| 00:00.33 | JeffM2501 | and a 7 inch LCD touchscreen |
| 00:00.39 | Ice_Wewe | Ahhh, only 60 C now |
| 00:00.55 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, ya think |
| 00:00.55 | TD-Linux | how do you keep your P4 at 60 degrees? |
| 00:01.06 | TD-Linux | mine sometimes goes to 75 degrees |
| 00:01.13 | Ice_Wewe | TD-Linux: I transcode DVDs for my PSP :) |
| 00:01.20 | JeffM2501 | wow those run hot |
| 00:01.21 | blast007 | TD-Linux: you pour water on them |
| 00:01.44 | Ice_Wewe | TD-Linux: I am going to bite the head off the of UPS guy when he comes tomorrow... he was supposed to delvier my 1Gb Memory Stick Duo a week ago... |
| 00:01.50 | *** join/#bzflag SC (n=SportChi@ca-redbch-cuda1-c3b-a-40.stmnca.adelphia.net) |
| 00:01.58 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: I have a load of 6.3! |
| 00:02.05 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: I think this is normal |
| 00:02.09 | TD-Linux | I have a DS, PSP was too expensive, and I didn't like any games |
| 00:02.13 | JeffM2501 | it could be but wow |
| 00:02.13 | JeffM2501 | hot |
| 00:02.24 | JeffM2501 | my systems hang at like 40-45 |
| 00:02.28 | JeffM2501 | I wory at 50 |
| 00:02.31 | TD-Linux | I have a P4 550, 3.4GHz HT |
| 00:02.43 | TD-Linux | regularily goes to 70 degrees C during BZFLag |
| 00:02.43 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, I'm sorry |
| 00:02.52 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: 50 idle, or max load (please remember that this is stock with no OC) |
| 00:03.08 | TD-Linux | Ice_Wewe: What processor exactly? |
| 00:03.09 | JeffM2501 | when playing City of Heros |
| 00:03.13 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: it does have HyperThreading.. which it is using |
| 00:03.13 | JeffM2501 | 100%cpu |
| 00:03.28 | Ice_Wewe | TD-Linux: Intel Socket 478 3Ghz (HT) |
| 00:03.31 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, yeah I know, and I'm sorry |
| 00:03.35 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: yes |
| 00:04.00 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: Idle, or max load? Mine at idle is 38/40 C |
| 00:04.04 | JeffM2501 | max load |
| 00:04.12 | Ice_Wewe | !punch TD-Linux |
| 00:04.12 | TheLastSpartan | Ice_Wewe: Wuo de ma! |
| 00:04.17 | TD-Linux | my board sensors near the processor reach 66 degrees celcius |
| 00:04.28 | JeffM2501 | gotta love old intel |
| 00:04.45 | TD-Linux | what? |
| 00:04.47 | JeffM2501 | they are good CPUs |
| 00:04.47 | TD-Linux | why? |
| 00:04.50 | JeffM2501 | nothing to slap anyone over |
| 00:04.56 | JeffM2501 | nice good dual core 4800 |
| 00:04.58 | blast007 | when my CPU fan was dying in my desktop, the CPU got up to 84C before I noticed it ;) |
| 00:04.59 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: P3, or P4? |
| 00:05.04 | TD-Linux | ~lart Ice_Wewe's P4s |
| 00:05.10 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, AMD |
| 00:05.12 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: *pout* |
| 00:05.16 | JeffM2501 | sorry TD-Linux, AMD |
| 00:05.20 | Ice_Wewe | rofl |
| 00:05.22 | JeffM2501 | I don't play the intel game |
| 00:05.46 | JeffM2501 | it costs too much, and you don't get much out of it |
| 00:05.55 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: I'll sell you mine, better yet, trade you for one of those nice AMD 64 machines... *drool* |
| 00:06.04 | TD-Linux | ~lart Pentium D 840 |
| 00:06.06 | JeffM2501 | why would I want a P4? |
| 00:06.18 | purple_cow | used to be that getting intel meant that you never had to worry about your cpu catching on fire, but amd has fixed most of those problems |
| 00:06.25 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: wait, you were telling me not 2 days ago to not get an AMD 64 because all linux OSs were 'broken' on 64 |
| 00:06.36 | Ice_Wewe | roflmao... |
| 00:06.39 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, I never said such a thing |
| 00:06.48 | TD-Linux | ~roflmao |
| 00:06.50 | ibot | roflmao is, like, rolling on the floor laughing my arse off, or painful |
| 00:06.50 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: yes you did |
| 00:06.52 | JeffM2501 | 2 days ago I was playing city of heros |
| 00:07.01 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: 3? |
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| 00:07.21 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, what you proably saw, was somone sayiing last mont that the linux drivers for the NForce line of motherboards were "iffy" |
| 00:07.26 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: load = 7.3 |
| 00:07.37 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, what? |
| 00:07.56 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: thats my current load... and my CPU is at a cool 62 C |
| 00:08.02 | Ice_Wewe | oh wait, 63 |
| 00:08.04 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, that's freaking hot |
| 00:08.08 | JeffM2501 | I aleart at 55 |
| 00:08.19 | JeffM2501 | cruse is like 38-40 |
| 00:08.21 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: thats what happens when your an idiot and don't go with the stock heatsync |
| 00:08.44 | JeffM2501 | hey if your an idiot that's your problem |
| 00:08.53 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: roflmao, maybe |
| 00:08.58 | JeffM2501 | I'm using stock fan |
| 00:09.06 | JeffM2501 | came with the retail CPU |
| 00:09.11 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: hey is it possible that the sensor is reporting the temp as 10 C hotter than it is? |
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| 00:09.15 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 00:09.26 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, I dono, is your stuff busted. |
| 00:09.30 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: which would make sence since I haven't had anything blowup yet |
| 00:09.36 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: dunno |
| 00:10.11 | JeffM2501 | or just P4's run hella lot hoter |
| 00:10.17 | JeffM2501 | they suck the power to be sure |
| 00:10.38 | Ice_Wewe | ~lart TD-Linux's ideals |
| 00:10.39 | purple_cow | 72C isn't super hot for a CPU... |
| 00:10.54 | TD-Linux | it isn't? |
| 00:11.07 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: does it make sence that my CPU would be running 10 C hotter than room temp with no load |
| 00:11.32 | JeffM2501 | I dono |
| 00:11.32 | TD-Linux | what if I pour sand inside my case and it comes out the ventilation holes as a liquid? |
| 00:11.39 | JeffM2501 | I'm no CPU guru |
| 00:11.55 | JeffM2501 | I just know that paying 100$ more for a CPU is prety stupid |
| 00:11.56 | Ice_Wewe | brb, aparntally my evil twin forgot to do the dishes |
| 00:12.00 | purple_cow | Ice_Wewe: your room temperature is 53C? |
| 00:12.13 | Ice_Wewe | ~lart purple_cow |
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| 00:23.16 | *** topic/#bzflag is http://BZFlag.org/ || http://my.BZFlag.org/bb/ || http://my.BZFlag.org/ || http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/BZFlag || http://BZFlag.org/wiki/GettingHelp || http://BZFlag.org/wiki/Download || try #bzchat if you just want to talk || paste errors http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/ |
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| 00:25.56 | Ice_Wewe | reconfigured sensors, no change |
| 00:26.04 | blast007 | http://www.heatsink-guide.com/content.php?content=maxtemp.shtml |
| 00:26.40 | Ice_Wewe | blast007: what bar is closest to your house, I need to buy you a round... |
| 00:26.53 | blast007 | heh |
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| 01:20.33 | jomojo | i am having a bit of fun i have loaded silvercat 5154 with 35 geno flags with a 20 shot limit |
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| 01:33.19 | TD-Linux | cool, I got to try this |
| 01:34.33 | TD-Linux | I see 3 shots and a few geno |
| 01:35.18 | TD-Linux | wait, tons of geno and 20 shot limit! |
| 01:35.19 | TD-Linux | cool; |
| 01:37.50 | TD-Linux | silvercat is nuts |
| 01:38.06 | TD-Linux | a geno hit every 3 seconds |
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| 01:49.10 | flickboy | yo |
| 01:50.01 | blast007 | hello :) |
| 01:50.17 | flickboy | everyone's playing i guess |
| 01:50.24 | TD-Linux | yes |
| 01:50.30 | TD-Linux | did you see what silvercat was like? |
| 01:50.37 | flickboy | lots of geno? |
| 01:50.40 | TD-Linux | here is a quote by jomojo earlier in IRC: |
| 01:50.47 | TD-Linux | jomojo i am having a bit of fun i have loaded silvercat 5154 with 35 geno flags with a 20 shot limit |
| 01:51.00 | TD-Linux | jomojo said that |
| 01:51.32 | flickboy | that's fine for a test server I guess |
| 01:52.42 | TD-Linux | it's hard to pass with that s |
| 01:53.01 | orange | good :-) |
| 01:53.23 | Aribeth | hi orange |
| 01:53.23 | TD-Linux | it's supposed to be that way? |
| 01:53.30 | TD-Linux | how do you pass with the S? |
| 01:53.34 | TD-Linux | jump and drop? |
| 01:53.42 | TD-Linux | or is it you ahve to be under a slant? |
| 01:53.53 | TD-Linux | I'm playing there nwo |
| 01:54.02 | orange | hi aribeth, everyone |
| 01:54.15 | orange | TD-Linux, just get under it and drop |
| 01:54.20 | orange | I've never had any trouble, myself |
| 01:55.08 | flickboy | blech |
| 01:55.10 | TD-Linux | figured it out, has to be precisely under the S |
| 01:55.21 | TD-Linux | I always drop it in the middle of one of the curves |
| 01:55.34 | TD-Linux | I like MG there |
| 01:57.08 | TD-Linux | yawn |
| 01:57.15 | TD-Linux | where is an active channel? |
| 01:57.18 | flickboy | time for dinner and 2 |
| 01:57.26 | TD-Linux | at 9 PM? :P |
| 01:57.33 | flickboy | yeah, at 9 pm |
| 01:57.41 | TD-Linux | ;) |
| 01:57.46 | flickboy | didn't get to eat during class |
| 01:57.56 | TD-Linux | oh, it really is 9 PM where you are? |
| 01:58.02 | flickboy | yeah central time |
| 01:58.23 | TD-Linux | you are a lazy CGI:IRC user! |
| 01:58.26 | TD-Linux | :P |
| 01:58.30 | flickboy | yes, yes I am |
| 01:58.39 | TD-Linux | tried to /whois you to get your location |
| 01:59.12 | flickboy | ha, it says i'm in germany |
| 01:59.23 | TD-Linux | no it dosen't |
| 01:59.30 | TD-Linux | that's where the CGI:IRC server is |
| 02:00.46 | blast007 | http://my.box86.info:84/hexdec.php?hex=43a7d0e4 |
| 02:01.01 | flickboy | nice |
| 02:01.03 | flickboy | yeah i see it |
| 02:01.24 | flickboy | bc is quicker if you set ibase=16 |
| 02:01.50 | TD-Linux | illinois? |
| 02:01.54 | flickboy | yeah |
| 02:02.09 | TD-Linux | mine is a bit more obvious ;) |
| 02:02.16 | flickboy | you're minnesota? |
| 02:02.35 | TD-Linux | yes |
| 02:02.38 | TD-Linux | guess the city |
| 02:02.55 | TD-Linux | do you know it? |
| 02:03.06 | TD-Linux | take a wild guess |
| 02:03.16 | flickboy | looks like rochester |
| 02:03.18 | blast007 | Rochester, Minnesota (at least your ISP is) |
| 02:03.18 | TD-Linux | yes |
| 02:03.57 | TD-Linux | you win a million dollars (minus a $2000000 shipping & handling fee) |
| 02:04.02 | flickboy | yuck, charter |
| 02:04.08 | TD-Linux | why? |
| 02:04.11 | TD-Linux | they are good here |
| 02:04.16 | TD-Linux | 1.5mbps cable\ |
| 02:04.20 | flickboy | I had a bad experience with them |
| 02:04.27 | TD-Linux | what did they do? |
| 02:04.35 | blast007 | is 1.5 their fast service? |
| 02:04.36 | flickboy | very slow, bad customer service |
| 02:04.53 | flickboy | frequent outages |
| 02:05.11 | TD-Linux | hmm... we had intermittent problems, and we got our cable modem replaced and our line to our house rewired |
| 02:05.23 | TD-Linux | it's all fine now |
| 02:05.37 | flickboy | lessee |
| 02:05.39 | TD-Linux | I think they now offer a 6 mbps service |
| 02:06.06 | blast007 | ah, cool |
| 02:06.11 | TD-Linux | ours is a special plan through IBM, we get the 'fastest speed', defined as 1.5mbps |
| 02:06.19 | blast007 | the 'fast' one here is 3mbps/384kbps |
| 02:06.29 | blast007 | the other one is 384kbps/128kbps |
| 02:06.37 | TD-Linux | I ran a test, and it looks like I get 1.5mbps, meaning they probably upgraded us to 3mbps ;) |
| 02:06.56 | TD-Linux | it's impossible to get to your actual speed they sell you! ;) |
| 02:07.17 | blast007 | I can get close to it, at least according to their speed test |
| 02:07.25 | blast007 | (small town) |
| 02:07.32 | TD-Linux | (medium town) |
| 02:07.53 | flickboy | Chicago |
| 02:07.56 | flickboy | (big town) |
| 02:08.26 | TD-Linux | madison was medium, I thought |
| 02:08.28 | TD-Linux | oh well |
| 02:08.43 | blast007 | well, I'm not _in_ madison |
| 02:08.48 | TD-Linux | oh |
| 02:09.00 | TD-Linux | suburb? |
| 02:09.09 | blast007 | 40 minutes from it, in fact |
| 02:09.12 | TD-Linux | oh |
| 02:09.27 | TD-Linux | oh |
| 02:09.41 | TD-Linux | it's already 9:10 PM here |
| 02:10.01 | TD-Linux | as it is for both of you, I guess |
| 02:10.15 | blast007 | yup |
| 02:10.37 | flickboy | yeah |
| 02:10.56 | flickboy | i guess my bud is about to get on |
| 02:11.02 | flickboy | i'm going to check, then get dinner |
| 02:11.19 | TD-Linux | g2g |
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| 02:11.23 | TD-Linux | I must sleep |
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| 03:48.17 | SportChick | oops |
| 03:49.16 | durt | a bike? |
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| 04:18.40 | jomojo | is there a patch that will grant certain observers the ability to see all conversations |
| 04:18.56 | jomojo | like a permission i can set up for top admins or whatever |
| 04:19.57 | orange | I think that would be good to have at least on replay servers |
| 04:20.40 | orange | like looking through the logs, but synchronized with action |
| 04:31.47 | trepan | including p2p msgs? (and no, but easy to setup) |
| 04:34.55 | orange | tough call trepan, but part of this would need to have p2p, yeah |
| 04:35.02 | orange | the ethical questions are many |
| 04:35.46 | JBdiGriz | There's no ethical question. It's using the server to pass messages. Notification is the only ethical requirement. |
| 04:35.59 | trepan | a public key enc. msg'ing system would cure it ;) |
| 04:36.45 | JBdiGriz | Not if it still passes through the server. Unless we add the capability to use keys at the endpoints. |
| 04:37.44 | trepan | JBdiGriz: what do you think i mean? |
| 04:38.43 | JBdiGriz | The server could negotiate keys. The end clients don't communicate with each other currently. |
| 04:39.24 | trepan | JBdiGriz: what other mechanism would you possibly think i was refering to? |
| 04:40.38 | JBdiGriz | client negotiates key with server. message is encrypted by client, decrypted by server, re-encrypted by server, decrypted by target client. |
| 04:40.57 | JBdiGriz | Don't laugh, I've seen people use it as a "secure" solution. |
| 04:41.27 | trepan | luckily, my IQ is over 60; thanks for assuming otherwise |
| 04:41.48 | JBdiGriz | Some very smart people don't understand security. |
| 04:42.34 | trepan | those very smart should then keep their mouths shut on the topic |
| 04:42.47 | trepan | otherwise, i wouldn't lump them into the smart category |
| 04:43.22 | JBdiGriz | I'll let you try to explain it to them. I'll keep charging people a lot of money instead. :) |
| 04:45.15 | trepan | back on topic: the information is already available in logs, but few servers actively notify their clients of the fact (or maybe most of the servers aren't logging, i dunno) |
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| 07:10.52 | jomojo | trepan: logs on silvercat are becoming easier to search with the install of grep |
| 07:11.07 | jomojo | but still not easy.. it would be great to see all while in replay |
| 07:14.50 | ruskie | :) |
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| 09:14.15 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: 03trepan * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/CmdLineOptions.cxx: remove comma |
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| 10:41.51 | Tupone | learner: :) |
| 10:54.31 | learner | ciao |
| 10:54.54 | Tupone | eek, early there :) |
| 10:55.00 | learner | yeah :( |
| 10:55.09 | _Manu_ | learner, the never sleeping man :) |
| 10:55.12 | learner | my brain isn't working yet |
| 10:55.24 | Tupone | DTRemenak: are you awake ? |
| 10:57.58 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: 03jujibo * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/BanCommands.cxx: too much rrrrrrs |
| 11:07.54 | _Manu_ | really? /kill is not so important I think |
| 11:12.06 | ToughShooter | I guess I've "/kill"ed a few people too much because I didn't had any sign that it worked... |
| 11:15.05 | _Manu_ | it works.. |
| 11:15.20 | *** join/#bzflag blast007_away (n=blast@24-196-92-143.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) |
| 11:15.32 | _Manu_ | but he must be playing.. not died |
| 11:15.50 | _Manu_ | but he get allways the message, also if he is an observer |
| 11:16.09 | ToughShooter | using /kill "callsign" reason gave me player not found messages |
| 11:16.31 | _Manu_ | then you typing wrong the callsign |
| 11:16.37 | _Manu_ | try to use slots |
| 11:17.17 | _Manu_ | using slots never fails is tha player is connected :) |
| 11:17.20 | ToughShooter | The one in question paused and using a slot had no visible effect |
| 11:17.49 | ToughShooter | Meaning he paused before I tried with a slot |
| 11:18.00 | _Manu_ | never checked it.. there is some conditions where the player can't be killed |
| 11:18.20 | _Manu_ | but be sure he receives the kill message |
| 11:19.14 | _Manu_ | and if he pauses for avoid your kill, just kick him |
| 11:19.14 | ToughShooter | I did a /kill "orange" test and got no player found, too |
| 11:19.43 | _Manu_ | what server version? |
| 11:19.47 | ToughShooter | there was no typo, I'm sure |
| 11:20.04 | ToughShooter | the one on silvercat.tybox.net:5154 |
| 11:21.20 | _Manu_ | and is not protected from being killed? |
| 11:21.45 | ToughShooter | Hmm, orange is protected, AFAIK |
| 11:22.10 | _Manu_ | just it is ;) |
| 11:23.03 | ToughShooter | Why having an error message that doesn't describe the problem? |
| 11:23.14 | _Manu_ | when he is protected.. he and not you receive a message.. |
| 11:23.29 | _Manu_ | yes that's weird |
| 11:23.50 | _Manu_ | you tried orange without the "" ? |
| 11:23.56 | ToughShooter | no |
| 11:24.01 | _Manu_ | try it |
| 11:25.21 | ToughShooter | I'll better set up a local test server from newest CVS and check all combinations there |
| 11:26.01 | _Manu_ | it may works because is the same code for all the commands.. kick, kill, mute, ban... |
| 11:27.00 | _Manu_ | and better use /kill playername reason when simplye callsign.. and /kill "the player name" reason, when compund playername |
| 11:30.36 | jomojo | ToughShooter you can't kill orange onn silvercat |
| 11:30.49 | jomojo | but it should give you a messages saying he is protected |
| 11:33.42 | _Manu_ | jomojo, yes, he can kill orange |
| 11:33.52 | _Manu_ | jomojo, but only playing.. ;-P |
| 11:37.01 | jomojo | _Manu_: no i mean orange is protected on silvercat from being killed along with 6 other owners |
| 11:37.14 | _Manu_ | but if I shoot him... ;) |
| 11:37.25 | jomojo | oh duh |
| 11:37.29 | _Manu_ | you mean /kill I mean kill |
| 11:37.32 | _Manu_ | :) |
| 11:38.02 | _Manu_ | and I knew he was protected.. as all the other admins ;) |
| 11:41.04 | Tupone | :) |
| 11:48.53 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: 03atupone * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/BanCommands.cxx: (log message trimmed) |
| 11:48.53 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: Reverting changes. Peoples was exploiting a bug for shortban. Use 0 instead. |
| 11:48.53 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: Never was a feature as documented in bzfs man. |
| 11:48.53 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: The way is doing was bad as there is no way to discriminate a missing time |
| 11:48.53 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: from a wrong time like in |
| 11:48.54 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: /ban c3po 30f spammming |
| 11:48.56 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: f could be a misstyped letter or 30f is part of the reason |
| 12:00.09 | jomojo | _Manu_: actually only the owner group is protected from /kill admins and cops at silvercat can still be /kill |
| 12:03.33 | _Manu_ | I mean owners :) |
| 12:06.38 | _Manu_ | but the problem wasn't the kill, it was the message not found message |
| 12:06.48 | _Manu_ | :/ |
| 12:06.58 | jomojo | nhmmm |
| 12:07.40 | jomojo | i can /kill just fine.. was toughshooter trying to do something out of the ordinary? |
| 12:08.23 | _Manu_ | he said: /kill "orange" message not working |
| 12:08.27 | _Manu_ | I tested it and works |
| 12:08.36 | _Manu_ | with/without "" |
| 12:10.03 | _Manu_ | it was an old bug.. but iirc you are running the latest or one of the latest cvs versions |
| 12:10.14 | _Manu_ | and it works fine |
| 12:24.55 | *** join/#bzflag mmu_man (i=revol@ALyon-253-1-23-177.w83-205.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
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| 13:05.30 | Tupone | meno meno |
| 13:08.22 | menotume | CTCP Pong |
| 13:12.39 | menotume | DTRemenak: It may be nice to get the new listserver online for more vigorous testing |
| 13:12.52 | menotume | we just need Mr. Tim to copy it over the old one |
| 13:12.57 | DTRemenak | menotume, yes, it might |
| 13:13.29 | menotume | i mean, it's been 'online' for a week or more now - but at a different url |
| 13:15.02 | menotume | that way, the bzfs '-advertise' option could be tested |
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| 14:01.10 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ |
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| 14:17.39 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ |
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| 14:18.39 | Tupone | ~pastebin |
| 14:18.41 | ibot | it has been said that pastebin is a place to paste your stuff without flooding the channel - try http://pastebin.ca/ |
| 14:19.06 | Tupone | are factinfo shared between several channels ? |
| 14:19.33 | DTRemenak | yes |
| 14:19.55 | Tupone | hmm, so we can't change to bzflag.pastebin.ca :( |
| 14:20.14 | DTRemenak | could create a "bzpastebin" factoid |
| 14:20.50 | Tupone | ~bzpastebin is a place to paste your stuff without flooding the channel - try http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/ |
| 14:20.51 | ibot | Tupone: okay |
| 14:20.58 | Tupone | ~bzpastebin |
| 14:20.59 | ibot | hmm... bzpastebin is a place to paste your stuff without flooding the channel - try http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/ |
| 14:21.08 | Tupone | :) |
| 14:21.59 | menotume | ~bzpastebin |
| 14:22.01 | ibot | bzpastebin is probably a place to paste your stuff without flooding the channel, and it archives too. - try http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/ |
| 14:22.07 | Tupone | ~c3po |
| 14:22.08 | ibot | it has been said that c3po is the best jumping bzplayer (by far better then Tupone) |
| 14:22.13 | Tupone | lol |
| 14:22.52 | Tupone | learner was |
| 14:26.32 | ToughShooter | ~brlcad |
| 14:26.33 | ibot | it has been said that brlcad is like a learner wrapped in tofu best served chilled |
| 14:28.31 | *** join/#bzflag mmu_man (i=revol@ALyon-253-1-23-177.w83-205.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 14:39.35 | *** join/#bzflag tango_ (n=nome@adsl-ull-115-119.44-151.net24.it) |
| 15:01.47 | brlcad | huh? :) |
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| 15:19.01 | orange | with a nice chianti? |
| 15:20.44 | Thumper_ | is there a problem with the current CVS source? I get a build error on ListServerConnection.o |
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| 15:25.52 | brlcad | orange: pinot |
| 15:29.35 | orange | fava beans? |
| 15:31.29 | Birdie | pinot? le vin? |
| 15:32.13 | bryjen | hmm |
| 15:32.18 | bryjen | ~brl-cad |
| 15:32.19 | ibot | i heard brl-cad is a powerful constructive solid geometry solid modeling system that includes an interactive geometry editor, ray tracing support for rendering and geometric analysis, network distributed framebuffer support, image and signal-processing tools. |
| 15:33.00 | bryjen | hyphenated. i was wondering why one would wrap software in tofu |
| 15:33.03 | bryjen | ;) |
| 15:35.12 | brlcad | heh |
| 15:41.25 | brlcad | pinot grigio |
| 15:51.22 | brlcad | hehe, http://reebok.com.edgesuite.net/lastexit_terrys_world_dsl.wmv |
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| 16:05.41 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ |
| 16:07.08 | Tupone | hi JeffM2501, did you read my commit on revert ? |
| 16:18.18 | JeffM2501 | no |
| 16:18.21 | JeffM2501 | what did you revert |
| 16:20.45 | Tupone | BanCommand.cxx |
| 16:20.54 | JeffM2501 | what did you change? |
| 16:21.03 | Tupone | I put back my version :) |
| 16:21.07 | JeffM2501 | why? |
| 16:21.40 | Tupone | You can see in the commit . However you basically reverted my fix |
| 16:21.42 | JeffM2501 | what was the "bug" that was being exploited? |
| 16:21.58 | Tupone | a word translated as 0 |
| 16:22.26 | JeffM2501 | no, I added an item that make the reason start one item early |
| 16:22.35 | JeffM2501 | it should have not had the same problem |
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| 16:22.53 | JeffM2501 | but I guess reverting is easyer then understanding code and trying to fix the bug |
| 16:23.08 | JeffM2501 | I didn't revert your code, I changed it slightly |
| 16:23.09 | Tupone | /ban c3po 30m Temp banning How do you interpret? |
| 16:24.13 | Tupone | you think is 30 minute. System accept and instead you ahd a short ban |
| 16:24.20 | Tupone | ahd even |
| 16:24.26 | Tupone | had. cannot type :( |
| 16:25.28 | JeffM2501 | so 30m is not valid for entry? |
| 16:25.39 | brlcad | hehe, there's not many mailing lists where you get to see someone write: If you are missing a butt pad, I have it! |
| 16:25.58 | brlcad | (rowers mailing list) |
| 16:25.59 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, maybe we should revaluate and discuss the feature, perhaps a /shortban |
| 16:26.07 | Tupone | we can add the "m" on the check but now a number alone is ok |
| 16:26.17 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, so M is not valid? |
| 16:26.22 | JeffM2501 | help me out here |
| 16:26.23 | _Manu_ | no |
| 16:26.26 | JeffM2501 | don't asume I can read your mind |
| 16:26.28 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 16:26.34 | _Manu_ | m is not valid, just a number means minutes |
| 16:26.39 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 16:26.40 | Tupone | basically if they want a shortban just put a 0 there |
| 16:26.43 | bryjen | Hours, Weeks, or Days. minutes is assumed with no letter |
| 16:26.51 | JeffM2501 | we need to document that or make a new command |
| 16:26.59 | Tupone | is documented I guess |
| 16:27.05 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, comunication is paramount, few people read the commits |
| 16:27.07 | _Manu_ | it's in the help |
| 16:27.07 | JeffM2501 | you guess? |
| 16:27.09 | _Manu_ | and in the man |
| 16:27.38 | JeffM2501 | does the man say use 0 for the ban time? |
| 16:27.38 | JeffM2501 | and say that the feature has changed |
| 16:27.39 | _Manu_ | 0 means forever.. |
| 16:27.39 | JeffM2501 | even tho the old feature was undocumented |
| 16:27.50 | JeffM2501 | so there is NO way to do a ban of the default ban time |
| 16:27.50 | JeffM2501 | that is not good |
| 16:28.24 | JeffM2501 | we could require the reason to be in "" |
| 16:28.32 | bryjen | the 0 = forever is in the current man. |
| 16:28.34 | Tupone | prolly a /shortban, but then we need to add /shorthostban also, and all variation |
| 16:28.39 | _Manu_ | reason is required in /ban |
| 16:28.52 | brlcad | or make it two commands, one to ban getting a default time and a second command to specify a different time |
| 16:28.53 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, or figure out a way to fix it right, and not just blindly revert code |
| 16:29.06 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:29.10 | bryjen | perhaps an explicit keyword, say forever, required to ban forever |
| 16:29.12 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, that's what I was saying with a /shortban command |
| 16:29.14 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:29.19 | JeffM2501 | -1 could be forever |
| 16:29.24 | brlcad | then you could reajust times on the fly |
| 16:29.30 | _Manu_ | brlcad, a reason is required ;) |
| 16:29.31 | JeffM2501 | or -1 could be default |
| 16:29.37 | JeffM2501 | _Manu_, we know that |
| 16:29.43 | brlcad | _Manu_: i already gave a reason |
| 16:29.49 | JeffM2501 | woudl people get mad if you had to do "" around your reason? |
| 16:29.55 | orange | shouldn't shortban permission just enforce a maximum, and use the same syntax as always |
| 16:29.59 | brlcad | the second would only change the ban time remaining |
| 16:30.00 | bryjen | i don't like magic negative numbers |
| 16:30.08 | trepan | is it currently broken? (the reverted version) |
| 16:30.09 | brlcad | or magic zero numbers |
| 16:30.13 | JeffM2501 | orange, it does that, but many used it also as a default |
| 16:30.17 | orange | ah |
| 16:30.23 | orange | how about not allowing ban to do permabans |
| 16:30.28 | orange | and add /permaban |
| 16:30.34 | orange | as a command and a privilege |
| 16:30.41 | Tupone | orange, with all the variation ? |
| 16:30.42 | JeffM2501 | trepan, currently a "feature" that used to work no longer works. a ban with no time, fails, it used to use the shortban time. |
| 16:30.45 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:31.00 | trepan | JeffM2501: poor command formatting |
| 16:31.06 | trepan | sounds like it's been fixed |
| 16:31.09 | JeffM2501 | trepan, probably |
| 16:31.19 | JeffM2501 | but people used it like that, and complained when it was busted |
| 16:31.24 | JeffM2501 | so it may be a valid use |
| 16:31.32 | Tupone | that feature did not work for design, but just for a bug. It is a bug |
| 16:31.35 | JeffM2501 | that's why we are discussing ways to work it into a good command formating |
| 16:31.42 | trepan | na, people do all kinds of stupid things |
| 16:31.55 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, people use that, who are you to tell them what is right and wrogn? |
| 16:32.01 | JeffM2501 | I see a valid use of it |
| 16:32.09 | JeffM2501 | it has become a 'defacto' feature |
| 16:32.36 | _Manu_ | earlier you can: /ban player capturing own team flag.. and it was parsed as a ban, duration 0 and message: own team flag |
| 16:32.39 | JeffM2501 | if you are going to pull it, then you must tell them specifcly that it does not do that anymore |
| 16:32.44 | JeffM2501 | and what to do instead |
| 16:32.54 | _Manu_ | the first word after the playername was parsed as 0 |
| 16:32.55 | JeffM2501 | at first it was just pulled form them and they had no clue why |
| 16:32.59 | orange | just add two new commands /timeban and /permaban and deprecate the old one with a message |
| 16:33.09 | brlcad | that's why to avoid putting too much behavior into one command (who, why, how long) seems like the crux of the problem and good reason to have two |
| 16:33.24 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, that's why I'm thinking a shortban command that dosn't take a time |
| 16:33.41 | JeffM2501 | so that the command lists can be formalised |
| 16:34.01 | JeffM2501 | but we'd have to make 2 of them shortban and shorthostban |
| 16:34.02 | brlcad | shortban would be some sort of default ban? |
| 16:34.03 | _Manu_ | yes, I also though about addine new short commands for commons success like tking, capturing own team flag, rejoining... |
| 16:34.09 | _Manu_ | s/addine/adding |
| 16:34.13 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, yes, using the default shortban limit |
| 16:34.17 | Tupone | we cannot have all variation of that command we already have /ban /hostban /unban /hostunban /banlist ... |
| 16:34.19 | JeffM2501 | that is how people use it now |
| 16:34.19 | orange | for someone with only shortban privileges, /timeban and /permaban would both work, but would limit to a maximum |
| 16:34.20 | _Manu_ | then no message required |
| 16:34.46 | brlcad | all the host* commands could be merged |
| 16:34.52 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, we can do what ever we want to |
| 16:35.06 | brlcad | there's no technical reason that requires them to be separate |
| 16:35.08 | Tupone | and people should remember all the name. OK |
| 16:35.18 | JeffM2501 | maybe make the ban command be all commonised, and have sub commands |
| 16:35.32 | JeffM2501 | like /ban add "player" time "reason" |
| 16:35.37 | bryjen | the list commands would not need "short" counterparts |
| 16:35.37 | JeffM2501 | and /ban remove "player" |
| 16:35.56 | JeffM2501 | then we could do /ban short "player" reason |
| 16:36.09 | JeffM2501 | the same remove could remove a short and a regular |
| 16:36.42 | Tupone | that could be done even now, just checking the time or the "short" word |
| 16:36.53 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:37.10 | Tupone | gamut ? |
| 16:37.14 | JeffM2501 | so you want to change the current ban command to /bantime ? |
| 16:37.15 | brlcad | spectrum? |
| 16:37.18 | bryjen | range |
| 16:37.19 | JeffM2501 | aka a ban that takes a time? |
| 16:37.24 | brlcad | no |
| 16:37.25 | Tupone | ok |
| 16:37.44 | brlcad | JeffM2501: bantime only works on existing bans, and merely adjusts their ban time |
| 16:37.51 | JeffM2501 | oh |
| 16:38.00 | brlcad | so you could make a ban infinite that wasn't, two minutes to 10, 20 to 0, etc |
| 16:38.01 | orange | can't do that by player name or slot |
| 16:38.12 | JeffM2501 | so how would a ban work then? |
| 16:38.18 | JeffM2501 | what steps would happen? |
| 16:38.24 | brlcad | default ban time |
| 16:38.30 | JeffM2501 | would all bans start as default ban time, then you change em? |
| 16:38.32 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:38.39 | brlcad | right |
| 16:38.45 | JeffM2501 | ehhh |
| 16:38.47 | JeffM2501 | 2 steps |
| 16:38.47 | brlcad | make default non-infinite |
| 16:38.49 | Tupone | that is a proposal ? not the previous |
| 16:38.56 | JeffM2501 | not my personal favorate |
| 16:39.00 | bryjen | that applies an IP or hostname ban? |
| 16:39.07 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, he's just thowing out an idea |
| 16:39.08 | Tupone | s/previous/actual behaviour/ |
| 16:39.14 | brlcad | yes, it also requires no apriori knowledge of ban's format |
| 16:39.22 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, well you tell me the previous behavor CAN'T work |
| 16:39.40 | Tupone | the actual behaviour works |
| 16:39.45 | Tupone | after my revert |
| 16:40.02 | Tupone | I have just to document how to obtain the shortban, if there is a way |
| 16:40.03 | JeffM2501 | but the previous behavor can not |
| 16:40.05 | JeffM2501 | with your method |
| 16:40.40 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, rather then just hack at the code and come up with designs in your head, we are trying to talk about it. |
| 16:40.45 | Tupone | shortban was not in any command, was a privileges of an adminthat limit the time he can ban |
| 16:41.19 | Tupone | I'm not doing any hacking. I'm just saying what I understand from the code |
| 16:41.23 | Tupone | and the doc |
| 16:41.30 | brlcad | alternatively, it could all be collapsed as you say to subcommands on a meta "ban" command, "poll" works that way actually |
| 16:43.22 | brlcad | ipfw style syntax would be sweet |
| 16:43.40 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:43.58 | Tupone | learner cheats ? |
| 16:44.14 | bryjen | a simple fix: make the duration parameter required and reconize the words "short" and "forever" as durations |
| 16:44.25 | brlcad | heh |
| 16:44.32 | brlcad | only when driving cars |
| 16:44.44 | Tupone | ~bryjen++ |
| 16:45.00 | Tupone | it is already required |
| 16:45.14 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, I know you know the code and the doc, I'm saying you don't know how people were actualy USING it |
| 16:45.16 | _Manu_ | duration is actually required.. but we can add for being recognized "short" and "forever" |
| 16:45.25 | brlcad | that makes me look up a freaking manual to issue a command |
| 16:45.28 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, that's what I said about the sub commands |
| 16:45.39 | brlcad | or pull up /help |
| 16:45.40 | JeffM2501 | we coudl have like /ban remove and /ban short |
| 16:45.43 | _Manu_ | brlcad, no need just type /ban :) |
| 16:45.54 | _Manu_ | the help is there |
| 16:46.12 | brlcad | exactly my point though, it can be made intuitive |
| 16:46.22 | brlcad | without having someone ask for help |
| 16:46.31 | bryjen | so if I /ban Foo dirty cheater , do i get an error message for no duration? |
| 16:46.33 | JeffM2501 | of all the ideas I like colapsing better |
| 16:46.44 | brlcad | the fact that ban without arguments even gives help is good, but not necessarily intuitive |
| 16:46.45 | JeffM2501 | bryjen, right now yes |
| 16:46.45 | Tupone | bryjen, now yes |
| 16:46.49 | _Manu_ | well.. when somebody is going to admin any server.. first must learn to use the tools for it |
| 16:46.51 | brlcad | especially as a behavior across commands |
| 16:46.58 | _Manu_ | no need to be intuitive.. but actually it is |
| 16:46.59 | JeffM2501 | bryjen, that's what he "broke" |
| 16:47.12 | JeffM2501 | then I fixed it |
| 16:47.30 | JeffM2501 | but the formating can make some easy mistakes not show well |
| 16:47.41 | bryjen | neither is broke or fixed, they both work as intended. your two intentions differ. |
| 16:47.51 | _Manu_ | well.. probably the first times you use it |
| 16:48.03 | JeffM2501 | like /ban brlcad 30m liking goats would actualy do a shortban |
| 16:48.08 | _Manu_ | I use it and no problem.. and most of new cops too |
| 16:48.11 | _Manu_ | they learn quick |
| 16:48.30 | JeffM2501 | bryjen, I fixed it because of a complaint, an old functional behvor stoped working |
| 16:48.49 | _Manu_ | the 'm' for minutes is not recognizded, but also can be implemented |
| 16:48.50 | brlcad | _Manu_: it's familiar and makes sense for a command that might give the perception of more arguments like banning -- banning implies you will ban "someone" -- but then should I presume I'll get help if I type /part? /banlist? /help? |
| 16:49.08 | brlcad | it's not a consistent interface that way |
| 16:49.11 | JeffM2501 | tupone changed it because he was unaware of how it worked, and fixed a bug where the first part of the discription was looked at as thing |
| 16:49.31 | _Manu_ | no, you tried to: /ban player message? |
| 16:49.38 | bryjen | having the durarion be optional lets you enter something _you_ think is a duration, but bzfs will actually silently make part of the reason and apply the default duration. that's NFG |
| 16:50.03 | brlcad | bryjen: very true |
| 16:51.06 | brlcad | so you either make it required and force everyone to learn that format or you work out different command conventions that work better |
| 16:51.19 | ToughShooter | When error correction introduces new bugs, why don't simply say "bad format" and only accept correct input? |
| 16:51.38 | _Manu_ | ToughShooter, that's how it works actually |
| 16:51.39 | brlcad | ToughShooter: detecting correct input is the problem in this case |
| 16:52.01 | brlcad | you can't necessarily detect that I wanted to say the duration, or make the duration part of the reason |
| 16:52.04 | bryjen | ...and optional parts make that harder |
| 16:52.17 | brlcad | if you have too many optional parts |
| 16:52.26 | bryjen | maybe s/harder/more error prone/ |
| 16:53.02 | brlcad | which is why I suggest either two commands or a different format altogether |
| 16:53.06 | trepan | could use a client-side format assistant if yall don't think they're bright enough to figure out 3 whole parameters |
| 16:53.29 | brlcad | trepan: you mean like prompt them? |
| 16:53.42 | trepan | yup |
| 16:53.43 | ToughShooter | _Manu_: It looks like the duration can be either duration or reason, correct? |
| 16:53.51 | brlcad | that could work too |
| 16:54.03 | bryjen | a GUI clock where they set the time by moving the hands! ;P |
| 16:54.22 | _Manu_ | ToughShooter, no... format is: /ban <player> <duration> <message> three prameters required and in this order |
| 16:54.32 | _Manu_ | actually |
| 16:54.53 | _Manu_ | another thing is what you think it is.. |
| 16:55.15 | _Manu_ | if you forget any parameter.. the help is fired |
| 16:56.00 | _Manu_ | and last tupone changes was for avoiding wrong duration parameters.. for being sure you make the ban you want.. not any default one |
| 16:56.01 | DTRemenak | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:56.14 | _Manu_ | DTRemenak, wow.. that's ugly and long |
| 16:56.17 | bryjen | hmm, DTRemenak=typesTooMuch |
| 16:56.23 | DTRemenak | :) |
| 16:56.33 | trepan | DTRemenak: a -m for duration mighten be horrible |
| 16:56.36 | _Manu_ | DTRemenak, the cheater can insult you 100 times before you ban him.. heh |
| 16:56.41 | trepan | would at least let 'em know it's minutes by default |
| 16:56.47 | DTRemenak | _Manu_, haha |
| 16:57.06 | bryjen | gah, brlcad. just as bad. |
| 16:57.10 | brlcad | yep :) |
| 16:57.21 | DTRemenak | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:57.23 | bryjen | point-and-drool simple, but too long |
| 16:57.24 | brlcad | though that is what many of them want |
| 16:57.32 | DTRemenak | [SERVER->] Player? |
| 16:57.35 | DTRemenak | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:57.41 | DTRemenak | [SERVER->] For how long? |
| 16:57.46 | DTRemenak | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:57.50 | DTRemenak | [SERVER->] Why? |
| 16:57.55 | DTRemenak | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:58.04 | bryjen | Yes, yes he is :P |
| 16:58.10 | _Manu_ | yes, yes.. you can add this one.. but plz.. keep the old one for experienced admins.. heh |
| 16:58.16 | orange | while you guys are discussing this, what about a mute list with state? |
| 16:58.40 | JeffM2501 | who's going to do the changes? |
| 16:58.41 | DTRemenak | I'm just making it rediculous. Either people need to learn to use the command RIGHT, or the interface needs to be OBVIOUS |
| 16:59.02 | _Manu_ | DTRemenak, true :) |
| 16:59.02 | DTRemenak | education || good design |
| 16:59.11 | DTRemenak | and I'm not seeing either one |
| 16:59.45 | Aribeth | i usualy do the command like this: ban #4 4587459687476 :becaose your a tool :P |
| 17:00.44 | _Manu_ | Aribeth, then you are simply making a ban too long in the time.. but probably you don't know what it means |
| 17:00.52 | bryjen | but at least I can spell :P |
| 17:01.04 | Aribeth | well, not that long |
| 17:01.26 | JeffM2501 | power users want a fast way to ban, that's why I don't like the 3 step thing |
| 17:01.50 | _Manu_ | actually you can: /ban #4 1h reason that's quick |
| 17:01.58 | Aribeth | yes |
| 17:02.01 | _Manu_ | and you know exactly what you are doing.. |
| 17:02.02 | JeffM2501 | it may be simple enough to make the duration parser know what "short" "forever" are |
| 17:02.13 | bryjen | i don't think having to type a duration or "short" take that long |
| 17:02.13 | jpa- | if no arguments or missing arguments for /ban, then go 3-step |
| 17:02.20 | Pimpinella | you don't need all three args anymore |
| 17:02.21 | JeffM2501 | _Manu_, yeah but that method has no way of doing default |
| 17:02.24 | _Manu_ | yes, but you need to know how long is short.. |
| 17:02.37 | ToughShooter | Aribeth: that's around 8,722,069.5 years :o |
| 17:02.37 | JeffM2501 | so should I make the duration parser know forever and short? |
| 17:02.42 | JeffM2501 | and doc and anounce it? |
| 17:02.44 | Aribeth | lol |
| 17:02.58 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 17:03.00 | JeffM2501 | fair nuf |
| 17:03.02 | DTRemenak | or maybe to short |
| 17:03.13 | JeffM2501 | default and max? |
| 17:03.21 | JeffM2501 | I can do a couple that mean the same thing |
| 17:03.27 | JeffM2501 | default and short be the same |
| 17:03.38 | JeffM2501 | are we in agreement on that tho |
| 17:03.43 | DTRemenak | JeffM2501, I'm looking for a way for shortban users to say "as long as possible" and still do the same thing when they migrate to full ban. |
| 17:03.43 | JeffM2501 | it's minimal changes to the command |
| 17:03.55 | bryjen | if you've only got shortBan permission max would get clamped back to short or default |
| 17:03.57 | JeffM2501 | DTRemenak, ok |
| 17:04.08 | JeffM2501 | so max for them on short would still clamp to shortban time |
| 17:04.13 | DTRemenak | yeah |
| 17:04.24 | _Manu_ | JeffM2501, quickest is to write a new command using a default time.. like /sban player reason.... (s from short) |
| 17:04.26 | DTRemenak | whereas max with full ban would ban forever |
| 17:04.40 | JeffM2501 | but what if you realy wanted to do the default, but didn't care or know what it was, and you had fullban |
| 17:04.42 | _Manu_ | easy to remember too |
| 17:04.46 | JeffM2501 | for that you'd want short |
| 17:04.48 | DTRemenak | yeah |
| 17:04.56 | JeffM2501 | _Manu_, that is actualy a lot more work |
| 17:05.11 | Pimpinella | instead of max/forever |
| 17:05.15 | JeffM2501 | I think I'll just do this now |
| 17:05.25 | JeffM2501 | and then in 2.1 we can revaluate all the commands |
| 17:05.28 | JeffM2501 | and maybe clean them all up |
| 17:05.33 | _Manu_ | JeffM2501, not too much I think.. simply writing the ban stuff out the command and call it with the right parameters |
| 17:05.35 | DTRemenak | Pimpinella, if you have shortban "max" is not permanent |
| 17:05.42 | JeffM2501 | I'd rather not make big command changes, I'd rather get .4 out |
| 17:05.43 | Pimpinella | yeah |
| 17:05.55 | trepan | "max" is equivalent to today's "0" then? |
| 17:06.03 | JeffM2501 | _Manu_, but if we redo it later, whats the point of teaching everyone a new command we may remove later. |
| 17:06.07 | JeffM2501 | trepan, yes |
| 17:06.09 | DTRemenak | trepan, seems that way |
| 17:06.18 | JeffM2501 | just for the slowbies |
| 17:06.41 | Pimpinella | if a player with shortban used max be default so far he will continue banning players forever if he finally gets ban perm |
| 17:06.56 | Pimpinella | probably without even knowing |
| 17:06.56 | _Manu_ | JeffM2501, If I know I'll die some day.. why learn things.. ;) |
| 17:07.28 | DTRemenak | Pimpinella, look at it the other way around "I want to ban this guy forever". so use max. if you can't ban him forever it won't. if you can it will. |
| 17:07.42 | JeffM2501 | _Manu_, if the only reason is lack of work, and we'll have to retrain people ANYWAY, I'd rather keep it the same command |
| 17:08.09 | DTRemenak | Pimpinella, if I ban someone I generally ban them forever anyway. You've gotta really get on my nerves to get banned. |
| 17:08.10 | JeffM2501 | it's less change to the command namespace |
| 17:08.38 | JeffM2501 | ok so I'm making changes, is everyone ok with that? |
| 17:09.01 | trepan | JeffM2501: as with the command, be explicit about the change set ;) |
| 17:09.12 | JeffM2501 | huh? |
| 17:09.18 | _Manu_ | heh |
| 17:10.00 | _Manu_ | JeffM2501, what are really your changes? |
| 17:10.12 | JeffM2501 | just making the duration know about a couple words |
| 17:10.22 | JeffM2501 | the durration will still be required |
| 17:10.34 | _Manu_ | ah.. |
| 17:10.45 | JeffM2501 | seems like a decent enough compromise |
| 17:10.56 | DTRemenak | JeffM2501, what do you think about parsing time extension also. so /ban #1 30m idiot |
| 17:11.02 | DTRemenak | or /ban #1 1h idiot |
| 17:11.07 | JeffM2501 | DTRemenak, dosn't it do that now? |
| 17:11.14 | JeffM2501 | it does this regex thing |
| 17:11.16 | DTRemenak | I dunno. does it? |
| 17:11.22 | DTRemenak | I always assumed it did not |
| 17:11.27 | JeffM2501 | it dosn't m for min |
| 17:11.34 | JeffM2501 | "Duration examples: 30 1h 1d 1w and mixing: 1w2d4h " |
| 17:11.35 | bryjen | DTRemenak: it does that somewhat. mintues are the default, so m isn't handled |
| 17:11.37 | _Manu_ | actually m for minutes is not implemented |
| 17:11.38 | JeffM2501 | but it does h d and q |
| 17:11.53 | JeffM2501 | wouldn't be hard to put in m |
| 17:11.59 | JeffM2501 | and would be consistent |
| 17:12.00 | orange | q = quarter? |
| 17:12.02 | _Manu_ | yes, it's easy |
| 17:12.15 | _Manu_ | orange, that become bloated :) |
| 17:12.15 | jpa- | q = off-by-one w |
| 17:12.19 | DTRemenak | JeffM2501, the manual has m in it |
| 17:12.20 | JeffM2501 | totaly |
| 17:12.25 | JeffM2501 | DTRemenak, then it's a bug |
| 17:12.28 | DTRemenak | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:12.32 | orange | ah, ok, I wasn't *asking* for quarter :-) |
| 17:12.37 | JeffM2501 | I'll see if I know regex enough to figure it out |
| 17:12.41 | JeffM2501 | if not I'll ask for help :) |
| 17:12.50 | trepan | what? no 'f'ortnight? |
| 17:13.01 | DTRemenak | how about making the /ban help say what you can do for duration also :) |
| 17:13.05 | _Manu_ | DTRemenak, yes.. m is wrong |
| 17:13.06 | JeffM2501 | 1f may be a good ban time :) |
| 17:13.09 | jpa- | what? no 'u'ntil haley-bob returns? |
| 17:13.14 | JeffM2501 | DTRemenak, do you just want to do the changes? |
| 17:13.21 | _Manu_ | earlier worked because a bug.. well not worked.. simply parsed |
| 17:13.26 | DTRemenak | JeffM2501, I'll change the help, sure |
| 17:14.02 | _Manu_ | DTRemenak, you must do: /ban ip 2h30 reason... |
| 17:14.31 | JeffM2501 | _Manu_, what he's saying is the manual says M, so we should support M |
| 17:14.35 | JeffM2501 | and nothing is asumed m |
| 17:14.45 | _Manu_ | true.. but never parsed M :) |
| 17:14.51 | _Manu_ | just a man bug |
| 17:15.00 | _Manu_ | but I agree m is fine |
| 17:15.04 | JeffM2501 | supporting m is logical |
| 17:15.05 | DTRemenak | if we don't support m then we should remove it from the manual. I think it would be better to just support it in the first place. |
| 17:15.20 | jpa- | support everything at(1) supports |
| 17:15.30 | _Manu_ | yes, but say 60m is intuitive too |
| 17:15.39 | DTRemenak | hm... No entry for at in section 1 of the manual |
| 17:16.14 | jpa- | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:16.51 | DTRemenak | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:17.24 | bryjen | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:17.33 | DTRemenak | hehe |
| 17:17.47 | _Manu_ | why the blank? :) |
| 17:17.59 | _Manu_ | /ban DTRemenak 10m test |
| 17:18.36 | _Manu_ | /ban DTRemenak 10m test (m not allowed actually :/ ) |
| 17:21.42 | JeffM2501 | I'm fixing the m now |
| 17:22.02 | *** join/#bzflag DTRemenak (n=DTRemena@DHCP-170-143.caltech.edu) |
| 17:22.02 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v DTRemenak] by ChanServ |
| 17:24.31 | JeffM2501 | ok changes done, commiting in a sec |
| 17:24.41 | JeffM2501 | DTRemenak, I updated the help, you can check it over :) |
| 17:27.22 | DTRemenak | heh, ok |
| 17:27.40 | JeffM2501 | just need to test it here |
| 17:31.08 | Birdie | i just make my radar on 30, but i dont see any tank on my screan above my radar anymore (black radar), i do know its possible to change that so you can see them again, like your screan moved up above, any one know how? |
| 17:32.28 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/src/ (bzfs/BanCommands.cxx common/TextUtils.cxx): |
| 17:32.30 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: make ban command accept a couple text constants for durration |
| 17:32.32 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: make ban command use m for min in duration. |
| 17:32.34 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: durration is now REQUIRED, even for 'shortbans' |
| 17:32.36 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: expand help to be more descriptive |
| 17:36.41 | bryjen | stricmp? |
| 17:36.57 | JeffM2501 | oh |
| 17:37.00 | JeffM2501 | one sec :) |
| 17:37.33 | JeffM2501 | keep forgeting what one you all have |
| 17:37.45 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/BanCommands.cxx: the rest of the world has strcasecmp |
| 17:37.55 | JeffM2501 | there ya go :) |
| 17:37.59 | DTRemenak | gah. cvs commit: Up-to-date check failed for `BanCommands.cxx' |
| 17:38.09 | JeffM2501 | bwahahahaah |
| 17:38.15 | DTRemenak | cvs update: conflicts found in BanCommands.cxx |
| 17:38.34 | trepan | JeffM2501: when in doubt, use the source |
| 17:38.43 | JeffM2501 | I know |
| 17:38.47 | JeffM2501 | it compiled for me |
| 17:39.16 | CIA-14 | BZFlag: 03dtremenak * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/BanCommands.cxx: spellingness |
| 17:39.31 | JeffM2501 | I thought it was spellage |
| 17:39.31 | trepan | well have to start using junk #define's to protect against such things :) |
| 17:39.38 | trepan | ... from all sides |
| 17:39.42 | JeffM2501 | probably not a bad idea |
| 17:40.02 | trepan | or just let DTRemenak fix 'em |
| 17:40.12 | DTRemenak | he |
| 17:40.13 | DTRemenak | h |
| 17:40.14 | JeffM2501 | or just use the textutils for all things |
| 17:40.17 | JeffM2501 | and std::strings |
| 18:04.28 | *** join/#bzflag Janosik (n=89630b54@webchat.bzflag.bz) |
| 18:04.40 | *** join/#bzflag Grumbler (n=Grumbler@pdpc/supporter/bronze/grumbler) |
| 18:05.22 | Grumbler | g'day JBdiGriz |
| 18:08.32 | Grumbler | JeffM2501, i was running the SSE version .17, GM missiles(not so much fired by me, but fired by others) and SW(only when i fired) was causing some jumpyness. qualifications -> it may have only been me, as others werent complaining, also other versions ran from 2.0.0 up, also, it was SP, so the connection could have been borked |
| 18:08.52 | JeffM2501 | what CPU do you have? |
| 18:08.59 | Grumbler | P4 3.2 |
| 18:09.12 | JeffM2501 | how did the 17+ one run? |
| 18:09.24 | Grumbler | didnt use that....but i will check |
| 18:09.25 | JeffM2501 | I think I'm only gonna go as far as the + one for this release |
| 18:09.41 | Grumbler | ok, i will give that a shot |
| 18:10.04 | trepan | JeffM2501: do you have some sort of CPU type checking? |
| 18:11.50 | trepan | or would it not be able to get as far as to report an incompatibility? |
| 18:14.30 | Grumbler | ls -alrt |
| 18:14.32 | ToughShooter | Someone else gets jittery, too. :) /me hopes it has the same reason. |
| 18:18.24 | JeffM2501 | trepan, it would not even get that far |
| 18:18.32 | JeffM2501 | it's just compiler setings |
| 18:18.36 | brlcad | Grumbler: I usually prefer -lart just cause it makes me smile :) |
| 18:18.57 | JeffM2501 | if bzflag was implemented in DLLs, then I could detect with blended code, then load optimised code |
| 18:19.27 | brlcad | we can write out the unix equivalent now trivially |
| 18:19.37 | brlcad | i specifically turned it off just to match what we did |
| 18:20.00 | brlcad | building dynamic and static is, however, the default |
| 18:20.38 | brlcad | since everything seems to be stable, I suppose I should finish it up now too |
| 18:25.12 | _Manu_ | JeffM2501, why you allways writes 'durration'? :/ |
| 18:25.37 | bryjen | ~spell allways |
| 18:26.22 | _Manu_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:26.59 | _Manu_ | heh |
| 18:28.09 | _Manu_ | ~spell bryjen |
| 18:28.18 | _Manu_ | :) |
| 18:28.30 | bryjen | Bryan |
| 18:29.00 | _Manu_ | I knew, but just funny what ibot says |
| 18:43.59 | *** join/#bzflag mmu_man (i=revol@ALyon-253-1-23-177.w83-205.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 18:44.24 | *** join/#bzflag TD-Linux (n=TD-Linux@24-159-197-101.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com) |
| 18:56.10 | TD-Linux | I see that 2.0.3 prevents the drop-suprflag-over-team-flag-so-that-it-is-invisible-on-radar cheat |
| 19:06.29 | TD-Linux | ~lart #masterbot |
| 19:07.32 | orange | td-linux are you playing or chatting in irc? |
| 19:10.08 | _Manu_ | TD-Linux, you must remove ID flag from your map for that cheat |
| 19:10.18 | orange | hmmm, could the plug-in structure allow you to create a plug-in that would prevent the opposing team from picking up a team flag under certain circumstances? |
| 19:11.42 | trepan | yup, just send a drop msg, plugin or not |
| 19:11.55 | orange | yeah, but this would be perfect as a plugin |
| 19:12.18 | orange | if player ratio is exceeded, prevent flag pick-up |
| 19:12.26 | orange | I know not all servers would want it |
| 19:12.29 | Birdie | YAY for gu update from the server |
| 19:12.32 | trepan | they might be able to move it incrementally though, it'd be hackish |
| 19:12.39 | Birdie | at least the match servers allready |
| 19:13.12 | orange | gu update from the server? |
| 19:13.20 | orange | oh, updated version of bzfs? |
| 19:13.26 | TD-Linux | I'm playing, and chatting when nothing is happening |
| 19:13.43 | orange | (i'm not making fun of your english, Birdie... it's far better than my "whatever you speak"-ish :-) |
| 19:13.44 | Birdie | gu was still running on 2.0, at least the match servers are 2.0.3 now:) |
| 19:13.57 | Birdie | i know my english is bad |
| 19:14.01 | orange | not really |
| 19:16.00 | TD-Linux | you mean you don't speakenglish well? Everybody on IRC talks like that, they are too lazy to correct errors |
| 19:18.09 | jpa- | Birdie: i love you anyway |
| 19:22.51 | Birdie | bah |
| 19:28.24 | *** join/#bzflag I_Died_Once (n=I_Died_O@pcp0010382004pcs.savana01.ga.comcast.net) |
| 19:28.43 | I_Died_Once | woot |
| 19:37.06 | TD-Linux | jpa- 's lawntractor was enough, thank you anyway |
| 19:37.40 | TD-Linux | Guess what? BZFlag messes up my Windows! |
| 19:37.54 | TD-Linux | Gimp and several other programs won't start after I play BZFlag |
| 19:38.05 | TD-Linux | :( |
| 19:38.20 | TD-Linux | 2.0.3b17+ |
| 19:38.39 | TD-Linux | Windows XP sp2 |
| 19:39.00 | brlcad | isn't that like messing up a train wreck? |
| 19:39.12 | TD-Linux | yes |
| 19:39.38 | TD-Linux | a reinstall of Windows would be nice, or even better a wipe of Windows and an install of Linux |
| 19:40.03 | TD-Linux | except for my $242 copy of Office 2003 |
| 20:00.12 | Pimpinella | spend a few more bucks to by crossover office |
| 20:00.23 | Pimpinella | buy |
| 20:01.59 | Pimpinella | or alternativly switch to one of the free alterntives to ms office |
| 20:02.42 | Grumbler | or sell your sell to Mr. Bill and Google-nation |
| 20:02.50 | Grumbler | err, soul |
| 20:06.02 | *** join/#bzflag pdog (n=d02e4d7a@webchat.bzflag.bz) |
| 20:06.37 | pdog | Having trouble compiling 2.0.2 on Windows... |
| 20:08.29 | TD-Linux | ok... |
| 20:08.35 | Grumbler | pdog, i would suggest pasting your error in pastebin |
| 20:08.45 | Grumbler | ~pastebin |
| 20:08.46 | ibot | i guess pastebin is a place to paste your stuff without flooding the channel - try http://pastebin.ca/ |
| 20:09.04 | pdog | Okay, let me give that a shot... just a moment |
| 20:09.59 | pdog | Actually, the error I'm getting when compiling bzflag is 'input line too long' from make.exe |
| 20:09.59 | orange | ~bzpastebin |
| 20:10.01 | ibot | i guess bzpastebin is a place to paste your stuff without flooding the channel, and it archives too. - try http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/ |
| 20:10.31 | pdog | Okay, I'm going to have to jump off and connect from the dev machine.... |
| 20:10.55 | Grumbler | heh, didnt know we pasted so much we had our own pastebin |
| 20:11.18 | *** join/#bzflag pdog (n=d02e4d7a@webchat.bzflag.bz) |
| 20:11.39 | pdog | Okay, I'm back...give me the URL again |
| 20:12.31 | orange | ~bzpastebin |
| 20:12.32 | ibot | it has been said that bzpastebin is a place to paste your stuff without flooding the channel, and it archives too. - try http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/ |
| 20:13.30 | pdog | Got it...be back in a moment |
| 20:14.54 | pdog | Okay, the output is at http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/21631 |
| 20:15.18 | pdog | I'm using Dev C on Windows XP Pro |
| 20:15.45 | pdog | I get the same error when compiling bzfs but not bzadmin |
| 20:16.03 | *** join/#bzflag |zongo| (n=zongo@84-72-45-91.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 20:16.24 | pdog | I tried to use VC6 but it wouldn't open the workspace files |
| 20:18.04 | pdog | I've checked the forums and Google but nobody else seems to have this problem |
| 20:18.20 | pdog | I've also gone over the release notes and READMEs |
| 20:20.10 | Grumbler | the dudes who handle much of the windows garbage appear to be missing....you might have to wait |
| 20:20.29 | pdog | No probs, I can hang for a while |
| 20:30.44 | *** join/#bzflag RPG_ (n=G-bus@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 20:34.39 | pdog | Any Windows dev folk here? |
| 20:35.01 | RPG_ | blast007 is one, although he doexn't have commit access |
| 20:35.08 | RPG_ | and i can answer baby questions |
| 20:35.27 | pdog | Just looking for bzflag compile help |
| 20:36.41 | brlcad | RPG_ you speak lies |
| 20:36.58 | brlcad | whether you know it or not :) |
| 20:37.03 | RPG_ | blast can commit? |
| 20:37.08 | brlcad | yes |
| 20:37.10 | RPG_ | oh |
| 20:37.14 | RPG_ | i remember him saying he couldn't |
| 20:37.32 | brlcad | emphasis on the past tense perhaps |
| 20:37.42 | pdog | Don't need help with CVS; compiling 2.0.2 |
| 20:38.46 | brlcad | you're still stuck on the pastebin problem? |
| 20:38.55 | *** part/#bzflag |zongo| (n=zongo@84-72-45-91.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 20:39.11 | pdog | Nope. My compile log is at http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/21631 |
| 20:39.22 | brlcad | that's what I meant |
| 20:39.33 | brlcad | if you're still having that problem |
| 20:39.38 | pdog | Well, then I guess I *am* |
| 20:39.56 | brlcad | yeah, the problem is with the Dev-C++ project |
| 20:40.18 | brlcad | it's apparently set up to link the whole caboodle at once without making libraries first like it's supposed to |
| 20:40.28 | brlcad | there are now too many files |
| 20:40.42 | pdog | Makes sense, any fix? |
| 20:40.44 | brlcad | this "may" have been fixed in the cvs version, there have been changes |
| 20:41.19 | pdog | I can try to grab the CVS version tonight |
| 20:41.28 | pdog | But in the meantime, have you heard of issues with the VC6 workspace files? |
| 20:41.29 | brlcad | the proper fix is to build libraries before linking.. i'm not sure what it currently does |
| 20:42.17 | brlcad | the windows dev folk in general can't help -- you need the guy that works on Dev-C++ |
| 20:42.45 | brlcad | that'd be lan56, who is not around much, or try to fix/workaround the problem yourself |
| 20:42.45 | pdog | And that would be...? |
| 20:43.01 | brlcad | I haven't heard of any workspace issues, but those files are gone from current CVS |
| 20:43.16 | *** join/#bzflag gina (n=gigi@192-197.240.81.adsl.skynet.be) |
| 20:43.48 | brlcad | you could try to get one of the other devs to help you, but to be honest not many on win like using devc++ for primary development |
| 20:43.59 | pdog | The issue with VC6 occurs when I try to open bzflag.dsw, the IDE opens but nothing shows up |
| 20:44.21 | brlcad | opening it in studio or devc++? |
| 20:44.31 | pdog | studio |
| 20:44.51 | pdog | We went to devcpp when we couldn't get studio to work |
| 20:44.56 | brlcad | eh, and you're sure it's studio 6 you have? :) |
| 20:45.07 | brlcad | there are 7 files |
| 20:45.27 | brlcad | er, files for vc7 |
| 20:45.27 | pdog | The Start menu item says Visual Studio 6.0 |
| 20:45.32 | brlcad | heh |
| 20:45.43 | brlcad | what about the "about this app" under help section? |
| 20:45.50 | pdog | Okay, checking |
| 20:46.00 | brlcad | just to be certain :) |
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| 20:46.14 | pdog | Visual C 6.0 |
| 20:46.18 | brlcad | k |
| 20:46.36 | brlcad | so you open it, and it does "nothing" |
| 20:46.37 | pdog | Our current PCs don't have enough ooomph to run VC7 |
| 20:46.42 | pdog | Yup, nothing |
| 20:46.45 | brlcad | did you try hitting build? |
| 20:47.00 | pdog | Give me a sec |
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| 20:47.35 | brlcad | there's someone who might have a better idea |
| 20:47.38 | pdog | build menu is grayed out |
| 20:48.14 | brlcad | JeffM2501: thoughts on what would cause the vc6 build files to not load in vc6? |
| 20:48.34 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, the fact that 1) they are unix LF format |
| 20:48.41 | JeffM2501 | or 2) the fact that they are gone |
| 20:49.12 | JeffM2501 | did they come from the tarbal or the zip or cvs? |
| 20:49.15 | brlcad | 2.0.2 source ball |
| 20:49.43 | pdog | I didn't see a source zip |
| 20:50.05 | JeffM2501 | the tarballs are made on linux |
| 20:50.14 | JeffM2501 | linux cvs gets them in linux format |
| 20:50.20 | JeffM2501 | most untarballers on windows DON"T convert them |
| 20:50.28 | JeffM2501 | therefor they do not work |
| 20:50.48 | pdog | so is there a win32 archive |
| 20:50.52 | JeffM2501 | there should be a zip |
| 20:50.57 | JeffM2501 | in the same place as the tar |
| 20:50.59 | JeffM2501 | let me check |
| 20:52.00 | brlcad | does .net handle that better? |
| 20:52.03 | JeffM2501 | I hope the VC6 stuff is complete in 2.0.2 |
| 20:52.11 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, yes, .net uses XML |
| 20:52.11 | brlcad | i would suspect it does with all the xml support |
| 20:52.32 | JeffM2501 | ahh noone made a zip |
| 20:52.33 | pdog | I got them to open in VC7 |
| 20:52.34 | JeffM2501 | that sukcs |
| 20:52.40 | JeffM2501 | pdog, what do you use to unzip? |
| 20:52.47 | JeffM2501 | pdog, you have vc 7.1? |
| 20:52.48 | pdog | Ultimate Zip |
| 20:52.57 | JeffM2501 | winzip will fix the files for you |
| 20:52.58 | pdog | Our PCs can't run VC7.1 |
| 20:53.09 | JeffM2501 | that dosn't make sense |
| 20:53.22 | pdog | It'll run but really, really slowly |
| 20:53.24 | JeffM2501 | we are desuporting VC6 with 2.0.4 |
| 20:53.31 | JeffM2501 | none of us use it anymore |
| 20:53.33 | pdog | p3 800, 256 MB RAM |
| 20:53.37 | JeffM2501 | should be fine |
| 20:53.49 | pdog | Let me try winzip |
| 20:53.54 | JeffM2501 | but, you can use winzip to do the tarball, it will work |
| 20:53.57 | JeffM2501 | most other unzipers are lame |
| 20:54.02 | pdog | Also, I have a text editor that will convert linefeeds |
| 20:54.09 | JeffM2501 | how ever you get them done |
| 20:54.47 | pdog | Okay, thanks! |
| 20:55.00 | JeffM2501 | but know that when 2.0.4 ships, we will only have vc7.1 |
| 20:55.02 | JeffM2501 | oh well |
| 20:55.17 | JeffM2501 | he can allways do mingw |
| 20:55.31 | RPG_ | can't 7.1 exprot 6 files? |
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| 20:56.09 | brlcad | optimal? |
| 20:56.23 | JeffM2501 | an option |
| 20:56.35 | brlcad | how about a .net build target/program that actually makes the devc++ and vc6 project files ;) |
| 20:56.49 | JeffM2501 | can that be done? |
| 20:56.52 | brlcad | so they stay perfectly in sync at release time |
| 20:56.59 | JeffM2501 | if you know the tool |
| 20:57.10 | JeffM2501 | I've heard of a 7.1 to VC6 tool |
| 20:57.15 | JeffM2501 | I've hard it's "iffy" |
| 20:57.26 | brlcad | i meant writing our own |
| 20:57.32 | brlcad | shouldn't be too hard |
| 20:57.36 | brlcad | they're all text formatted |
| 20:57.46 | JeffM2501 | devC++ dosn't do the same types of projects |
| 20:57.50 | JeffM2501 | it dosn't let you nest them |
| 20:58.00 | JeffM2501 | and if there allready is a tool for vc6... |
| 20:58.09 | JeffM2501 | they are such a minimal % of the build |
| 20:58.21 | brlcad | doesn't need to nest, just needs to make multiple binaries/libraries |
| 20:58.25 | JeffM2501 | I'd rather spend the time in making us VC8 compatable, so it can work with the free .net express |
| 20:58.33 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, that's what it can't do |
| 20:58.43 | brlcad | it already makes multiple binaries |
| 20:58.48 | JeffM2501 | no it dosn't |
| 20:58.52 | JeffM2501 | there is a seperate project per |
| 20:58.54 | JeffM2501 | it's a mess |
| 20:59.02 | JeffM2501 | we could do it, but what for? 3 people? |
| 20:59.11 | brlcad | well, that's a different question :) |
| 20:59.20 | JeffM2501 | mingw works for the total free stuff, and it's makefile. |
| 20:59.31 | JeffM2501 | for the gui people we could target the free VC express |
| 20:59.45 | brlcad | dunno really, probably not a whole lot -- but with all the kiddies who could download and compile for free on windows.. |
| 20:59.46 | JeffM2501 | since at some point I have to make it VC8 compatabale ANYWAY |
| 20:59.57 | JeffM2501 | vc express is free |
| 21:00.04 | brlcad | more just a thought that "it's possible" |
| 21:00.16 | JeffM2501 | anyting is possible :) |
| 21:00.28 | brlcad | yup |
| 21:00.37 | *** part/#bzflag RPG_ (n=G-bus@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 21:00.43 | JeffM2501 | the other reason for making them seperate downloads at first would be to see how many people realy use them |
| 21:00.49 | JeffM2501 | I think it's minimal |
| 21:01.30 | brlcad | you sure about that dev-C++ thing or is that something lan was spouting? |
| 21:01.35 | bryjen | that's backwards. you do the work to make them to then confirm that no one uses them :/ |
| 21:01.41 | brlcad | somehow find that really hard to believe |
| 21:01.54 | brlcad | that it won't build library and a binary as a project |
| 21:02.02 | JeffM2501 | I coudl not see a way |
| 21:02.06 | JeffM2501 | but maybe they have updated |
| 21:02.17 | JeffM2501 | they don't have the concept of a "workspace" that has multiple "proejcts" |
| 21:02.21 | brlcad | hrmph, let someone who cares figure it out :) |
| 21:02.30 | JeffM2501 | where each project makes a lib or an exe |
| 21:02.45 | JeffM2501 | it will build a binary OR a lib |
| 21:02.46 | brlcad | didn't have a concept of targets? |
| 21:02.51 | JeffM2501 | not really |
| 21:02.56 | JeffM2501 | it just had projects |
| 21:03.01 | brlcad | wierd |
| 21:03.05 | JeffM2501 | and each project was ether a lib or an exe |
| 21:03.12 | JeffM2501 | so it dosn't make like lib common |
| 21:03.17 | JeffM2501 | it just compiles all the code in |
| 21:03.31 | JeffM2501 | they may have updated tho |
| 21:03.35 | JeffM2501 | I haven't looked in a year |
| 21:03.38 | brlcad | i noticed that guys compile line for bzflag was every object |
| 21:03.55 | bryjen | linky linky linky |
| 21:03.56 | brlcad | which of course overflowed his command line |
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| 21:04.55 | JeffM2501 | yeah he had no clue |
| 21:05.03 | JeffM2501 | it is a toy compiler |
| 21:05.09 | JeffM2501 | well IDE |
| 21:05.15 | JeffM2501 | good for school projects and the like |
| 21:05.22 | JeffM2501 | but I'd not trust it for anything more |
| 21:05.37 | JeffM2501 | with MS having a free one, I don't see why we can't just keep the one set of proejcts that work on it. |
| 21:05.46 | JeffM2501 | since they will be the same for us and the express users |
| 21:10.47 | JeffM2501 | we pulled VC6 because it wasn't kept updated, and noone complained..... |
| 21:10.53 | JeffM2501 | where we == me |
| 21:11.35 | Grumbler | that makes logical sense, and avoids confusion |
| 21:12.37 | bryjen | well, counting that last guy, one person |
| 21:12.39 | JeffM2501 | figured why have something in there somone woudl think we supported when we didn't keep it up |
| 21:12.48 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 21:12.52 | JeffM2501 | he's the first I've heard |
| 21:13.21 | JeffM2501 | but if there are people in 2.0.4 that need it I'll have them try the converter |
| 21:13.25 | JeffM2501 | if that works, then we are done |
| 21:13.34 | JeffM2501 | if that dosn't then we'll have to see if one of them waints to maintain it |
| 21:13.43 | JeffM2501 | thanks to history we can allways get the files back |
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| 21:14.13 | JeffM2501 | oh that's right I didn't build 2.0.2 |
| 21:14.17 | JeffM2501 | that's why there wasn't a zip |
| 21:14.31 | JeffM2501 | don't think dtr knew he had to make one |
| 21:15.30 | JeffM2501 | I've pondered doing a source installer, but don't think it's worth it |
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| 21:23.14 | Win_XP | whats wrong?! libtool: link: cannot find the library `/usr/X11R6/lib/libGL.la' |
| 21:23.30 | JeffM2501 | do you have that lib? |
| 21:23.38 | Win_XP | no, I have libGLU.la |
| 21:23.59 | Win_XP | JeffM2501: and there is no package, which I haven't already installed, that has it |
| 21:24.16 | JeffM2501 | GL and GLU are difrent things |
| 21:24.46 | JeffM2501 | you should have some form of GL |
| 21:24.52 | JeffM2501 | what video card do you have? |
| 21:24.55 | Win_XP | JeffM2501: I just had someone confrim for me (running the same OS) that they are the SAME package |
| 21:25.02 | Win_XP | JeffM2501: FX 6600 |
| 21:25.15 | JeffM2501 | nooo, GLU is the OpenGL utility lib |
| 21:25.20 | JeffM2501 | GL is the opneGL core lib |
| 21:25.26 | JeffM2501 | they are commonly packaged together tho |
| 21:25.34 | JeffM2501 | did you install the drivers from nivia? |
| 21:25.41 | JeffM2501 | often there is a dev package that goes with it |
| 21:25.51 | JeffM2501 | since nvidia implements there own GL libs for your card |
| 21:26.03 | *** part/#bzflag Win_XP (n=kyle@CPE0011d868ebf3-CM000f9fac8236.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 21:26.10 | JeffM2501 | or he could just leave |
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| 21:40.19 | *** topic/#bzflag by ruskie -> ; /foreach window /n |
| 21:41.15 | ruskie | ups |
| 21:41.19 | ruskie | sorry 'bout that |
| 21:43.07 | TD-Linux | I have VC++ .NET express 2005 beta somewhere... |
| 21:43.31 | TD-Linux | ooh, I just discoverd that GIMP does animations, but now, what should I animate? |
| 21:43.33 | TD-Linux | :P |
| 21:43.34 | JeffM2501 | bzflag isn't set to build in 2005 yet |
| 21:43.43 | JeffM2501 | I have to do a number of changes |
| 21:43.52 | JeffM2501 | when the beta's calm down I'll be making them |
| 21:43.57 | TD-Linux | it wouldn't matter anyway, Express dosen't compile that stuff, does it? |
| 21:44.06 | JeffM2501 | it will when I'm done with it |
| 21:44.19 | TD-Linux | It only compiles console programs and DLLs |
| 21:44.21 | JeffM2501 | I have to mod the projects a bit to let depriciated stuff work |
| 21:44.26 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, that is untrue |
| 21:44.31 | TD-Linux | really? |
| 21:44.37 | TD-Linux | Express is a real compiler? |
| 21:44.40 | TD-Linux | yay! |
| 21:44.41 | JeffM2501 | it just dosn't ship with the windows SDK |
| 21:44.48 | JeffM2501 | express is the same compiler |
| 21:44.48 | *** topic/#bzflag by orchid -> Topic for #bzflag: http://BZFlag.org/ || http://my.BZFlag.org/bb/ || http://my.BZFlag.org/ || http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/BZFlag || http://BZFlag.org/wiki/GettingHelp || http://BZFlag.org/wiki/Download || try #bzchat if you just want to talk || paste errors http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/ |
| 21:45.02 | TD-Linux | I just remembered reading something |
| 21:45.15 | JeffM2501 | you can download the windows and directX sdks and build bz just fine |
| 21:45.18 | TD-Linux | it said that 2003 dosen't have an optimizing compiler |
| 21:45.22 | brlcad | ~orchid++ |
| 21:45.23 | TD-Linux | 2005 does |
| 21:45.31 | JeffM2501 | 2003 doesn't on standard, it does for pro |
| 21:45.42 | JeffM2501 | 2005 has a difrent optimisation system that is more automatic |
| 21:45.43 | TD-Linux | ok, is bzflag binaries in pro? |
| 21:45.47 | JeffM2501 | yes |
| 21:45.50 | TD-Linux | ok |
| 21:45.59 | JeffM2501 | express 2005 just as fewer otpimisation options |
| 21:46.01 | TD-Linux | what did trepan do to make that map run at 190 FPS? |
| 21:46.06 | JeffM2501 | basicly it allways builds smart blended code |
| 21:46.19 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, make bzflags graphic subsystem not suck so bad |
| 21:46.32 | JeffM2501 | and do the "right" stuff for modern hardware |
| 21:46.35 | TD-Linux | did he commit that to CVS yet? It's hard to reach him |
| 21:46.50 | TD-Linux | *contact |
| 21:46.52 | JeffM2501 | instead of simple things that are more for older non GPU hardware |
| 21:47.09 | JeffM2501 | really? I find /msg treapan what up G works well |
| 21:47.14 | TD-Linux | awww, I thought it would help out this 600mhz server with a S3 Savage4 :( |
| 21:47.23 | JeffM2501 | it may |
| 21:47.25 | JeffM2501 | it may not |
| 21:47.33 | JeffM2501 | it uses a lot of GPU features |
| 21:47.36 | TD-Linux | it seems to render inderect, maybe my driver is bad |
| 21:47.39 | JeffM2501 | like vertex buffer opbjects |
| 21:47.42 | TD-Linux | it's the generic linux one |
| 21:47.47 | TD-Linux | ooh |
| 21:47.48 | JeffM2501 | it expects the card to render it all |
| 21:47.58 | JeffM2501 | so you have to have a card that can accelerate those things |
| 21:48.11 | TD-Linux | does that mean you could support some really fancy new effects, like some of those hardware particle effects? |
| 21:48.19 | JeffM2501 | those are shaders |
| 21:48.24 | JeffM2501 | we could do shaders at any time |
| 21:48.40 | JeffM2501 | they woudl only work on cards with shaders tho |
| 21:48.44 | TD-Linux | oh |
| 21:48.54 | TD-Linux | menu option? |
| 21:49.10 | JeffM2501 | what? |
| 21:49.21 | TD-Linux | my cheap X700 gets 150FPS constantly, so I have plenty of time to spare on effects |
| 21:49.24 | TD-Linux | as do many others |
| 21:49.31 | TD-Linux | so it could be a menu option to turn on shaders |
| 21:49.36 | JeffM2501 | sure |
| 21:49.46 | TD-Linux | one other thing: |
| 21:49.59 | JeffM2501 | the biger question is, why spend the time to do it when so many other engines allready support it. |
| 21:50.13 | JeffM2501 | and have many other features that bz would be better having |
| 21:50.47 | TD-Linux | Antisotropic Filtering and Anti-Aliasing: BZFlag doesn't seem to support these, although it seems like a simple call to OpenGL would turn them on by what I know of OpenGL, which isn't much |
| 21:50.55 | JeffM2501 | it'll be interesting to see what happens for 2.1 |
| 21:51.12 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, there are many things we could do |
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| 21:51.22 | purple_cow | TD-Linux: it doesn't make those calls via opengl directly, but usually you can set that up in your drivers |
| 21:51.46 | TD-Linux | ok, I tried, but my ATI driver dosen't seem to do anything :/ |
| 21:51.59 | JeffM2501 | with our sad texture cahcing system, we are not optimised for that kinda stuff |
| 21:52.37 | TD-Linux | with the FPS some of these cards get, optimization wouldn't matter much |
| 21:52.38 | JeffM2501 | that is probably the next place that needs help |
| 21:52.52 | TD-Linux | Does texture caching even work? |
| 21:53.01 | JeffM2501 | for what we do, sure |
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| 21:53.09 | JeffM2501 | bind everyting, let the GPU sort it out |
| 21:53.18 | TD-Linux | it never seemed to do anything but fill up the cache directory |
| 21:53.21 | JeffM2501 | pray there is enough card ram |
| 21:53.29 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, not that kind of cache |
| 21:53.32 | JeffM2501 | *sigh* |
| 21:53.39 | JeffM2501 | that's just download cache |
| 21:53.41 | TD-Linux | oh |
| 21:53.44 | TD-Linux | wait... |
| 21:53.47 | TD-Linux | I know what cache now |
| 21:53.58 | JeffM2501 | I mean when you have more textures then you have card space for |
| 21:53.59 | TD-Linux | the one that stores it and sends it to the card when needed |
| 21:54.07 | TD-Linux | yes, that one |
| 21:54.11 | JeffM2501 | yeah, we don't have one of those |
| 21:54.12 | JeffM2501 | at all |
| 21:54.19 | TD-Linux | with the size of BZFlag textures, does it matter currently? |
| 21:54.20 | JeffM2501 | it's all sent to the card and the card sorts it out |
| 21:54.30 | TD-Linux | I don't think they go over 16mb at all |
| 21:54.38 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, you could very easly make a map now that refrenced gigs of textuures, |
| 21:54.45 | JeffM2501 | specialy with your Aniso |
| 21:54.52 | TD-Linux | brb |
| 21:54.53 | JeffM2501 | even with mip maps |
| 21:55.34 | JeffM2501 | children, no respect for the tennents of graphics programing |
| 21:56.36 | TD-Linux | back |
| 21:56.58 | TD-Linux | what would be also nice: |
| 21:57.11 | TD-Linux | and make the cache more worthwhile: |
| 21:57.22 | JeffM2501 | how is it not worthwile? |
| 21:57.24 | TD-Linux | Some form of compression of textures, like .jpg |
| 21:57.36 | JeffM2501 | png's are compressed |
| 21:57.39 | JeffM2501 | *sigh* |
| 21:57.43 | TD-Linux | not as much as .jpg |
| 21:57.53 | JeffM2501 | yeah because they are lossy |
| 21:57.53 | TD-Linux | except for small textures |
| 21:57.54 | purple_cow | depends on the image |
| 21:58.09 | JeffM2501 | jpegs offten look like ass as textures |
| 21:58.14 | purple_cow | images with low numbers of colors but high frequencies will compress a lot better as png |
| 21:58.18 | purple_cow | and they don't look like ass ;) |
| 21:58.20 | TD-Linux | I tested, over about 64x64 .jpg is smaller |
| 21:58.20 | JeffM2501 | as the card will scale them and amplify there jpeg artifacts |
| 21:58.45 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, so you have a huge problem downloading the bzflag textures? |
| 21:58.57 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, how much smaller, and at what image quality? |
| 21:59.12 | JeffM2501 | and using what program to make the png? |
| 21:59.35 | TD-Linux | imagemagick |
| 21:59.40 | TD-Linux | mogrify |
| 21:59.45 | JeffM2501 | what jpeg quality? |
| 21:59.52 | TD-Linux | Pretty high, I think |
| 21:59.56 | TD-Linux | 80% compression |
| 22:00.03 | JeffM2501 | the higest quality? |
| 22:00.08 | purple_cow | 80% compression or 80% quality? :P |
| 22:00.10 | TD-Linux | I can't tell the difference between the PNG and the JPG |
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| 22:00.23 | JeffM2501 | there are ways to get each to compress better or worse then the other |
| 22:00.24 | JeffM2501 | png works |
| 22:00.24 | TD-Linux | the quality is high enough, whatever it may be exactly |
| 22:00.26 | JeffM2501 | and works well |
| 22:00.38 | JeffM2501 | the difs are pobably in the 100's of bytes |
| 22:00.40 | TD-Linux | yes, but jpg is 5 times smaller at 256x256 |
| 22:00.42 | JeffM2501 | it's neglegable |
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| 22:00.53 | TD-Linux | no, there are huge size differences |
| 22:00.54 | purple_cow | TD-Linux: depends on the image, dammit! |
| 22:00.55 | TD-Linux | for a test |
| 22:01.05 | TD-Linux | I compressed the bzflag base texture |
| 22:01.07 | JeffM2501 | purple_cow, he's a foolish child, no point in arguing |
| 22:01.20 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, again, are you haveing a HUGE problem with these |
| 22:01.25 | JeffM2501 | since they are only downloaded ONCE |
| 22:01.36 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: bzflag is broken |
| 22:01.46 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, ohh noooes.... |
| 22:01.48 | purple_cow | we haven't had any complaints about texture sizes except by people who feel that they need to "optimize" things |
| 22:01.48 | JeffM2501 | call out the guard |
| 22:02.03 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: it WILL NOT compile on mandrake computers... without serious tweaking of libs |
| 22:02.21 | TD-Linux | ok, I know, PNG is good, but I thought it would be nice to have JPG support as well, for textures that are smaller in JPG, thats' all, soory |
| 22:02.49 | purple_cow | more code means more bugs and more work for the developers |
| 22:02.53 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: I'm pissing my pants with laughter... |
| 22:02.55 | TD-Linux | I know that |
| 22:03.03 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: ...not |
| 22:03.04 | Tupone | JPG has some kind of IP. Better avoid them |
| 22:03.13 | TD-Linux | red_basetop.png: 350KB |
| 22:03.17 | purple_cow | now, for sure, if we were doing the right thing and using a real image library, we'd have jpeg support built in already |
| 22:03.19 | TD-Linux | red_basetop.jpg:40KB |
| 22:03.40 | JeffM2501 | purple_cow, well actualy I could do jpeg with less code :0 |
| 22:03.50 | JeffM2501 | purple_cow, devIL ;) |
| 22:04.02 | TD-Linux | 310KB difference, so maps could have a lot more textures |
| 22:04.11 | TD-Linux | so... |
| 22:04.16 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, how about actualy stating what your problem is, rather then making vuage statements |
| 22:04.32 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, what are you talking about? the file size has nothing to do with the card limit |
| 22:04.49 | JeffM2501 | the textures are DECOMPRESED as we load them |
| 22:04.49 | Ice_Wewe | configure: WARNING: Client build has been requested, but GL is not fully available (missing gl.h) |
| 22:04.57 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, fix your GL |
| 22:04.59 | TD-Linux | sorry, I keep changing the subject, I'm talking about downloading textures now |
| 22:05.16 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, when what limit are you talking about? how could they have "more" textures? |
| 22:05.24 | JeffM2501 | the can have as many as they want |
| 22:05.33 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: its ____not____ broken, and bzflag did compile before this, so I'm blaming bzflag, also this is the second computer this has happened |
| 22:05.35 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, that's a problem on YOUR system, not bzflag's fualt |
| 22:05.43 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: it is not |
| 22:05.45 | *** part/#bzflag Ice_Wewe (n=Ice_Wewe@ppp-216-106-107-112.storm.ca) |
| 22:05.45 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, well then your make system can't find it |
| 22:05.46 | TD-Linux | well, you ahve to download the pictures |
| 22:05.50 | TD-Linux | textures |
| 22:05.53 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, once |
| 22:06.12 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, is hit a masive problem? |
| 22:06.30 | TD-Linux | yes, but people aren't going to want to download more than 8 MB of textures, or wait |
| 22:06.31 | JeffM2501 | how much longer does it take on average to dowload the exter 350k? |
| 22:06.34 | JeffM2501 | 5-6 seconds? |
| 22:06.46 | *** join/#bzflag Dvn (n=4164c54e@webchat.bzflag.bz) |
| 22:06.47 | TD-Linux | no, but I'm talking if we have a map with 10 textures |
| 22:06.49 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, changing it to jpeg isn't going to solve it |
| 22:07.03 | JeffM2501 | TD-Linux, ok, try it real world |
| 22:07.08 | JeffM2501 | take a map with that many textures |
| 22:07.19 | JeffM2501 | compress them jpeg with 100% quality |
| 22:07.22 | JeffM2501 | check the difrence |
| 22:07.29 | Dvn | hi |
| 22:07.31 | TD-Linux | ok |
| 22:07.33 | JeffM2501 | then tell me the time it will take |
| 22:07.33 | Dvn | nwow |
| 22:07.33 | TD-Linux | doing that |
| 22:07.43 | JeffM2501 | if it's under a min or 2, I don't care |
| 22:07.54 | Dvn | hello? |
| 22:07.56 | JeffM2501 | hello |
| 22:08.04 | Dvn | could you help me |
| 22:08.10 | JeffM2501 | depends on what you need help with |
| 22:08.21 | Dvn | how do i get my server on the list? |
| 22:08.30 | JeffM2501 | make it -public |
| 22:08.34 | JeffM2501 | in your config |
| 22:08.40 | Dvn | how do i do that? |
| 22:08.48 | JeffM2501 | and if you are behind a router, make sure your server port is routed to your computer |
| 22:08.57 | JeffM2501 | you have a conifg or a command line to set your options? |
| 22:09.09 | Dvn | whats a router? |
| 22:09.14 | Dvn | sry im 13 |
| 22:09.28 | JeffM2501 | have you read the forums on "how to host a public server" ? |
| 22:09.33 | bryjen | we're sorry too |
| 22:09.41 | Dvn | kind of |
| 22:09.49 | JeffM2501 | it has step by step instructions |
| 22:10.02 | JeffM2501 | http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=2915 |
| 22:10.07 | JeffM2501 | read it all the way thru |
| 22:10.13 | Dvn | k |
| 22:10.23 | JeffM2501 | it explains what all the thigns are and how to set one up |
| 22:10.34 | JeffM2501 | don't take any shortcuts |
| 22:11.21 | JeffM2501 | bryjen, they are out in force today arn't they? |
| 22:13.34 | *** join/#bzflag Ice_Wewe (n=Ice_Wewe@ppp-216-106-107-112.storm.ca) |
| 22:13.41 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: it is bzflag |
| 22:13.58 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, did you rerun the autogen? and do you have libtool? |
| 22:14.05 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: I've reinstalled my nvidia driver 3 times now, and I've made sure I need every package |
| 22:14.08 | JeffM2501 | the makefile did change recently |
| 22:14.10 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: what kind of error you have? |
| 22:14.17 | JeffM2501 | he can't find gl.h |
| 22:14.24 | Ice_Wewe | configure: WARNING: Client build has been requested, but GL is not fully available (missing gl.h) |
| 22:14.24 | Ice_Wewe | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:14.31 | JeffM2501 | do you have gl.h? |
| 22:14.37 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: I have it |
| 22:14.42 | JeffM2501 | where is it? |
| 22:14.50 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: can you bzpastebin your config.log or look by yourself ? |
| 22:14.58 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: /usr/X11R6/lib/libGL.la |
| 22:15.05 | JeffM2501 | that is not gl.h |
| 22:15.07 | JeffM2501 | that is a lib |
| 22:15.10 | JeffM2501 | where is gl.h |
| 22:15.13 | Tupone | ~bzpastebin |
| 22:15.15 | ibot | it has been said that bzpastebin is a place to paste your stuff without flooding the channel, and it archives too. - try http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/ |
| 22:15.17 | Ice_Wewe | sry brb |
| 22:15.24 | JeffM2501 | and pastebin your thing so that tupone can see |
| 22:15.26 | Ice_Wewe | /usr/X11R6/include/GL/gl.h |
| 22:15.32 | JeffM2501 | he is one ofthe makefile masters |
| 22:15.39 | Tupone | pastebin all the config.log |
| 22:15.57 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, we made a compromise on the ban thing |
| 22:16.08 | Tupone | yeah, I agree on that :) |
| 22:16.10 | JeffM2501 | and I put an anoucement on the boards |
| 22:16.27 | bryjen | is *.la a library or some other support file? Libs are *.so, no ? |
| 22:16.33 | JeffM2501 | I think for 2.1 we sould evaluate all our / commands and see if we can't make the more consistent |
| 22:16.35 | Ice_Wewe | http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/21653 |
| 22:16.39 | purple_cow | .la is a libtool archive |
| 22:16.53 | bryjen | ah, thx purple_cow |
| 22:17.13 | Ice_Wewe | brb dinner, I'll let you look over that log |
| 22:17.31 | *** join/#bzflag ChipX86 (n=chipx86@galago/ChipX86) |
| 22:19.29 | bryjen | ah, they're text file with hints for libtool |
| 22:20.27 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: is a bzflag fault in some way (bad diagnosys) but you miss glu.h |
| 22:21.22 | Tupone | ~spell diagnosys |
| 22:21.36 | JeffM2501 | the 3rd one |
| 22:21.38 | Tupone | diagnosis :) |
| 22:22.21 | jomojo | hmmm when you /mute someone it won't show them a reason why |
| 22:22.27 | jomojo | only that they have been muted |
| 22:22.37 | jomojo | or unmuted |
| 22:22.51 | Tupone | we should really change that message gl.h missing, could be anything :/ |
| 22:22.58 | jomojo | that is not really all that practical |
| 22:23.30 | JeffM2501 | I dono, last time I changed a thing for somone, tupone reverted it |
| 22:23.34 | bryjen | jomojo: they were not kicked or banned, so they are still on the server and can hear you tell them to STFU |
| 22:23.54 | jomojo | right |
| 22:23.54 | JeffM2501 | we could tack the reason on to the message |
| 22:23.58 | JeffM2501 | it'd be simple |
| 22:24.02 | JeffM2501 | and probably the "right" thing to do |
| 22:24.11 | jomojo | right but when you kill they see the message |
| 22:24.12 | JeffM2501 | then add "STFU BEEATCH" at the end |
| 22:24.42 | bryjen | kick and ban need to send a reason because the victim will be disconnected, mute does not |
| 22:24.50 | Tupone | well, I really like muted person to think they can talk :) |
| 22:25.04 | brlcad | bryjen: yeah, just text files.. it's a "libtool archive" |
| 22:25.17 | brlcad | ahh, purple_cow answered |
| 22:25.57 | bryjen | if a cow moo's in an empty field.... |
| 22:25.59 | brlcad | libtool can even use system-installed .la files for proper linking |
| 22:26.11 | JeffM2501 | wait |
| 22:26.16 | JeffM2501 | mute dosn't take a reason |
| 22:26.22 | JeffM2501 | Syntax: /mute <#slot | PlayerName | \"Player Name\ |
| 22:26.38 | JeffM2501 | it's not stored like a ban |
| 22:26.43 | JeffM2501 | so there is no reason for reason |
| 22:27.06 | JeffM2501 | your "reason" is called "crap at the end of the command" :) |
| 22:27.44 | jomojo | right but kill doesn't take a reason but you see a message that an admin adds on if he wishes |
| 22:27.59 | JeffM2501 | kill has an optional reason |
| 22:28.03 | JeffM2501 | mute just dosn't |
| 22:28.07 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: do I need glu.h? |
| 22:28.08 | JeffM2501 | the command isn't set to take or use a reason at all |
| 22:28.12 | Tupone | yeah |
| 22:28.14 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, totaly |
| 22:28.23 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: I don't have it, anywhere |
| 22:28.26 | bryjen | just don't go sniffing it |
| 22:28.30 | JeffM2501 | sucks to be you |
| 22:28.34 | Ice_Wewe | haha |
| 22:28.56 | Ice_Wewe | found the package that I need |
| 22:28.57 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: mandrake? install some *glu*dev*rpm |
| 22:29.59 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: I found a package that has it, but it wont install |
| 22:30.06 | Ice_Wewe | Some package requested cannot be installed: |
| 22:30.06 | Ice_Wewe | libMesaGLU1-devel-5.0.2-10.SoS.i586 (due to unsatisfied devel(libnvidia-tls)) |
| 22:30.06 | Ice_Wewe | Continue? (Y/n) n |
| 22:30.15 | Ice_Wewe | what now? |
| 22:30.23 | Ice_Wewe | my nvidia driver is blocking the install of these items |
| 22:30.29 | *** join/#bzflag TD-Linux (n=TD-Linux@24-159-197-101.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com) |
| 22:30.35 | Tupone | wait |
| 22:30.41 | JeffM2501 | there should be an nvidia dev package |
| 22:30.43 | Tupone | forever |
| 22:31.03 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: ??? |
| 22:31.09 | JeffM2501 | he wants you to wait |
| 22:31.11 | JeffM2501 | forever |
| 22:31.13 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: there is not |
| 22:31.14 | Tupone | :) looking |
| 22:31.16 | Ice_Wewe | oh |
| 22:31.17 | Ice_Wewe | ok |
| 22:31.23 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, then double sucks to be on mandrake then |
| 22:31.29 | JeffM2501 | silly distro |
| 22:31.38 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: what do you run? |
| 22:31.42 | JeffM2501 | devian |
| 22:31.45 | JeffM2501 | debian even |
| 22:31.49 | bryjen | deviant |
| 22:31.51 | Ice_Wewe | >:P |
| 22:31.53 | JeffM2501 | it roxorz your boxorz |
| 22:31.54 | Ice_Wewe | to each their own |
| 22:32.02 | JeffM2501 | yeah and my own, WORKS ;) |
| 22:32.11 | Ice_Wewe | well mine WORKED |
| 22:32.13 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: do you have libGLU.so.* ? |
| 22:32.18 | Ice_Wewe | until I got this new version |
| 22:32.24 | JeffM2501 | deviant woudl be a great distro name |
| 22:32.34 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: no |
| 22:32.52 | JeffM2501 | or a good bzflag fork name :) |
| 22:32.58 | JeffM2501 | DeviantFlag |
| 22:33.04 | Ice_Wewe | libMesaGLU1-devel:/usr/X11R6/lib/libGLU.so |
| 22:33.06 | bryjen | DVFlag! |
| 22:33.19 | Ice_Wewe | but I can't install it cause of my nvidia drvier (poo) |
| 22:33.24 | JeffM2501 | it's a band name |
| 22:33.45 | Tupone | you have the old bzflag version ? |
| 22:33.52 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: yes |
| 22:34.03 | Tupone | and works ? |
| 22:34.07 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: yes |
| 22:34.25 | Tupone | do an ldd on that and poste in paste bin |
| 22:34.30 | Ice_Wewe | ldd? |
| 22:34.32 | bryjen | "due to unsatisfied" sounds like you're missing something, not that there's a conflict. At least to me, but I don't know jack about mandrake |
| 22:34.55 | Tupone | you don't have ldd ? |
| 22:35.08 | Ice_Wewe | bryjen: probably means that nvidia would call bloody murder if it installed it |
| 22:35.16 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: ldd: ./bzflag: No such file or directory |
| 22:35.25 | bryjen | ldd /path/to/bzflag |
| 22:35.39 | Ice_Wewe | its REALLY long |
| 22:35.48 | Ice_Wewe | like 20 + lines |
| 22:35.51 | Tupone | paste in pastebin |
| 22:36.14 | Dvn | what is install directory |
| 22:36.24 | Ice_Wewe | http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/21659 |
| 22:36.38 | bryjen | Dvn: where the program files are |
| 22:36.50 | Tupone | /usr/X11R6/lib/libGLU.so.1 |
| 22:37.05 | JeffM2501 | bryjen, so what, you want like rebel bzflag? |
| 22:37.05 | JeffM2501 | viva la flag! |
| 22:37.13 | Tupone | it seems that you have GLU library ? |
| 22:37.19 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: I guess |
| 22:37.41 | Ice_Wewe | but why can't bzflag find that? |
| 22:37.41 | bryjen | JeffM2501: I thought _you_ wanted one. I'd go along for the ride ;) |
| 22:37.47 | Tupone | ok, now, you know where this file come from ? I mean /usr/X11R6/lib/libGLU.so.1 |
| 22:37.52 | JeffM2501 | bryjen, would you? |
| 22:37.56 | JeffM2501 | for you I was never sure |
| 22:38.11 | JeffM2501 | be cool to have a list of who woudl go along |
| 22:38.55 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: I don't remember the rpm command to query what package own that file |
| 22:39.05 | Tupone | You need to know that |
| 22:39.14 | Tupone | and then get the -dev package |
| 22:39.17 | JeffM2501 | I'm just bumed 2.0 got used up, it would be wierd to make a bzflag2 1.0 |
| 22:39.22 | Ice_Wewe | libMesaGLU1:/usr/X11R6/lib/libGLU.so.1 |
| 22:39.44 | Ice_Wewe | can't install it |
| 22:39.50 | Tupone | ok, so no way you need that GLU1-dev . |
| 22:39.50 | Ice_Wewe | f'in video card driver! |
| 22:40.07 | Ice_Wewe | wait, I think its already installed |
| 22:40.17 | JeffM2501 | most other distros have an nvidia dev package |
| 22:40.37 | JeffM2501 | does mandrake have a package manager that handles dependencys? |
| 22:40.45 | Tupone | urpmi |
| 22:40.50 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: yes |
| 22:41.00 | Tupone | yes to what ? |
| 22:41.01 | Ice_Wewe | doing a query on it |
| 22:41.02 | JeffM2501 | could he not install like sdl dev, and have it go get him the stuff he needs for the headers? |
| 22:41.03 | Ice_Wewe | nothing |
| 22:41.18 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: I compiled and installed SDL a LONG time ago |
| 22:41.25 | bryjen | i still think you're missing something. the floor is open to conjecture about what ;) |
| 22:41.44 | Tupone | you are missing glu.h |
| 22:41.56 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: where do I get it? |
| 22:42.00 | JeffM2501 | maybe a GLUT dev thingy would get it |
| 22:42.05 | *** part/#bzflag mmbm (n=mmbm@203-59-12-218.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 22:42.07 | Tupone | on the GLU1-dev package |
| 22:42.42 | Tupone | he is missing glu.h the compiler says, so it is. Can be he is missing other things too |
| 22:42.47 | Ice_Wewe | Some package requested cannot be installed: |
| 22:42.48 | Ice_Wewe | libMesaGLU1-devel-5.0.2-10.SoS.i586 (due to unsatisfied devel(libnvidia-tls)) |
| 22:42.48 | Ice_Wewe | Continue? (Y/n) n |
| 22:43.00 | Ice_Wewe | f'in driver |
| 22:43.06 | JeffM2501 | that libnvidia-tls is the package you need |
| 22:43.15 | Tupone | how are you installing? urpmi ? |
| 22:43.25 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: yes |
| 22:43.35 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: there is no package named libnvidia-tls |
| 22:43.59 | Tupone | where did you get this rpm ? official mandrake ? |
| 22:44.03 | JeffM2501 | how did you install your nvidia drivers? via the package manager? or via the direct download? |
| 22:44.16 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: NVIDIA.run file |
| 22:44.25 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: download from nvidia web site |
| 22:44.29 | JeffM2501 | mandrake dosn't have a package for it? |
| 22:44.32 | Ice_Wewe | mandrake doesn't cover nvidia drivers |
| 22:44.34 | JeffM2501 | suxorz |
| 22:44.35 | Tupone | the GLU things ? |
| 22:44.41 | Tupone | from nvidia ? |
| 22:44.47 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: I think so |
| 22:44.55 | JeffM2501 | *cough*apt*cough* |
| 22:45.05 | Ice_Wewe | *couhg*not my fault*cough* |
| 22:45.22 | JeffM2501 | bzflag has allways required glu, how could you have built before? |
| 22:45.24 | Tupone | GLU has to come from mandrake AFAIK |
| 22:45.31 | JeffM2501 | you sure it's just not somewhere else? |
| 22:45.40 | Ice_Wewe | locate glu.h? |
| 22:45.49 | JeffM2501 | somewhere that maybe just libtool dosn't know about? |
| 22:45.50 | Ice_Wewe | /usr/X11R6/lib/libglut.so.3 |
| 22:46.03 | JeffM2501 | thats a lib |
| 22:46.07 | Tupone | not talking about glut, just glu |
| 22:46.08 | JeffM2501 | there should be a header somewhere |
| 22:46.12 | JeffM2501 | probably same place that gl.h is |
| 22:46.18 | Ice_Wewe | no glu.l |
| 22:46.20 | Ice_Wewe | no glu.la |
| 22:46.31 | JeffM2501 | do you have gl.h? |
| 22:46.38 | Ice_Wewe | Yes |
| 22:46.45 | Tupone | he has, the compiler says |
| 22:46.46 | JeffM2501 | glu should be in the same place |
| 22:46.47 | Ice_Wewe | /usr/X11R6/include/GL/gl.h |
| 22:46.59 | JeffM2501 | wierd that they would get split |
| 22:47.34 | Ice_Wewe | glext.h GLwDrawA.h GLwMDrawA.h glxext.h glxint.h glxproto.h osmesa.h |
| 22:47.34 | Ice_Wewe | gl.h GLwDrawAP.h GLwMDrawAP.h glx.h glxmd.h glxtokens.h |
| 22:47.44 | Ice_Wewe | thats what I have in /usr/X11R6/lib/GL/ |
| 22:47.55 | JeffM2501 | if you don't have it, bz would never have built before |
| 22:47.55 | Ice_Wewe | would glx.h work as well? |
| 22:48.01 | JeffM2501 | have you changed anyhing else recently? |
| 22:48.04 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: well it did |
| 22:48.06 | JeffM2501 | no thats the GL bindings to X |
| 22:48.09 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: no |
| 22:48.16 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, then your search isn't showing all things |
| 22:48.35 | Ice_Wewe | updatedb (command is being processed) |
| 22:48.36 | JeffM2501 | does 2.0.2 still build? |
| 22:48.40 | JeffM2501 | it dosn't use libtool |
| 22:48.53 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: 2.0.3-0808 built for me |
| 22:49.00 | JeffM2501 | that wasn't what I asked |
| 22:49.05 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: what version of mandrake ? |
| 22:49.07 | JeffM2501 | does 2.0.2 still build |
| 22:49.10 | Ice_Wewe | 10.2 |
| 22:49.27 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: a lot newer versoins have built |
| 22:49.34 | JeffM2501 | if you put the source for 2.0.2 in another dir, will it build NOW |
| 22:49.40 | Ice_Wewe | Yes |
| 22:49.43 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, I don't care about earlyer builds and things that happend in the past |
| 22:49.51 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, so if you do it right now, it works? |
| 22:49.55 | Ice_Wewe | brb |
| 22:50.26 | JeffM2501 | see if its' configlog sees the glu.h |
| 22:52.27 | bryjen | their web page talks about version 10.1, not seeing a 10.2, or an rpm index/browser :( |
| 22:52.29 | Ice_Wewe | No |
| 22:52.39 | Ice_Wewe | configure: WARNING: Client build has been requested, but GL is not fully available (missing gl.h) |
| 22:52.40 | Ice_Wewe | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:52.44 | JeffM2501 | so 2.0.2 no longer builds ether? |
| 22:52.46 | Ice_Wewe | but then how did 2.0.3 build? |
| 22:52.56 | JeffM2501 | something on your system changed |
| 22:53.03 | JeffM2501 | has ANYTHING been updated |
| 22:53.11 | JeffM2501 | since you built last? |
| 22:53.21 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: yes |
| 22:53.29 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: but I don't know what |
| 22:53.36 | JeffM2501 | ooooookkkk |
| 22:53.40 | JeffM2501 | then you got somethig to figure out |
| 22:53.47 | JeffM2501 | it's not the new build stuff with lib tool |
| 22:53.49 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: what is the log for urpmi? |
| 22:54.11 | Tupone | I don't know. Try to install with rpm directly |
| 22:54.27 | Ice_Wewe | Tue Aug 30 14:11:16 2005 urpmi called with gl |
| 22:54.27 | Ice_Wewe | Tue Aug 30 14:11:47 2005 urpmi called with glibc |
| 22:54.27 | Ice_Wewe | Tue Aug 30 14:11:57 2005 urpmi called with libMesaGLU |
| 22:54.35 | Ice_Wewe | Tue Aug 30 14:12:04 2005 urpmi called with libMesaGLU1 |
| 22:54.35 | Ice_Wewe | Tue Aug 30 14:12:13 2005 urpmi called with libMesaGLU1-devel |
| 22:54.35 | Ice_Wewe | Tue Aug 30 14:14:28 2005 urpmi called with libtool |
| 22:54.40 | Ice_Wewe | Tue Aug 30 14:29:24 2005 urpmi called with libMesaGLU1-devel |
| 22:54.40 | Ice_Wewe | Tue Aug 30 14:29:35 2005 urpmi called with libMesaGLU1-devel --force |
| 22:54.40 | Ice_Wewe | Tue Aug 30 14:29:56 2005 urpmi called with libMesaGLU1-devel |
| 22:54.43 | JeffM2501 | what ever it did, it didn't do it right |
| 22:54.45 | JeffM2501 | dude pastebin |
| 22:54.49 | JeffM2501 | or /msg |
| 22:54.51 | Ice_Wewe | ok |
| 22:54.58 | JeffM2501 | something got busted |
| 22:55.11 | Tupone | Could you see if it is there ? /usr/X11R6/include/GL/ |
| 22:55.16 | JeffM2501 | is there anything that will rebuild your dependency table or anything? |
| 22:55.33 | Ice_Wewe | glext.h GLwDrawA.h GLwMDrawA.h glxext.h glxint.h glxproto.h osmesa.h |
| 22:55.33 | Ice_Wewe | gl.h GLwDrawAP.h GLwMDrawAP.h glx.h glxmd.h glxtokens.h |
| 22:55.38 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: dunno |
| 22:55.56 | JeffM2501 | thats probably just the nvidia stuff |
| 22:55.59 | JeffM2501 | he dosn't have the core stuff |
| 22:56.03 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: I recently installed... yes |
| 22:56.07 | Ice_Wewe | nvidia |
| 22:56.09 | JeffM2501 | I guess you could remove the nvidia driver |
| 22:56.13 | JeffM2501 | install mesa dev |
| 22:56.14 | Ice_Wewe | NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO |
| 22:56.18 | JeffM2501 | then reinstall the nvidia driver |
| 22:56.22 | Ice_Wewe | oh, then reinstall it |
| 22:56.28 | JeffM2501 | umm yeah |
| 22:56.28 | Tupone | force the install of the GLU things |
| 22:56.32 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: how would I uninstall? |
| 22:56.37 | JeffM2501 | let people finish before you overreact |
| 22:56.40 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: tried it |
| 22:56.43 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, that's a feature of your OS |
| 22:56.48 | Tupone | nvidia does not provide glu AFAIK |
| 22:56.49 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, learn your OS |
| 22:56.57 | JeffM2501 | no they don't since it just calls gl |
| 22:56.57 | *** join/#bzflag wegstar (n=foo@allegro/user/wegstar) |
| 22:57.00 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: urpmi --force libMesaGLU1 |
| 22:57.03 | Ice_Wewe | it doesn't work |
| 22:57.10 | JeffM2501 | on debian I've allways done the dev packages before the drivers |
| 22:57.17 | JeffM2501 | so they are in when nvidia puts it's stuff in |
| 22:57.28 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: rpm does not work too ? |
| 22:57.35 | JeffM2501 | your package manager is probably freaking that the default GL stuff got replaced, thats why it won't put the core in |
| 22:57.39 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: where would I get the package? |
| 22:57.58 | Tupone | I think you already have |
| 22:58.07 | Tupone | is some directory |
| 22:58.15 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: no, the package is in the urpmi database |
| 22:58.19 | Tupone | find / -name \*GLU*.rpm |
| 22:58.27 | Ice_Wewe | /usr/share/doc/libMesaGLU1-5.0.2 |
| 22:58.49 | Tupone | don't use locate do a find |
| 22:59.04 | Ice_Wewe | finding |
| 22:59.53 | Ice_Wewe | nothing... |
| 23:00.46 | Ice_Wewe | Mesa is not installed, is that why? |
| 23:01.02 | Tupone | probably |
| 23:01.02 | bryjen | NV's .run installer has an --uninstall option, no? |
| 23:01.17 | bryjen | or .bin or whatever they call it |
| 23:01.37 | Ice_Wewe | oh sh*t, I just uninstalled it, while I'm using it |
| 23:01.39 | JeffM2501 | it does |
| 23:02.34 | Tupone | http://bzflag.tupone.dyndns.org/glu.h |
| 23:02.50 | Tupone | try that :( |
| 23:02.54 | Ice_Wewe | well I was able to install a Mesa package |
| 23:02.56 | *** part/#bzflag bryjen (n=bryjen@63.147.94.151) |
| 23:03.26 | Tupone | as a last chance ... try to install the GLU things before |
| 23:04.00 | Ice_Wewe | oho, somehting is very unhappy |
| 23:04.20 | Ice_Wewe | great, now I have more problems |
| 23:04.40 | Ice_Wewe | http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/21663 |
| 23:04.44 | Ice_Wewe | my problem |
| 23:05.07 | Ice_Wewe | oh man |
| 23:05.07 | JeffM2501 | did you remove SDL? |
| 23:05.09 | Ice_Wewe | no |
| 23:05.23 | JeffM2501 | when you removed the drivers, did you have it remove all things that used it? |
| 23:05.26 | Ice_Wewe | I just did "cp glu.h /usr/X11R6/lib/" |
| 23:05.34 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: don't think so |
| 23:05.41 | Ice_Wewe | I just did "cp glu.h /usr/X11R6/include" |
| 23:05.41 | JeffM2501 | think? or know? |
| 23:05.44 | Ice_Wewe | I just did "cp glu.h /usr/X11R6/include/GL/" |
| 23:05.47 | Ice_Wewe | think |
| 23:05.54 | JeffM2501 | that's not an uninstall |
| 23:05.56 | JeffM2501 | that is a copy |
| 23:06.06 | JeffM2501 | that did not cause your problem |
| 23:06.08 | Tupone | ok, Ice_Wewe paste the config.log not the message |
| 23:06.39 | JeffM2501 | maybe your being haxord and someone is removing your packages, to make room for pr0n |
| 23:06.44 | Ice_Wewe | http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/21665 |
| 23:07.08 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: there is NO pr0n on this computer, thats on the one with the larger HDD ;) |
| 23:07.25 | JeffM2501 | how do you know the hax0rs isn't puting pron on it |
| 23:07.43 | Ice_Wewe | I've got a gut feeling |
| 23:07.44 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: are you compiling 2.0.2 ? |
| 23:08.01 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: I ./configure ed it for Jeff's sake |
| 23:08.04 | JeffM2501 | that and 5$ will get you dinner at burger king |
| 23:08.07 | Tupone | I don't like to debug 2 version |
| 23:08.15 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: my current version is 2.0.3 |
| 23:08.21 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: the one thats working |
| 23:08.43 | Tupone | but that is not the one from the config.log To me config.log seems about 2.0.3 |
| 23:08.48 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: reinstall the nvidia driver? |
| 23:08.51 | JeffM2501 | I just asked you to try 2.0.2 to show that it wasn't the version, but something that was screwed on your system and your crys of "it used to work" meant jack. |
| 23:09.18 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, dude it's your computer, you know what you have and don't, I'd think you'd know what to reinstall |
| 23:09.20 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: the log is from 2.0.3 |
| 23:09.31 | Ice_Wewe | ok, brb, I have to kill X |
| 23:11.14 | *** join/#bzflag Ice_Wewe (n=Ice_Wewe@ppp-216-106-107-112.storm.ca) |
| 23:11.26 | Ice_Wewe | no luck :( |
| 23:11.41 | Tupone | perhaps I have to fix something in the configure. I bet you do not have anymore the libGLU |
| 23:11.42 | Tupone | #define VERSION "2.0.2.20050830" |
| 23:11.52 | Tupone | it is 2.0.2 :) |
| 23:12.02 | Tupone | I want the good config.log |
| 23:12.46 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, that's why I wanted him to try 2.0.2, I don't think it's a thing you have to do, he has problems before the changes. |
| 23:12.54 | JeffM2501 | I don't think he has any more GL stuff anymore |
| 23:13.01 | JeffM2501 | he did something that screwed it all up |
| 23:13.03 | Tupone | he has problem on his system |
| 23:13.08 | JeffM2501 | yes |
| 23:13.09 | JeffM2501 | yes he does |
| 23:13.11 | JeffM2501 | bad ones |
| 23:13.27 | JeffM2501 | taking it down to 2.0.2 removes a lot of the question |
| 23:13.51 | JeffM2501 | he should probably force the raw RPMS to resinstall |
| 23:13.59 | JeffM2501 | if he can even do that |
| 23:14.06 | Tupone | probably better a reinstall if he cannot fix that. He need above a standard installation GLU-dev things, SDL-dev and CURL-dev If I dont' forget anything |
| 23:14.15 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 23:14.23 | Ice_Wewe | what? |
| 23:14.30 | JeffM2501 | we are saing your screwed |
| 23:14.36 | JeffM2501 | and you need to get your packages reinstalled |
| 23:14.37 | Ice_Wewe | nice |
| 23:14.44 | JeffM2501 | cuss stuff is missing that you should have |
| 23:14.57 | JeffM2501 | 2.0.2 won't even build, so you have some core problems |
| 23:15.05 | Ice_Wewe | reboot? |
| 23:15.18 | JeffM2501 | you can try, but doubt it will change anything |
| 23:15.25 | Ice_Wewe | fix? |
| 23:15.29 | JeffM2501 | other then unload your video driver that I'll bet you remvoed |
| 23:15.31 | JeffM2501 | reinstall |
| 23:15.44 | Ice_Wewe | hmm..... no |
| 23:15.54 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: you can't blame bzflag. Probably you can blame us that have not a big HOWTO to explain how you can install bzflag on Mandrake. If someone pay us for doing probably we get some with spare time |
| 23:16.01 | *** join/#bzflag ipaq (n=ipaq@c529df873.cable.wanadoo.nl) |
| 23:16.02 | JeffM2501 | then go thru and force the package RPMS to reinstall |
| 23:16.19 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: what package? |
| 23:16.25 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, I'd say all of them |
| 23:16.33 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: oh |
| 23:16.55 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: want me to try in Fedora, and if it doesn't work, you'll take the blame? |
| 23:17.05 | JeffM2501 | there is no blame? |
| 23:17.07 | JeffM2501 | it's your computer |
| 23:17.09 | Ice_Wewe | >:P soggy fortune cookies |
| 23:17.11 | JeffM2501 | take responsibiltiy for it |
| 23:17.15 | Ice_Wewe | poo |
| 23:17.21 | JeffM2501 | we arn't here to support your OS |
| 23:17.28 | JeffM2501 | we just offer opinions |
| 23:17.29 | Ice_Wewe | guess that means I'll be stuck with 2.0.3 forever |
| 23:17.44 | Tupone | why ? |
| 23:17.45 | JeffM2501 | I dbout bzflag will even RUN in your current staate |
| 23:17.53 | Ice_Wewe | cause there is no way I'm reinstalling, I have to much stuff installed |
| 23:17.59 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, because he is too stuborn/lazy to fix it |
| 23:18.03 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: I'll take you up on that bet |
| 23:18.13 | JeffM2501 | and he dosn't want to have to think about fixing it himself |
| 23:18.24 | Ice_Wewe | haha, it works |
| 23:18.30 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 23:18.33 | Ice_Wewe | which means that I should be able to compile a new one |
| 23:18.34 | JeffM2501 | so you have the libs |
| 23:18.47 | JeffM2501 | bzflag dosn't use headers when it runs |
| 23:18.50 | JeffM2501 | only libs |
| 23:18.56 | JeffM2501 | if you don't have the headers it won't build |
| 23:19.08 | JeffM2501 | your errors showed you not having headers |
| 23:19.13 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, are you like 13? |
| 23:19.18 | *** join/#bzflag I_Died_Once (n=I_Died_O@pcp0010382004pcs.savana01.ga.comcast.net) |
| 23:19.19 | Tupone | what you did now ? |
| 23:19.29 | Tupone | except the dance :) |
| 23:19.32 | Ice_Wewe | JeffM2501: wanna talk to the guys in the Mandriva channel, they can answer your questions way more than I can |
| 23:19.34 | Ice_Wewe | rofl |
| 23:19.35 | Ice_Wewe | ok |
| 23:19.39 | Ice_Wewe | #mandriva |
| 23:19.41 | JeffM2501 | they know your age? |
| 23:19.46 | Ice_Wewe | maybe |
| 23:19.48 | JeffM2501 | hey I don't care about your OS |
| 23:19.52 | JeffM2501 | that's your job |
| 23:20.10 | JeffM2501 | I've never heard anything but problems on mandrake, that's why I didn't try it |
| 23:20.43 | I_Died_Once | I don't like mandrake or mandrive because they wamt $$$ for their good stuff. **** THAT |
| 23:21.01 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: I have gentoo now, and I can answer for it, partially. Need several machine to answer all installation question rapidly. |
| 23:21.17 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, send tupone your computer |
| 23:21.21 | JeffM2501 | so he can "fix" bzflag |
| 23:21.23 | JeffM2501 | yeah that's it |
| 23:21.30 | Ice_Wewe | rofl |
| 23:21.34 | Tupone | fix Mandriva installation :) |
| 23:21.37 | Tupone | not bzflag |
| 23:21.43 | JeffM2501 | by installing gentoo ;) |
| 23:21.47 | Ice_Wewe | where does he live, and he is paying for shipping, its heavy comp |
| 23:22.02 | Tupone | I'm a poor guy :( |
| 23:22.04 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, your problem, your responsibility, he's in italy |
| 23:22.04 | Ice_Wewe | I've been looking for someone to help me install it, its ****ing hard! |
| 23:22.09 | Ice_Wewe | serious? |
| 23:22.14 | JeffM2501 | yes |
| 23:22.17 | Ice_Wewe | thats is gonna be one killer bill! |
| 23:22.21 | JeffM2501 | why would I jest? |
| 23:22.30 | Ice_Wewe | how bout I send him my HDD...? |
| 23:22.30 | JeffM2501 | install debian, it's cake |
| 23:22.30 | I_Died_Once | forget Mandrive - try SuSE |
| 23:22.31 | TheLastSpartan | I've never heard of Mandrive - try SuSE, I_Died_Once! |
| 23:22.45 | Ice_Wewe | I've tried it, it sucks |
| 23:23.00 | I_Died_Once | No, SuSE rocks out... |
| 23:23.03 | JeffM2501 | then you have made your choice |
| 23:23.05 | JeffM2501 | and fix it |
| 23:23.09 | Ice_Wewe | SuCKs |
| 23:23.18 | JeffM2501 | children, stop it |
| 23:23.24 | Ice_Wewe | awwwww |
| 23:23.26 | I_Died_Once | what, did you try the 9.1 personal? |
| 23:23.29 | Ice_Wewe | yes |
| 23:23.34 | JeffM2501 | no OS wars |
| 23:23.37 | Ice_Wewe | *cough*suck*cough* |
| 23:23.44 | Tupone | hmm DTRemenak had Mandriva IIRC |
| 23:23.46 | JeffM2501 | just let him fix his busted packaged |
| 23:23.50 | I_Died_Once | they dropped the ball with 9.1 personal |
| 23:23.53 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, yeah he's used it |
| 23:24.06 | I_Died_Once | but 9/3 comes fully loaded |
| 23:24.07 | JeffM2501 | it's all about the sarge |
| 23:24.11 | I_Died_Once | thats 9.3 |
| 23:24.14 | Ice_Wewe | What??! says who? OS Wars, the next generation "No SuSE 100.5 sucks more than Mandrake 10.2" |
| 23:24.25 | Tupone | if he had the nvidia he could know how to fix it |
| 23:24.26 | JeffM2501 | now you are anoying me |
| 23:24.39 | Ice_Wewe | sorry |
| 23:24.40 | JeffM2501 | we've done what we can to help you with your problem |
| 23:24.41 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o Tupone] by ChanServ |
| 23:24.43 | JeffM2501 | we can't do anymore |
| 23:24.48 | I_Died_Once | so RPG's new racetosevel plugin is funked up |
| 23:24.52 | JeffM2501 | lets just leave it at that |
| 23:24.59 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: where could get the nvidia package? |
| 23:25.02 | JeffM2501 | I_Died_Once, supriesed? |
| 23:25.17 | I_Died_Once | if someone joins the server during a match, it crashes |
| 23:25.31 | JeffM2501 | he does many bad C++ errirs |
| 23:25.36 | Tupone | did you installed the GLU-dev package? |
| 23:25.44 | Tupone | english :( sry |
| 23:25.56 | I_Died_Once | JeffM2501 should be a decent guy and fix it for RPG so I can test it more |
| 23:26.05 | Ice_Wewe | hey Tupone: if I send you my HDD, will you fix it for me, and ship some good pasta back for me? |
| 23:26.14 | I_Died_Once | it gives duplicate notifications for EVERTYIHNG |
| 23:26.25 | JeffM2501 | I_Died_Once, I don't have his crurrent code, I'd look over it if he asked me, but he hasn't |
| 23:26.29 | Tupone | and wine too. Nothing else? |
| 23:26.40 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone: thats about it |
| 23:26.54 | I_Died_Once | wine is a nice software package |
| 23:27.15 | Tupone | it does not taste like good italian's |
| 23:27.58 | *** join/#bzflag mmu_man (i=revol@ALyon-253-1-23-177.w83-205.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 23:28.07 | Ice_Wewe | http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/21669 |
| 23:28.17 | Ice_Wewe | these are all the packages that contain glu |
| 23:28.58 | Ice_Wewe | should I OC my CPU by 25% OR 60? |
| 23:29.40 | Tupone | try to install the libMesaGLU1-devel |
| 23:30.06 | Tupone | now that you have removed the nvidia |
| 23:30.41 | Tupone | and don't do this things with X11 on. shut it down |
| 23:32.36 | Tupone | Ice_Wewe: do you have another Mandrake installation on a similar computer? |
| 23:34.55 | I_Died_Once | woot |
| 23:35.04 | Ice_Wewe | **** i CUT OPEN MY TOE |
| 23:35.13 | Ice_Wewe | aww sh*t, I got blood all over the carpet |
| 23:35.19 | Ice_Wewe | owwww |
| 23:35.20 | JeffM2501 | dude please watch the language |
| 23:35.23 | Ice_Wewe | sorry |
| 23:35.27 | Ice_Wewe | its really bleeding a lot |
| 23:35.36 | JeffM2501 | then stop typing and fix it |
| 23:35.42 | Tupone | we cannot do anything sorry |
| 23:35.44 | Ice_Wewe | I'm trying |
| 23:35.47 | Ice_Wewe | ow |
| 23:35.49 | JeffM2501 | this isn't the childrens comedy hour |
| 23:35.49 | Ice_Wewe | ok |
| 23:35.53 | Ice_Wewe | Tupone, yes I do |
| 23:35.55 | JeffM2501 | freaking drama queens |
| 23:36.12 | Ice_Wewe | brb gotta get the blood out of the carpet |
| 23:37.27 | *** join/#bzflag triclops (n=triclops@203-173-49-49.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 23:41.54 | Ice_Wewe | how do you clean blood out of white carpet? |
| 23:42.16 | purple_cow | hehe, childrens comedy hour |
| 23:42.22 | Ice_Wewe | I'm not kidding |
| 23:42.34 | JeffM2501 | Ice_Wewe, go ask your mom |
| 23:42.34 | Ice_Wewe | I have a bloody spot on my carpet I gotta clean off |
| 23:42.41 | Ice_Wewe | brb |
| 23:43.10 | Tupone | that is a bzflag support channel only. go to #clean&wash |
| 23:43.21 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, why do we even bother? |
| 23:43.57 | Tupone | dunno :( I like to fix things. I have to learn how to fix human still |
| 23:44.15 | JeffM2501 | you need to use more hamers when fixing humans |
| 23:49.20 | *** join/#bzflag wegstar_ (n=foo@adsl-69-109-212-188.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 23:52.23 | brlcad | could just act like the good 'ol days of irc |
| 23:52.44 | brlcad | tell them to just stfu |
| 23:53.06 | JeffM2501 | but we are modern, we have /ban +q |
| 23:53.08 | JeffM2501 | ;) |
| 23:53.15 | JeffM2501 | or mode +q |
| 23:53.31 | JeffM2501 | stfu makes them cry |
| 23:53.37 | JeffM2501 | then they call mom and we get suid |
| 23:53.43 | brlcad | there is some fun to that |
| 23:54.24 | JeffM2501 | there wen't as many homeschoolers back in the days of good 'ol IRC ether |
| 23:54.30 | JeffM2501 | just dropouts |
| 23:57.14 | JeffM2501 | and types ow, instead of saying it |
| 23:57.19 | menotume | lol |
| 23:57.20 | blast007 | menotume: by sticking it into an 80mm fan ;) |
| 23:57.23 | JeffM2501 | probably stuck foot in fan |
| 23:57.28 | menotume | hehe |