ICQ i online ;) |
| 22:15.35 | romfis | or MSN |
| 22:15.38 | romfis | bye |
| 22:15.43 | romfis | and all |
| 22:15.45 | romfis | ;) |
| 22:18.58 | SportChick | ciao romfis |
| 22:19.04 | SportChick | oder tschuess |
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