irclog2html for #bzflag on 20030330

`00:03.56`	`bzgirl`	`what is the oldest client that can connect to a 1.7g1 server?`
`00:04.18`	`Pat221-Laptop`	`e2 i think`
`00:04.31`	`bzgirl`	`ok`
`00:07.07`	`*** join/#bzflag lurgyman_ (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU)`
`00:07.44`	`*** part/#bzflag Skipp_ (vcpfz236@dialup-67.25.201.178.Dial1.Denver1.Level3.net)`
`00:10.23`	`Chestal`	`we'll switch to daylight savings time ths night`
`00:10.25`	`Chestal`	`I hate that`
`00:10.50`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Where do you live?`
`00:11.06`	`Chestal`	`Germany`
`00:11.12`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ahh`
`00:11.14`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:)`
`00:14.20`	`*** part/#bzflag bzgirl (~brat@toronto-hs-64-26-176-61.d-ip.magma.ca)`
`00:16.43`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Everyone's busy! :(`
`00:16.52`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`No one to help me with my site...`
`00:26.39`	`Pat221-Laptop`	`?`
`01:04.04`	`*** join/#bzflag BaDiN (Paramount@adslsapo-b3-254-16.telepac.pt)`
`01:50.26`	`*** join/#bzflag BaDiN (Paramount@adslsapo-b3-254-16.telepac.pt)`
`01:50.41`	`BaDiN`	`any teams around?`
`01:51.15`	`*** join/#bzflag GenRommel (~gene@24-193-121-4.nj.rr.com)`
`01:51.39`	`*** join/#bzflag BaDiN (Paramount@adslsapo-b3-254-16.telepac.pt)`
`01:53.16`	`BaDiN`	`any teams to play?`
`02:01.21`	`*** join/#bzflag DB7654321 (~DB7654321@chcgil2-ar7-4-3-185-179.chcgil2.dsl-verizon.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:02.01`	`*** join/#bzflag snyke (~snyke@eros.bingo-ev.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:05.11`	`*** join/#bzflag Chestal (thilo@vmax.unix-ag.uni-siegen.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:05.11`	`*** join/#bzflag lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:05.11`	`*** join/#bzflag MrCooper (~daenzer@dclient80-218-113-11.hispeed.ch) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:05.11`	`*** join/#bzflag [dmp] (~somewhere@0x50c4919b.adsl-fixed.tele.dk) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:05.11`	`*** join/#bzflag Noodlebot (~noodlebot@bc183148.bendcable.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:05.11`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o Chestal] by leguin.freenode.net`
`02:15.40`	`*** part/#bzflag BaDiN (Paramount@adslsapo-b3-254-16.telepac.pt)`
`02:36.59`	`*** join/#bzflag tenacious_d (~relyons@c-66-56-44-155.atl.client2.attbi.com)`
`02:40.49`	`*** join/#bzflag [STC]_creeperz (creeperz@host-178-78-220-24.midco.net)`
`02:41.11`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`This retard is going to make a game!`
`02:41.18`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Who's going to help me...?`
`02:41.23`	`Patlabor221`	`?`
`02:41.26`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Heh`
`02:42.04`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I've been thinking...And getting chunks of Doritoes out of my nose... But nonetheless thinking that this would be a great learning experience for me!`
`02:42.51`	`Patlabor221`	`what are you going to make?`
`02:42.57`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`But, I am probally going to test with edited BZFlag source, first. Experiment with new things`
`02:43.07`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Not sure yet`
`02:43.15`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Something like screamers`
`02:43.26`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`But more like project 2015`
`02:43.32`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Is that it?`
`02:43.35`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`2015?`
`02:43.37`	`Patlabor221`	`how are they difrent?`
`02:43.39`	`Patlabor221`	`2501`
`02:43.51`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Screamers are floaty thingies`
`02:44.04`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`And no flags :) (just kidding)`
`02:44.10`	`Patlabor221`	`only cus that's the way the current game logic class has them`
`02:44.16`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I know`
`02:44.26`	`Patlabor221`	`and Franks tanks are also floating`
`02:44.35`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Oh well`
`02:44.40`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`That game looks cool`
`02:45.07`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`But that's off of the subject. I want to make a game...But am too mentally incompetent`
`02:45.19`	`Patlabor221`	`you should learn to program`
`02:45.23`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I know`
`02:45.32`	`Patlabor221`	`or do the dark basic thing`
`02:45.35`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`And this is a great learning experience`
`02:45.40`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`What?`
`02:45.46`	`Patlabor221`	`dark basic`
`02:45.46`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Dark basic thing?`
`02:45.55`	`Patlabor221`	`it's a prgaming language`
`02:46.01`	`Patlabor221`	`that set up for simple game like things`
`02:46.16`	`Patlabor221`	`actualy doing a game as your first programing thing is kinda silly`
`02:46.24`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I know :)`
`02:46.36`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`So is having a check card when you're 13`
`02:46.51`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`That and getting Doritoes stuck in your nose`
`02:47.00`	`Patlabor221`	`you should learn the basics first`
`02:47.03`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`...But that hurts`
`02:47.06`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Yes`
`02:47.18`	`Patlabor221`	`or the dark basic thing`
`02:47.23`	`Patlabor221`	`they set up a lot for you`
`02:47.36`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I am looking through the BZFlag source...I think I can modify it enough...Like how you did to Zero`
`02:47.40`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ok`
`02:47.45`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Dark Basic`
`02:47.49`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`What IS it?`
`02:47.54`	`Patlabor221`	`good luck changing the models :)`
`02:47.58`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Heh`
`02:48.05`	`Patlabor221`	`DB is a programing language.`
`02:48.10`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Not going in THAT far`
`02:48.12`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I know`
`02:48.13`	`Patlabor221`	`made for realtime 3d simulations`
`02:48.17`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Now do I do it?`
`02:48.35`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`How*`
`02:48.41`	`Patlabor221`	`how do you do what?`
`02:48.50`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Make with DB`
`02:48.55`	`Patlabor221`	`get it`
`02:48.57`	`Patlabor221`	`learn it`
`02:48.58`	`Patlabor221`	`use it`
`02:48.59`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Where?`
`02:49.04`	`Patlabor221`	`guess`
`02:49.15`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`darkbasic.org`
`02:49.21`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`www.darkbasic.org`
`02:49.26`	`Patlabor221`	`close but no cigar`
`02:49.31`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`.com`
`02:49.39`	`Patlabor221`	`yes, he can be taught`
`02:49.47`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`It is too :)`
`02:49.55`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`.org is right`
`02:50.27`	`Patlabor221`	`ahh they registerd that too`
`02:50.35`	`Patlabor221`	`well they are not a NPO`
`02:50.38`	`Patlabor221`	`they are a FPO`
`02:50.56`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Hmm?`
`02:51.25`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I;m downloading the trial first`
`02:51.30`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I'm*`
`02:51.40`	`Patlabor221`	`that was the entire point :)`
`02:51.53`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I think I'm getting better at image editing...`
`02:51.57`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Zoom :)`
`02:52.04`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`www.creeperz.com/pixel.gif`
`02:52.35`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`?`
`02:52.44`	`Patlabor221`	`the gray of your image background dosn't match the gray of your page`
`02:52.52`	`Patlabor221`	`you should make it transperant`
`02:52.56`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Yea`
`02:53.04`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Oopz!`
`02:53.12`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I made my 404 error my home :)`
`02:53.22`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`www.creeperz.com/pixel.jpg`
`02:53.31`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Heh`
`02:53.35`	`Patlabor221`	`what is that?`
`02:53.40`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`It's an improvement!`
`02:53.45`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I don't know...`
`02:53.48`	`Patlabor221`	`it's a very small gradient`
`02:53.57`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I know`
`02:54.05`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`But I'm getting better`
`02:54.39`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`And I might make it my bg color`
`02:54.53`	`Patlabor221`	`a blend from black to white?`
`02:54.55`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Do you know how to make an image your bg? Static image`
`02:55.01`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Black to gray`
`02:55.02`	`doughecka`	`<boing>`
`02:55.06`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Light gray :)`
`02:55.10`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I know`
`02:55.15`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`But that didn't work`
`02:55.16`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah background = "http://my image" in the body tag`
`02:55.25`	`doughecka`	`doh, wonder why`
`02:55.26`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ahh`
`02:55.32`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Doh, why?`
`02:55.44`	`doughecka`	`scanline suggested it`
`02:55.46`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`You said the work "is" 500 times...`
`02:55.49`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I think...`
`02:55.58`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Heh :)`
`02:56.16`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`<backgroung="pixel.jpg">?`
`02:58.05`	`Patlabor221`	`no you know how you have a <body> tag?`
`02:58.23`	`Patlabor221`	`<body background="pixel.jpg" >`
`02:58.44`	`Patlabor221`	`and it's gonna repleat and look very very ugly`
`02:59.19`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Oh`
`02:59.20`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Got it`
`02:59.30`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Hmmmm`
`02:59.33`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ok`
`02:59.41`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I'm going to read up on DB`
`03:00.19`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Can you get me started?`
`03:00.46`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`...or not...`
`03:06.45`	`Patlabor221`	`?`
`03:07.03`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`NvM`
`03:12.03`	`Patlabor221`	`damned 8 bit textures`
`03:15.58`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Jeff: The coding looks ALOT harder than C++`
`03:16.13`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Much harder, in-fact`
`03:16.14`	`Patlabor221`	`never used it myself, just hear it's realy easy`
`03:16.17`	`Patlabor221`	`how so?`
`03:16.23`	`Patlabor221`	`should be the basic language`
`03:16.58`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`C++ defines pretty much everything that goes on... this is all in one big file, C++ is in several`
`03:17.08`	`Patlabor221`	`ohh that's just how they did it`
`03:17.13`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`?`
`03:17.20`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Put it all together?`
`03:17.23`	`Patlabor221`	`you know C dosn't have features like "make me a tank right here"`
`03:17.29`	`Patlabor221`	`sure you can do that in C as well`
`03:17.39`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`?`
`03:17.43`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Whatever`
`03:17.52`	`Patlabor221`	`looks rather simple`
`03:17.53`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I'm going to look at some code again...`
`03:17.56`	`Patlabor221`	`normal basic stuff`
`03:18.02`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ok`
`03:18.02`	`Patlabor221`	`do while loops`
`03:18.04`	`Patlabor221`	`ifs`
`03:18.07`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`?`
`03:18.20`	`Patlabor221`	`standard programing concepts`
`03:18.34`	`Patlabor221`	`you know, the functions to do IF/THEN/ELSE tests`
`03:18.36`	`Patlabor221`	`LOOPS`
`03:18.54`	`doughecka`	`while [STC]_creeperz beats head on desk then get pillow`
`03:19.01`	`doughecka`	`see?`
`03:19.03`	`doughecka`	`:P`
`03:19.13`	`doughecka`	`else take pillow away`
`03:19.19`	`Patlabor221`	`there are a number of basic programing concepts that you will have to get down`
`03:19.25`	`Patlabor221`	`no mater what language you use`
`03:19.32`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`English...`
`03:19.33`	`Patlabor221`	`variables`
`03:19.35`	`Patlabor221`	`booleans`
`03:19.36`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`;)`
`03:19.40`	`Patlabor221`	`IF tests`
`03:19.43`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ahh`
`03:19.44`	`Patlabor221`	`those kind of things`
`03:20.06`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Like some HTML? ...Not HTML...Something else`
`03:20.14`	`Patlabor221`	`huh?`
`03:20.23`	`Patlabor221`	`HTML is not a programing langage`
`03:20.29`	`Patlabor221`	`it's a page descriptor`
`03:20.36`	`Patlabor221`	`says how something looks`
`03:20.39`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`[if:something] Yadeeyah [endif:something]`
`03:20.39`	`Patlabor221`	`dosn't infer logic`
`03:20.52`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I know`
`03:20.55`	`Patlabor221`	`yes, but that is jscript`
`03:21.01`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Oh`
`03:21.10`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`js is weird`
`03:21.13`	`Patlabor221`	`jscript is a type of programing language that most browsers read`
`03:21.19`	`Patlabor221`	`it's a lot like C`
`03:21.20`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I know`
`03:21.36`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ahhh`
`03:21.37`	`Patlabor221`	`java has it's syntax like C`
`03:21.44`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Yes?`
`03:21.50`	`Patlabor221`	`yes`
`03:21.55`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Cool`
`03:22.06`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I'm going to get back to DB`
`03:22.29`	`Patlabor221`	`or you could do one of those point and clike game engine thingy`
`03:22.35`	`Patlabor221`	`"no programing required"`
`03:25.07`	`doughecka`	`ugh`
`03:25.32`	`Patlabor221`	`I think you and doug and spif should have a game progrmaing contest`
`03:26.02`	`doughecka`	`and give me books`
`03:26.05`	`doughecka`	`and stuff`
`03:26.06`	`doughecka`	`:)`
`03:26.41`	`doughecka`	`bleh, after helping my dad replace the master cylinder, the front brakes dont work any more`
`03:29.34`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Heh`
`03:29.42`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I might be able to help in that area`
`03:29.46`	`doughecka`	`oh`
`03:29.49`	`doughecka`	`we figured it out`
`03:29.52`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Oh`
`03:29.59`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ford?`
`03:30.02`	`doughecka`	`mazda`
`03:30.06`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ahh`
`03:30.13`	`doughecka`	`my dads is a mazda`
`03:30.15`	`doughecka`	`mine is a VW`
`03:30.27`	`doughecka`	`a type 3 fastback`
`03:30.31`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`'90`
`03:30.35`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Cool`
`03:30.39`	`doughecka`	`aircooled engine`
`03:30.41`	`doughecka`	`one belt`
`03:30.42`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I have a '73 Ford`
`03:30.46`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Air?`
`03:30.50`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Woah...`
`03:30.51`	`doughecka`	`bleh`
`03:30.53`	`doughecka`	`who needs air?`
`03:31.00`	`doughecka`	`the engine is in the back`
`03:31.10`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I know :)`
`03:31.12`	`Patlabor221`	`you would if you lived here :)`
`03:31.17`	`doughecka`	`Patlabor221: nah`
`03:31.28`	`doughecka`	`no engine upfront making hot air`
`03:31.29`	`doughecka`	`:)`
`03:31.30`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I also have a '91 Chrysler LeBaron`
`03:31.38`	`Patlabor221`	`so your ok with the outside air being 115?`
`03:31.46`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Heh :)`
`03:31.54`	`Patlabor221`	`in the shade`
`03:32.11`	`doughecka`	`Patlabor221: as long as the humidity is OK I am fine with that`
`03:32.21`	`doughecka`	`but 90 in florida? ugh`
`03:32.26`	`Patlabor221`	`it's dry here`
`03:32.34`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Are you ok with walking out side to your mailbox wairing most of the clothing you can find and still almost freeze?`
`03:32.38`	`Patlabor221`	`you would cry like litle babby`
`03:32.48`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I wouldn't!`
`03:32.51`	`doughecka`	`yes, I can stand heat, but humidity kills me`
`03:32.57`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Same`
`03:33.06`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Washington is pretty humid`
`03:33.19`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Live there for a year or three!`
`03:33.35`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Then you'll feel hot AND COLD!`
`03:33.42`	`doughecka`	`hm`
`03:33.51`	`Patlabor221`	`define hot?`
`03:33.59`	`doughecka`	`kentucky is the same, though it doesnt get too cold`
`03:34.14`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Hot: "Don't touch the stove, son. It may burn you"`
`03:34.56`	`doughecka`	`hot = going outside and having the air handle melt the skin to your bones`
`03:35.23`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`hot: frying an egg on a sidewalk...a molten sidewalk`
`03:35.34`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`That's hot`
`03:35.47`	`Patlabor221`	`have you ever done that?`
`03:35.54`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Yes`
`03:36.00`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`But I got yelled at`
`03:36.03`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`It works!`
`03:36.07`	`doughecka`	`a molten sidewalk?`
`03:36.09`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I fed it to my dog`
`03:36.11`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Yea`
`03:36.16`	`doughecka`	`I see.`
`03:36.21`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`So hot outside that it melted the cement`
`03:36.27`	`doughecka`	`riight`
`03:36.33`	`Patlabor221`	`hmm that happens at about 400 deg`
`03:36.51`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`...My dog died 3 days later from food poisoning J\|K`
`03:36.55`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`You die!`
`03:37.01`	`doughecka`	`Patlabor221: well, his dome got hot and after that he cant think strait`
`03:37.48`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:)`
`03:37.53`	`doughecka`	`a... gang?`
`03:37.58`	`Patlabor221`	`a gang?`
`03:38.03`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Heh`
`03:38.15`	`doughecka`	`exept chain gangs cleaning the highway`
`03:38.16`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`You heard me, foo Blood!`
`03:38.51`	`Patlabor221`	`foo blood?`
`03:39.09`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`U Neade two git sum krakc nd kooke it`
`03:39.11`	`doughecka`	`people dont even come up to my house at holloween`
`03:39.24`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:(`
`03:39.28`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`You poor thing`
`03:39.31`	`doughecka`	`I get all the candy then`
`03:39.38`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I scare the little crutons!`
`03:39.43`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I am a cruton`
`03:39.47`	`doughecka`	`~dict crutons`
`03:39.50`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I go on salad`
`03:39.57`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~spell cruton`
`03:39.59`		`possible spellings for cruton: crouton cretin Cretan Groton croutons carton crating cretonne Briton Carlton Triton coroutine crayon triton Creon croon curtain curating Cristin crufting crusting Creighton Cotton cotton Breton Canton Caxton canton cartoon creating crudding grouting proton`
`03:40.06`	`doughecka`	`its french`
`03:40.07`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~dict crouton`
`03:40.22`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`That would explain the o :)`
`03:40.39`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Lol, Freedom croutons`
`03:40.41`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:)`
`03:41.03`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I pissed off a worker at BK`
`03:41.32`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I asked for FRENCH fries. They said "We don't have french fries, we have Freedom fries, though."`
`03:41.44`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I said "What are freedom fries?"`
`03:41.59`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`"Oh, they're French Fries with a different name"`
`03:42.08`	`doughecka`	`this is what my car looks like: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/index.mv?photo+71939.jpg`
`03:42.25`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`"No thank you. You guys must suck big time if you don't have any french fries"`
`03:42.29`	`doughecka`	`more rust and not lowered, and no roof rack`
`03:42.44`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`1939?`
`03:42.53`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`N\|M`
`03:42.54`	`doughecka`	`1969`
`03:43.09`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Cool`
`03:44.25`	`doughecka`	`das peoples wagon`
`03:44.49`	`doughecka`	`hmm, I could learn a: morse code b: C++ c: german`
`03:45.24`	`Patlabor221`	`why only 1?`
`03:45.37`	`doughecka`	`or all three`
`03:45.41`	`doughecka`	`but not at the same time`
`03:45.41`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Morse Code is easy :)`
`03:45.49`	`doughecka`	`[STC]_creeperz: not for 50 WPM`
`03:45.50`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`German is just...Stupid`
`03:45.51`	`Patlabor221`	`so is C++`
`03:45.54`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Oh`
`03:45.56`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:)`
`03:46.09`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`C++ is fairly complicated, though`
`03:46.15`	`Patlabor221`	`huh?`
`03:46.25`	`Patlabor221`	`not the language itself`
`03:47.00`	`Patlabor221`	`functions, classes, variables, and some if statments and your good`
`03:47.18`	`Patlabor221`	`the rest is not part of the language`
`03:47.36`	`captain_proton`	`templates are part of the language ;)`
`03:47.40`	`Patlabor221`	`true`
`03:47.46`	`Patlabor221`	`wasn't gonna scare him tho :)`
`03:47.59`	`doughecka`	`lol`
`03:48.14`	`Patlabor221`	`and you can learn the lang with out using templates`
`03:48.17`	`captain_proton`	`hehe`
`03:48.31`	`Patlabor221`	`everything else is an API to something`
`03:49.21`	`Patlabor221`	`I've never actualy made a template`
`03:49.24`	`Patlabor221`	`just use them`
`03:49.28`	`doughecka`	`heh`
`03:49.42`	`Patlabor221`	`that is what STL is there for`
`03:49.45`	`captain_proton`	`tell 1 sure`
`03:49.45`	`captain_proton`	`eek`
`03:50.20`	`doughecka`	`whats a GOOD way of learning C++... how did YOU learn it?`
`03:50.41`	`Patlabor221`	`got the C primer`
`03:50.43`	`Patlabor221`	`read`
`03:50.47`	`Patlabor221`	`made some stuff`
`03:50.50`	`Patlabor221`	`asked questions`
`03:50.53`	`Patlabor221`	`made more stuff`
`03:50.53`	`doughecka`	`primer?`
`03:50.57`	`Patlabor221`	`it's a book`
`03:51.04`	`Patlabor221`	`looked at some code`
`03:51.11`	`Patlabor221`	`repeat`
`03:51.15`	`doughecka`	`cool`
`03:51.56`	`*** join/#bzflag captain_proton (~jupiter@aden2-23-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`03:52.28`	`*** join/#bzflag captain_proton (~jupiter@aden2-23-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`03:52.32`	`doughecka`	`portburst!`
`03:52.41`	`Patlabor221`	`just bust out a helo world`
`03:52.44`	`doughecka`	`bah`
`03:52.45`	`Patlabor221`	`and start tweaking`
`03:52.53`	`Patlabor221`	`void main (void)`
`03:52.54`	`Patlabor221`	`{`
`03:53.04`	`doughecka`	`hm`
`03:53.06`	`Patlabor221`	`printf("hello world\n");`
`03:53.07`	`Patlabor221`	`}`
`03:53.16`	`*** join/#bzflag evil_enchilada (~jupiter@aden2-23-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU)`
`03:53.24`	`doughecka`	`basic = PRINT "hello world"`
`03:53.34`	`Patlabor221`	`yup very simialar`
`03:53.35`	`doughecka`	`cobol = 2 pages of stuff`
`03:53.56`	`Patlabor221`	`but basic don't have clases :)`
`03:54.01`	`Patlabor221`	`and pointers`
`03:54.02`	`doughecka`	`java is the cobol of the new milliniam`
`03:54.04`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`03:54.21`	`Patlabor221`	`actualy java is like c for dummies`
`03:54.21`	`doughecka`	`even though QBASIC 5 got pretty close to all that stuff`
`03:54.59`	`doughecka`	`hm`
`03:55.47`	`Patlabor221`	`hmmm, cap ponderince for you`
`03:56.15`	`captain_proton`	`shoot`
`03:56.29`	`doughecka`	`darn`
`03:56.34`	`Patlabor221`	`would it work if I "burned in" ( aka set vertex colors ) for all the static lights in a scene, on all the static objets, then just used GL to do they dynamic lights`
`03:56.54`	`Patlabor221`	`would that mix the same way?`
`03:57.00`	`captain_proton`	`no i don't think so`
`03:57.08`	`Patlabor221`	`I had a feeling it wouldn't`
`03:57.16`	`captain_proton`	`because the vertex colors would make the dynamic lights 'reflect' that color`
`03:57.22`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah`
`03:57.47`	`Patlabor221`	`so it's ether all or nothing`
`03:58.10`	`Patlabor221`	`gl dosn't have enough lights`
`03:58.20`	`doughecka`	`heh`
`03:59.25`	`Patlabor221`	`I'll just have to fake it, wonder if there is a performance hit for changing lights per ojbect`
`04:00.59`	`Patlabor221`	`or I could BZ cheat and just do the 8 closest lights to you`
`04:01.11`	`doughecka`	`heh`
`04:01.17`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Heh`
`04:01.33`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Uugh`
`04:01.48`	`captain_proton`	`Patlabor221: there are performance hits on any state change`
`04:01.52`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`My stupid friend was going to type something really stupid`
`04:02.00`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`He's gay`
`04:02.04`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Seriously`
`04:02.09`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah but how much`
`04:02.14`	`captain_proton`	`damnit doughecka`
`04:02.23`	`doughecka`	`captain_proton: ?`
`04:02.24`	`captain_proton`	`learn the difference between wonder and wander`
`04:02.35`	`Patlabor221`	`and boasting is a sin :)`
`04:02.38`	`captain_proton`	`or else you just come off looking like a stupid kid cough`
`04:03.01`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`a;sldkfjjfkdls;a`
`04:03.16`	`doughecka`	`Patlabor221: a... sin?`
`04:03.25`	`Patlabor221`	`sure`
`04:03.44`	`Patlabor221`	`blue or red?`
`04:03.50`	`doughecka`	`or yeller`
`04:03.50`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`BLUE!`
`04:04.04`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Blue and yellow, pruple pills`
`04:04.17`	`doughecka`	`too many pills for [STC]_creeperz`
`04:04.17`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Little round, white ones`
`04:04.18`	`Patlabor221`	`sigh he dosn't get it`
`04:04.26`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`The Matrix`
`04:04.29`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`?`
`04:04.33`	`Patlabor221`	`there you go`
`04:04.36`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Heh`
`04:04.42`	`doughecka`	`who watches the matrix?`
`04:04.45`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I did`
`04:04.56`	`doughecka`	`EVERYBODY SHOULD SEE TOY STORY!`
`04:04.59`	`Patlabor221`	`a large number of people have`
`04:05.01`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`SD.com has a good remake of the matrix :)`
`04:05.06`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Same!`
`04:05.11`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`www.stickdeath.com`
`04:05.20`	`Patlabor221`	`that's not a matrix remix`
`04:05.31`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`re-make\`
`04:05.34`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`kinda`
`04:05.35`	`doughecka`	`drink up, the worlds about to end!`
`04:05.36`	`Patlabor221`	`nor that`
`04:05.40`	`Patlabor221`	`it's stickfigure`
`04:05.46`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I know :)`
`04:05.51`	`Patlabor221`	`pure and simple kung fu`
`04:06.04`	`Patlabor221`	`yuen wuu ping syle`
`04:06.09`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`The dude gets shot in the...well, let's just say he lost his "dude" status`
`04:06.38`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Tae Kwon Leap :)`
`04:06.50`	`Patlabor221`	`that is before your time`
`04:06.57`	`Patlabor221`	`mr 1990`
`04:07.41`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~boot doug`
`04:07.43`		`ACTION says "boot to the head" to doug and knocks him over`
`04:07.51`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Heh`
`04:07.55`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`1990?`
`04:08.09`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`What about 1990?`
`04:08.11`	`doughecka`	`thick even`
`04:08.50`	`Patlabor221`	`ether that or 1989 was your birth year`
`04:08.52`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Red Faction is a great game :)`
`04:08.55`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`1989`
`04:08.57`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Yea`
`04:09.11`	`Patlabor221`	`hmm or I could go play zelda`
`04:09.20`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Or DAOC`
`04:09.30`	`Patlabor221`	`nahhh not today`
`04:09.31`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`RF2`
`04:09.33`	`captain_proton`	`Patlabor221: i wanna see the graphics on that zelda game`
`04:09.35`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Heh`
`04:09.46`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Neither do I!`
`04:09.48`	`doughecka`	`RTFM`
`04:09.54`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Me?`
`04:09.55`	`Patlabor221`	`I think gamespy has some screenys`
`04:09.58`	`Patlabor221`	`but it's prety good`
`04:10.06`	`Patlabor221`	`it realy is an interactive toon`
`04:10.52`	`captain_proton`	`what was that one we were looking at screenies of a long time ago? dragons lair something?`
`04:11.05`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah`
`04:11.13`	`Patlabor221`	`that was good cell shading`
`04:11.16`	`Patlabor221`	`game sucked tho`
`04:11.24`	`Patlabor221`	`like assbery pancakes`
`04:11.29`	`captain_proton`	`haha`
`04:11.35`	`doughecka`	`ugh`
`04:12.20`	`Patlabor221`	`www.bakadigital.com/zelda first commercial.mpeg`
`04:12.24`	`Patlabor221`	`you need to see that cap`
`04:12.31`	`Patlabor221`	`ohh how far we have come`
`04:12.34`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah soory`
`04:12.40`	`Patlabor221`	`I can rename`
`04:13.01`	`Patlabor221`	`there no spaces`
`04:14.30`	`Patlabor221`	`wasn't there a zelda comercial where link was just shouting "ZELLLDA!" ?`
`04:14.48`	`Patlabor221`	`or maybe I am thinking mortal combat :)`
`04:14.53`	`captain_proton`	`Patlabor221: hehe`
`04:15.29`	`Patlabor221`	`I never thought I would hear "nice graphics" and "8 bit system" in the same comercial`
`04:15.37`	`doughecka`	`lol`
`04:16.01`	`*** join/#bzflag Pat221-Laptop (~jeffm@adsl-64-172-198-120.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net)`
`04:28.28`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`YAWN`
`04:30.02`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Also from The Matrix :)`
`04:30.19`	`captain_proton`	`welcome to Rivendal, Mr Anderson`
`04:30.22`	`captain_proton`	`thats a cool song`
`04:30.23`	`captain_proton`	`=)`
`04:30.37`	`MrAnderson`	`welcome to rivendell mr. bagins`
`04:30.47`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Rivendal...Cool place. I've been there! ;)`
`04:31.18`	`MrAnderson`	`we almost shouted that during a showing`
`04:31.31`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`What?`
`04:31.50`	`MrAnderson`	`welcome to rivendell mr bagins`
`04:32.04`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`This is what you are doing. This is what I WANT you to be doing`
`04:32.58`	`captain_proton`	`i think thats the song`
`04:33.33`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Let's all get together and make a web browser that we can sell for crap-loads of money?! :)`
`04:33.42`	`captain_proton`	`uh`
`04:33.44`	`captain_proton`	`right`
`04:33.45`	`captain_proton`	`you do that`
`04:33.48`	`captain_proton`	`i'll watch`
`04:33.48`	`MrAnderson`	`huh`
`04:33.52`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`lol`
`04:36.43`	`MrAnderson`	`have you ever payed money for a browser?`
`04:37.04`	`captain_proton`	`i did once`
`04:37.15`	`MrAnderson`	`opera?`
`04:37.19`	`captain_proton`	`mosaic`
`04:38.01`	`MrAnderson`	`was it worth it?`
`04:38.10`	`captain_proton`	`well`
`04:38.15`	`captain_proton`	`it meant i got a web browser at home`
`04:38.34`	`captain_proton`	`and it was cheaper than netscape at the time`
`04:38.41`	`captain_proton`	`then netscape started giving it away`
`04:38.49`	`MrAnderson`	`ahhh`
`04:39.02`	`MrAnderson`	`pre free`
`04:42.49`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Hmm`
`04:43.48`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`YAWN`
`04:49.40`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`WEll`
`04:49.42`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Well*`
`04:55.00`	`*** join/#bzflag TimRiker (~timr@proxyle02.ext.ti.com)`
`04:56.13`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Hey, Tim`
`04:56.24`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`You're not Op-ed`
`04:56.26`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:)`
`04:57.02`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ok, Tim`
`04:57.09`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`See yu around`
`05:02.49`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ`
`05:18.17`	`*** join/#bzflag lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU)`
`06:40.27`	`Noodleman`	`moo`
`09:26.53`	`*** join/#bzflag larsl (~larsl@c213-100-62-28.swipnet.se)`
`09:27.00`	`larsl`	`~country .bm`
`09:27.01`		`rumour has it, country .bm is bermuda`
`11:12.26`	`*** join/#bzflag MrCooper (~daenzer@dclient80-218-113-11.hispeed.ch)`
`11:15.22`	`*** join/#bzflag mmu_man (~revol@ALyon-202-1-1-56.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`14:41.53`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~idle Noodleman`
`14:42.09`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~seen Noodleman`
`14:42.09`		`noodleman is currently on #bzflag (2d 11h 33m 47s). Has said a total of 172 messages. Is idling for 8h 1m 42s`
`14:42.28`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~seen larsl`
`14:42.29`		`larsl is currently on #bzflag (5h 15m 36s). Has said a total of 1 messages. Is idling for 5h 15m 29s`
`14:42.40`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~seen TikRiker`
`14:42.40`		`i haven't seen 'tikriker', [STC]_creeperz`
`14:42.49`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~seen timriker`
`14:42.49`		`timriker <~timr@proxyle02.ext.ti.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #utah, 9h 1m 20s ago, saying: 'nite all'.`
`14:43.16`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I need to go`
`14:55.31`	`larsl`	`~seen TimRiker`
`14:55.34`		`timriker <~timr@proxyle02.ext.ti.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #utah, 9h 14m 5s ago, saying: 'nite all'.`
`14:56.09`	`larsl`	`I always miss him by a few hours. =P`
`14:57.01`	`larsl`	`I'm commiting the team flag timeout patch to CVS now, it's been tested for a while on bzgirl's server, no bugs found.`
`15:03.01`	`*** join/#bzflag BaDiN (Paramount@81.193.5.145)`
`15:03.08`	`*** part/#bzflag BaDiN (Paramount@81.193.5.145)`
`15:41.48`	`*** join/#bzflag [TeA\|TrEE] (~TeaZee@pD9E971D4.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`15:48.21`	`*** join/#bzflag ak\|ra (~mathias@p50883E47.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`15:49.47`	`ak\|ra`	`moin`
`16:17.06`	`[TeA\|TrEE]`	`huhu`
`16:36.33`	`[TeA\|TrEE]`	`~ducati5`
`16:36.48`	`[TeA\|TrEE]`	`~ducati6`
`16:52.33`	`*** join/#bzflag GenRommel (~gene@24-193-121-4.nj.rr.com)`
`17:00.31`	`*** join/#bzflag Cell (~Cell@pD9590DEE.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`17:00.42`	`*** part/#bzflag Cell (~Cell@pD9590DEE.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`17:04.47`	`*** join/#bzflag Patlabor221 (~JeffM@adsl-64-172-198-117.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net)`
`17:06.00`	`GenRommel`	`anybody alive here?`
`17:06.18`	`Patlabor221`	`define alive`
`17:08.21`	`GenRommel`	`how does bzflag.org look from your side? for me it's been terribly slow for the past 2 days. i'm on roadrunner`
`17:08.21`	`larsl`	`It seems OK to me.`
`17:09.04`	`GenRommel`	`hmmm...`
`17:09.44`	`larsl`	`And I'm on the other side of the Atlantic ocean. =)`
`17:10.04`	`GenRommel`	`i'm doing traceroute and it looks like there's a config problem somewhere:`
`17:10.16`	`GenRommel`	`traceroute to bzflag.org (66.35.250.210), 64 hops max, 40 byte packets 1 * * * 2 srp1-0.hubp-rtr1.nj.rr.com (24.168.128.17) 11 ms 9 ms 81 ms 3 24.168.128.1 (24.168.128.1) 90 ms 38 ms 43 ms 4 pop1-nye-P10-0.atdn.net (66.185.151.53) 40 ms 160 ms 77 ms 5 bb1-nye-P0-0.atdn.net (66.185.151.48) 10 ms 11 ms 12 ms 6 pop2-nye-P0-0.atdn.net (66.185.151.65) 11 ms 10 ms 11 ms 7 dcr2-so-3-2`
`17:10.16`	`GenRommel`	`-0.NewYork.cw.net (206.24.207.217) 11 ms 10 ms 12 ms 8 dcr2-loopback.SantaClara.cw.net (208.172.146.100) 87 ms 87 ms 87 ms 9 bhr1-pos-0-0.SantaClarasc8.cw.net (208.172.156.198) 89 ms 87 ms 87 ms 10 csr1-ve240.SantaClarasc8.cw.net (66.35.194.34) 87 ms 90 ms 87 ms 11 66.35.212.174 (66.35.212.174) 91 ms 89 ms 100 ms 12 * * * 13 * * * 14 * * * 15 * * * 16 * * * 17 * * * 18 * * * 19`
`17:10.16`	`GenRommel`	`<PROTECTED>`
`17:10.23`	`GenRommel`	`and traceroute is not done yet....`
`17:10.37`	`Patlabor221`	`what server you going to?`
`17:10.46`	`GenRommel`	`website www.bzflag.org`
`17:10.58`	`Patlabor221`	`no to play BZ that is so slow?`
`17:10.59`	`larsl`	`Hmm, I get that too. It works fine in the browser though.`
`17:11.10`	`GenRommel`	`so, sourceforge must be screwed up...`
`17:11.17`	`Patlabor221`	`no it's normal`
`17:11.21`	`Patlabor221`	`they don't reply to pings`
`17:11.28`	`Patlabor221`	`after a certan point`
`17:11.33`	`Patlabor221`	`prevents DNS`
`17:11.45`	`Patlabor221`	`if it's just laggy, then thats between you and the server in question`
`17:12.10`	`Patlabor221`	`sourceforge just holds the list server IP ( it did just move )`
`17:12.36`	`Patlabor221`	`but once you connect to a server, it's just between you and it, SF and bzflag.org are not involved`
`17:12.42`	`Patlabor221`	`what server are you trying to play on?`
`17:12.48`	`GenRommel`	`i guess rr.com has not updated it's DNS tables`
`17:12.58`	`GenRommel`	`no, playing is fine - it's the website that's wicked slow`
`17:13.03`	`Patlabor221`	`ohh`
`17:13.11`	`Patlabor221`	`wel Tim is moving`
`17:13.19`	`Patlabor221`	`so maybe the new host is slow till he moves`
`17:13.23`	`Patlabor221`	`works fine for me`
`17:13.24`	`GenRommel`	`btw, can I change my password on the website or do I have to send email to webmaster?`
`17:13.29`	`Patlabor221`	`but you may have a difrent route`
`17:13.39`	`Patlabor221`	`what password?`
`17:13.49`	`GenRommel`	`user password for the league`
`17:13.51`	`Patlabor221`	`for the leauge stuff?`
`17:13.59`	`Patlabor221`	`dono`
`17:22.04`	`*** join/#bzflag Chestal (thilo@vmax.unix-ag.uni-siegen.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`17:22.04`	`*** join/#bzflag GenRommel (~gene@24-193-121-4.nj.rr.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
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`17:22.04`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o Chestal] by leguin.freenode.net`
`17:23.19`	`*** join/#bzflag Chestal (thilo@vmax.unix-ag.uni-siegen.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
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`17:23.20`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o Chestal] by leguin.freenode.net`
`17:26.06`	`Patlabor221`	`welcome back`
`17:26.18`	`GenRommel`	`chestal - you alive?`
`17:31.52`	`*** join/#bzflag sussi (~sussi@217-68-182-105.cable.primacom.net)`
`17:33.13`	`sussi`	`hi`
`17:38.01`	`doughecka`	`hi`
`17:40.11`	`*** part/#bzflag GenRommel (~gene@24-193-121-4.nj.rr.com)`
`17:43.16`	`*** join/#bzflag GenRommel (~gene@24-193-121-4.nj.rr.com)`
`17:46.50`	`Patlabor221`	`well looks like it's going to have to be 2 passes for lighting`
`17:47.07`	`Patlabor221`	`nope 3 pass :(`
`17:49.47`	`larsl`	`Yay, from 1570 boxes to 222 boxes without losing any of the total geometry!`
`17:49.51`	`larsl`	`It's still slow, though.`
`17:54.25`	`Patlabor221`	`that should not be too slow`
`17:55.24`	`larsl`	`~25 fps in worst case on my computer. =P`
`18:00.05`	`Patlabor221`	`hmmm how does one calculate a shadow volume`
`18:01.57`	`larsl`	`Shadows have volumes?`
`18:02.04`	`Patlabor221`	`yes`
`18:02.27`	`Patlabor221`	`all we see is that volume's projection onto a surface`
`18:02.37`	`Patlabor221`	`if you have a box casting a shadow`
`18:02.38`	`larsl`	`Shouldn't that volume be infinite?`
`18:03.27`	`Patlabor221`	`and you put another box in the volume that is created betweent he objcet and the shadow on the ground, it will also pick up the shadow from the first box`
`18:03.39`	`Patlabor221`	`no for a single light source and some ground plane it's finite`
`18:03.50`	`larsl`	`Ah, you have a ground plane.`
`18:03.59`	`Patlabor221`	`yes`
`18:04.07`	`Patlabor221`	`with no ground plane it would be infinate`
`18:04.24`	`Patlabor221`	`the ground plane just makes it easer`
`18:05.00`	`Patlabor221`	`if I could get a shadow volume for each object, there is a method using the stencel buffer to get inter object shadows`
`18:05.50`	`Patlabor221`	`I could just stick with projection shadows`
`18:05.53`	`larsl`	`How exact should it be?`
`18:06.06`	`Patlabor221`	`more exact = better shadows`
`18:06.20`	`Patlabor221`	`techincaly to the polygon`
`18:06.51`	`Patlabor221`	`but I could use the colision volume, that may be close enough`
`18:07.18`	`Patlabor221`	`doing arbitrary meshes in a bz type lighting situeation is not that easy`
`18:07.25`	`Patlabor221`	`and it's required to do it proper`
`18:07.33`	`larsl`	`For objects high above ground, you might get a good approximation by calculating the volume of the cone that has the shadow on the ground plane as base and the light source as top, truncated at the center point of the object casting the shadow.`
`18:07.51`	`Patlabor221`	`it's not a cone`
`18:07.59`	`larsl`	`Not a circular cone.`
`18:08.02`	`larsl`	`But still a cone.`
`18:08.08`	`Patlabor221`	`bz's light is not a point souce`
`18:08.11`	`Patlabor221`	`so it's not a code`
`18:08.12`	`larsl`	`Oh.`
`18:08.13`	`Patlabor221`	`cone`
`18:08.18`	`Patlabor221`	`shadows don't grow`
`18:08.40`	`Patlabor221`	`it's asumed to be an infinate distance away`
`18:09.05`	`Patlabor221`	`so i could calc one`
`18:09.32`	`Patlabor221`	`but I am also trying to do stuff other then boxes`
`18:09.42`	`larsl`	`Well, then it's just a prism. =)`
`18:09.50`	`Patlabor221`	`if it's a box`
`18:10.02`	`Patlabor221`	`what if it's a bust of J. Edgar Hover?`
`18:10.10`	`larsl`	`Then you're in trouble.`
`18:10.29`	`Patlabor221`	`people want arbitrary mehses`
`18:11.03`	`Patlabor221`	`it's gonna slow down on the glow pass too`
`18:11.28`	`larsl`	`Glow?`
`18:11.36`	`Patlabor221`	`you know when you shoot a shot`
`18:11.47`	`Patlabor221`	`and it makes a light on the walls of a building`
`18:11.50`	`larsl`	`Oh.`
`18:11.54`	`Patlabor221`	`glow`
`18:12.09`	`Patlabor221`	`that is done now by segmenting the heck out of the geometry`
`18:12.12`	`larsl`	`Not the same as an actual light source?`
`18:12.20`	`Patlabor221`	`yes not the same`
`18:12.41`	`Patlabor221`	`the boxes are teselated when a light is near`
`18:12.46`	`Patlabor221`	`so they get more shading points`
`18:13.06`	`Patlabor221`	`can't easaly do that on an arbitrary mesh`
`18:13.15`	`Patlabor221`	`so It'll have to be a stencel glow pass`
`18:13.51`	`Patlabor221`	`so for proper shadows 3 passes`
`18:13.57`	`Patlabor221`	`1 for the global light`
`18:14.03`	`Patlabor221`	`1 for the shadows`
`18:14.07`	`Patlabor221`	`and 1 for the glows`
`18:14.24`	`larsl`	`If it's a lot slower, maybe it should be a quality setting.`
`18:14.40`	`larsl`	`'glow for boxes, but not for arbitrary meshes'.`
`18:14.45`	`Patlabor221`	`well I haven't even thought about implemting it in bz yet`
`18:14.50`	`Patlabor221`	`that is gonna be "fun"`
`18:14.53`	`larsl`	`=)`
`18:15.18`	`Patlabor221`	`I am thinking I would have to change just about everything in the entire renderer`
`18:15.54`	`Patlabor221`	`and the fact that since it has to run on crap hardware I can only use one light at a time`
`18:33.52`	`Patlabor221`	`ewwwwwwwwwww`
`18:34.13`	`Patlabor221`	`shadow volumes get ALLL funky when the eye point enters the volume`
`18:40.40`	`Noodleman`	`moo`
`18:41.03`	`doughecka`	`'lo`
`18:41.53`	`Noodleman`	`Patlabor221 sent me a 3com network card`
`18:41.58`	`Noodleman`	`he's kewl :-)`
`18:42.06`	`doughecka`	`hehe`
`18:42.12`	`Noodleman`	`even thos he says he did it for a selfish reason ;-)`
`18:42.50`	`Noodleman`	`creeperz would ask him every 15 minutes when s.b.o would be back up :-)`
`18:43.05`	`doughecka`	`lol`
`18:43.30`	`Noodleman`	`that would be a problem`
`18:43.33`	`Noodleman`	`hehe`
`18:44.02`	`doughecka`	`http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/03/30/0510225&mode=nested&tid=133&tid=159`
`18:44.24`	`Noodleman`	`hah`
`18:45.22`	`Noodleman`	`did you see this?`
`18:45.23`	`Noodleman`	`http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/03/15/1356215&mode=thread&tid=133&tid=156`
`18:45.38`	`doughecka`	`woo`
`18:45.39`	`doughecka`	`:)`
`18:46.07`	`Noodleman`	`too bad it didn't make it to the front page tho`
`18:46.25`	`doughecka`	`hrm`
`18:46.38`	`Noodleman`	`but i did get about 4 dozen submissions`
`18:46.50`	`doughecka`	`The closest I've ever come to this (or plan to) was a quick and dirty perl script which generated all of the words to "4294967295 Bottles of Beer on the Wall", which was piped to festival.`
`18:46.50`	`doughecka`	`My roommates, while amused for the first 10 minutes or so, threatened grevious personal injury a few hours later.`
`18:46.52`	`doughecka`	`lol`
`18:47.01`	`Noodleman`	`hehe`
`19:04.10`	`Noodleman`	`http://www.bigzaphod.org/cow/`
`19:05.11`	`Patlabor221`	`funny`
`19:06.22`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`19:07.25`	`*** join/#bzflag Cell (~Cell@pD9590DEE.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`19:09.54`	`doughecka`	`hey cell!`
`19:09.57`	`Cell`	`lo, i play majors mask currently, still a deku scrub`
`19:10.09`	`doughecka`	`want a really easy and cool languege?`
`19:10.11`	`doughecka`	`http://www.bigzaphod.org/cow/`
`19:10.38`	`Patlabor221`	`Majoras' mask`
`19:10.58`	`Cell`	`yes`
`19:14.16`	`Cell`	`does the n64 for use a stencil buffer to draw all the cheap shadows on the poly?`
`19:14.34`	`Patlabor221`	`proabably just a second pass`
`19:14.47`	`Patlabor221`	`it's not real hardware rendering like we know it`
`19:18.03`	`Cell`	`<PROTECTED>`
`19:18.37`	`Patlabor221`	`those are just circles on the ground, not even real shadows`
`19:18.46`	`Cell`	`yeah, cheap shadows`
`19:19.05`	`Patlabor221`	`why would they need a stencel for that`
`19:19.20`	`Cell`	`coplaner to polygons`
`19:19.31`	`Patlabor221`	`just force depth writes`
`19:19.44`	`Patlabor221`	`or don't fill in the z buffer for the floor`
`19:20.08`	`Cell`	`u mean just force frame buffer writes?`
`19:20.18`	`Patlabor221`	`thats one way`
`19:20.25`	`Patlabor221`	`that's how I do ground objects`
`19:20.35`	`Patlabor221`	`draw the floor, with n z writes`
`19:20.39`	`Cell`	`but that is not clean`
`19:20.41`	`Patlabor221`	`draw the ground objects`
`19:20.51`	`Patlabor221`	`then fill in the floors z`
`19:20.52`	`Patlabor221`	`works fine`
`19:20.57`	`Cell`	`ah k`
`19:21.02`	`Patlabor221`	`no artifacts at all`
`19:21.24`	`Patlabor221`	`it's 2 passes on the floor, but there i fill rate up the wazzzo`
`19:22.13`	`Cell`	`ah`
`19:23.54`	`Patlabor221`	`anyone know what version of OpenGL most linux systems have?`
`19:27.28`	`doughecka`	`what should I learn first, C or C++ or visual basic? ;)`
`19:27.57`	`Patlabor221`	`thre is C in C++`
`19:28.03`	`doughecka`	`yes`
`19:28.19`	`Patlabor221`	`but you may be more familar with VB`
`19:28.26`	`Patlabor221`	`but then it's slower`
`19:28.28`	`doughecka`	`but if I want to learn C++, do I want to learn C first, or just learn C along with everything else in C++`
`19:28.37`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`19:29.59`	`Cell`	`doughecka: i would learn java or c#`
`19:30.07`	`Cell`	`all students do that`
`19:30.12`	`Cell`	`when they start`
`19:30.14`	`doughecka`	`not the ones I know`
`19:30.19`	`Cell`	`hm`
`19:30.28`	`doughecka`	`c#? thats on windows only anyway`
`19:30.35`	`Patlabor221`	`Java does seem to have replaced pascall as the "learning " language`
`19:30.41`	`doughecka`	`how do you say that? C pound?`
`19:30.47`	`doughecka`	`C number?`
`19:30.54`	`doughecka`	`C hash?`
`19:30.56`	`Patlabor221`	`C Sharp`
`19:31.01`	`doughecka`	`oh.`
`19:31.08`	`Patlabor221`	`if you do C++ you will get C with it`
`19:31.13`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`19:31.20`	`Patlabor221`	`noone realy makes stuff in raw C much any more`
`19:31.27`	`doughecka`	`hmm, k`
`19:31.29`	`Cell`	`but with Java you get a faster success experience`
`19:31.45`	`Cell`	`cause c++ is more difficult to learn`
`19:31.48`	`Patlabor221`	`and all that means is no classes, and some other little stupid rules you have to follow, so if you do have to, it's not hard`
`19:31.58`	`doughecka`	`cool`
`19:32.04`	`Patlabor221`	`Java = C++ for dummies`
`19:32.16`	`Cell`	`haha`
`19:32.17`	`Patlabor221`	`the C++ language is not that hard`
`19:32.18`	`doughecka`	`Cell: I dont like java in the first place, why would I want to learn it?`
`19:32.31`	`Cell`	`cause its more like perl`
`19:32.35`	`Cell`	`or a script`
`19:33.08`	`Cell`	`you can make things, like bots much more easy and quickly, same when dealing with strings`
`19:33.16`	`doughecka`	`hm`
`19:33.29`	`Cell`	`file acces is much easier`
`19:33.45`	`Patlabor221`	`and there are libs in C++ that let you do the same thing :)`
`19:33.58`	`Patlabor221`	`java just rolls a bunch of those into the lang`
`19:34.00`	`Cell`	`yes but they are more diff to use`
`19:34.08`	`Patlabor221`	`depends on the lib`
`19:34.13`	`Cell`	`true`
`19:34.16`	`Patlabor221`	`just cus you don't like it cell dosn't make it bad.`
`19:34.18`	`doughecka`	`but lets say I want to make a 3d app, with open gl... I would most likly use C++`
`19:34.30`	`Patlabor221`	`you can use GL in a lot of languages`
`19:34.33`	`doughecka`	`yes`
`19:34.40`	`doughecka`	`but if I want it fast and stable..`
`19:34.41`	`Patlabor221`	`C++ would compile the fastest`
`19:34.51`	`Patlabor221`	`with the least optimisations`
`19:35.05`	`Patlabor221`	`and you can use SDL`
`19:35.10`	`Patlabor221`	`cus SDL roxorz`
`19:35.13`	`doughecka`	`hehe`
`19:35.19`	`doughecka`	`me could use Patlabor221's engine`
`19:35.20`	`Cell`	`doughecka: but i quess you want it stable, so i would use Java, cause you will make fewer errors no pointers`
`19:35.26`	`Patlabor221`	`sure if you wanted to`
`19:35.53`	`doughecka`	`most java apps I have seen where slow or unstable`
`19:35.57`	`Patlabor221`	`yes the garbage cleanup is nice there, but then sometimes you just need a pointer`
`19:35.57`	`Cell`	`and i dont thing you make a game that has so much game logic that it runs slow with java, cause gl calls are still in C`
`19:36.07`	`Patlabor221`	`and yes the VM implementiaons vary on platfroms`
`19:36.07`	`doughecka`	`but they do run on any computer, but so does C++`
`19:36.32`	`Patlabor221`	`for C you have to compile for each system`
`19:36.36`	`Patlabor221`	`for java you don't`
`19:36.43`	`Patlabor221`	`but you have to have a VM on each system`
`19:36.50`	`doughecka`	`exactly`
`19:37.01`	`Patlabor221`	`if you make your C++ right then it will run on most systems`
`19:37.14`	`Patlabor221`	`java does run without modification on more systems`
`19:37.18`	`doughecka`	`and I dont want a poor guy on a 95 box on dialup download a whole VM for my itty bitty proggy`
`19:37.20`	`Patlabor221`	`that is why it's a good scripter`
`19:37.43`	`Patlabor221`	`well if he's on 95 then he may not even have GL :)`
`19:37.53`	`Cell`	`glsetup`
`19:37.56`	`doughecka`	`not for gl`
`19:38.03`	`doughecka`	`but like a terminal app or something`
`19:38.13`	`Patlabor221`	`then yes you can make him a bin`
`19:38.20`	`Patlabor221`	`but you could also put java in a web page`
`19:38.30`	`Patlabor221`	`so each has its avatages`
`19:38.33`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`19:38.38`	`Patlabor221`	`I find C++ way easyer to debug`
`19:38.47`	`Patlabor221`	`cus less things happen behind the scenes`
`19:38.53`	`doughecka`	`heh`
`19:39.04`	`Patlabor221`	`tho VB is usefull in ASP pages`
`19:39.11`	`doughecka`	`it is?`
`19:39.18`	`doughecka`	`too bad I dont use ASP servers...`
`19:39.19`	`Patlabor221`	`I am not conviced of it as a apication language`
`19:39.30`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`19:39.32`	`Patlabor221`	`yes you can do ASP scripting in VB if you want`
`19:39.36`	`doughecka`	`cool`
`19:40.38`	`doughecka`	`hmm`
`19:40.50`	`Cell`	`<PROTECTED>`
`19:40.51`	`doughecka`	`what do I want? professional, or enterprise?`
`19:41.05`	`Patlabor221`	`for visual studio?`
`19:41.06`	`Cell`	`i have all n54 games that matter`
`19:41.18`	`Patlabor221`	`N54`
`19:41.20`	`Cell`	`n64`
`19:41.23`	`Patlabor221`	`wow is that your special one? :)`
`19:41.33`	`Patlabor221`	`you don't need those extra 10 bits`
`19:41.37`	`Cell`	`yes nice water`
`19:41.41`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`19:41.50`	`doughecka`	`visual studio`
`19:42.00`	`Patlabor221`	`assbery pancaktes`
`19:42.10`	`Patlabor221`	`there shoudl not be a diffrence between them doug`
`19:42.20`	`doughecka`	`ok`
`19:42.28`	`doughecka`	`what IS the diference?`
`19:42.36`	`doughecka`	`more features?`
`19:42.47`	`Patlabor221`	`foxpro`
`19:42.51`	`Patlabor221`	`and j++ I think`
`19:42.55`	`doughecka`	`ah cool`
`19:43.02`	`Patlabor221`	`no each level just includes more langs`
`19:43.07`	`Patlabor221`	`the VB is the same`
`19:43.08`	`doughecka`	`ah`
`19:43.13`	`Cell`	`i think learning a language is only 5% of the whole bottle, learning the framework + system is the other 95%`
`19:43.35`	`Patlabor221`	`this is nice water`
`19:44.12`	`doughecka`	`crystal clear it is`
`19:44.16`	`Patlabor221`	`http://www.darkageofcamelot.com/screen_shots/shots/si008.jpg`
`19:44.32`	`Patlabor221`	`bahh was inbeded in java took a bit to get the path`
`19:44.37`	`Cell`	`bad shot :?`
`19:44.42`	`doughecka`	`yea.. I would say that is pretty nice`
`19:45.04`	`Patlabor221`	`http://www.darkageofcamelot.com/screen_shots/shots/si005.jpg`
`19:45.19`	`Cell`	`ah pretty realistic`
`19:45.35`	`Cell`	`haha`
`19:45.39`	`Patlabor221`	`that would be fun with surface deformations`
`19:45.39`	`Cell`	`try`
`19:46.00`	`Patlabor221`	`it's doable just not easy, nor that fast`
`19:46.06`	`doughecka`	`and you could drop blocks and things in the water and have it splash and flow around it`
`19:46.12`	`doughecka`	`hm`
`19:46.23`	`Patlabor221`	`you know you have to do all the math for that`
`19:46.29`	`doughecka`	`hrm`
`19:46.31`	`Cell`	`+ physics`
`19:46.39`	`Patlabor221`	`physics is math`
`19:46.43`	`Cell`	`no`
`19:46.50`	`doughecka`	`um, yes it is`
`19:46.53`	`Cell`	`physics uses math`
`19:46.58`	`Patlabor221`	`physics is an plication of math`
`19:46.58`	`doughecka`	`to the common man`
`19:47.06`	`Patlabor221`	`in the computer, it's still all math`
`19:47.13`	`Cell`	`yes`
`19:47.36`	`doughecka`	`newton had an apple to do all his physics stuff`
`19:48.03`	`Patlabor221`	`hmmm how do I get the open GL 1.3 headers and libs`
`19:48.20`	`doughecka`	`google.`
`19:48.23`	`doughecka`	`;)`
`19:48.39`	`Patlabor221`	`nope msdn`
`19:48.47`	`doughecka`	`ah`
`19:49.12`	`Cell`	`i had the list insalled with VC++6.0`
`19:49.16`	`Cell`	`libs`
`19:49.24`	`Patlabor221`	`that is 1.1 not 1.3`
`19:49.29`	`Cell`	`ah`
`19:49.38`	`Patlabor221`	`need at least 1.2`
`19:49.45`	`Cell`	`because of?`
`19:49.50`	`doughecka`	`wow`
`19:49.56`	`doughecka`	`588 megs total`
`19:50.06`	`Patlabor221`	`<PROTECTED>`
`19:50.13`	`doughecka`	`whats on cds 2 and 4?`
`19:50.15`	`doughecka`	`er, 3?`
`19:50.26`	`Patlabor221`	`and arb multitexture`
`19:50.31`	`Cell`	`never saw that`
`19:50.35`	`Cell`	`ah`
`19:50.42`	`Cell`	`extension`
`19:51.17`	`Patlabor221`	`arb multi texture?`
`19:51.44`	`Cell`	`no GL_LIGHT_MODEL_COLOR_CONTROL`
`19:51.53`	`Patlabor221`	`it's not an extension`
`19:52.09`	`Patlabor221`	`it's a new enumeraton`
`19:52.19`	`doughecka`	`~dict enumeraton`
`19:52.25`	`Cell`	`what is its intention`
`19:52.26`	`doughecka`	`~spell enumeraton`
`19:52.28`		`possible spellings for enumeraton: enumerating enumeration enumerator enumerators enumerate`
`19:52.38`	`Patlabor221`	`to make the specular light be applied after the texture`
`19:52.45`	`doughecka`	`~dict enumeration`
`19:53.04`	`doughecka`	`cool`
`19:53.11`	`Cell`	`so its not modulated`
`19:53.23`	`*** join/#bzflag bzgirl (~brat@toronto-hs-64-26-176-61.d-ip.magma.ca)`
`19:53.33`	`Patlabor221`	`it is, just right now it's applied before the texture`
`19:53.40`	`Patlabor221`	`so that the texture modulates to it`
`19:53.43`	`doughecka`	`hey bzgirl from toronto canada!`
`19:53.48`	`Patlabor221`	`this way it modultes the texture`
`19:54.01`	`Patlabor221`	`so you can get realy specular highlights on top of the texture, not just a fullbright texture`
`19:54.30`	`Cell`	`but you need phong shading`
`19:54.43`	`doughecka`	`thong?`
`19:54.43`	`Patlabor221`	`no, gl does fake speculars`
`19:54.51`	`doughecka`	`they dont shade`
`19:54.56`	`Patlabor221`	`they can`
`19:55.03`	`doughecka`	`very little`
`19:55.11`	`Patlabor221`	`depends how big it is`
`19:55.16`	`doughecka`	`hum`
`19:56.25`	`doughecka`	`can VB access hardware directly?`
`19:56.28`	`doughecka`	`like a serial port?`
`19:56.35`	`Patlabor221`	`no`
`19:56.42`	`doughecka`	`no.`
`19:56.44`	`Patlabor221`	`no app can on a NT based OS`
`19:56.46`	`doughecka`	`oh`
`19:56.53`	`doughecka`	`how do I Get data in and out a serial port?`
`19:56.55`	`Patlabor221`	`only on dos based ones`
`19:57.03`	`doughecka`	`huh`
`19:57.04`	`Patlabor221`	`you use the serial port API`
`19:57.07`	`doughecka`	`oh`
`19:57.10`	`doughecka`	`is that hard?`
`19:57.24`	`Patlabor221`	`no actulay it's eayser then hiting the hardware direclty`
`19:57.34`	`doughecka`	`ah`
`19:57.34`	`Patlabor221`	`you get thigns like "sendSomeData(data)"`
`19:57.35`	`doughecka`	`cool`
`19:57.40`	`doughecka`	`wow`
`19:57.52`	`Patlabor221`	`no inturpts or anything like that`
`19:57.53`	`doughecka`	`serialspeed(1200)`
`19:57.58`	`doughecka`	`ah, sweet`
`19:58.08`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah this is the moder era`
`19:58.14`	`doughecka`	`it just works.`
`19:58.18`	`doughecka`	`heh`
`19:58.36`	`doughecka`	`how about windows CE devices?`
`19:58.44`	`doughecka`	`how do you compile stuff for them?`
`19:58.54`	`Patlabor221`	`they should have drivers as well`
`19:59.00`	`doughecka`	`hm`
`19:59.07`	`doughecka`	`linux?`
`19:59.07`	`doughecka`	`:P`
`19:59.10`	`Patlabor221`	`there is a nother compiler`
`19:59.15`	`Patlabor221`	`for the protable devices`
`19:59.16`	`doughecka`	`ah`
`19:59.27`	`Patlabor221`	`MS eMbeded 3.0`
`19:59.30`	`Patlabor221`	`or somethign like that`
`19:59.33`	`doughecka`	`heh`
`19:59.39`	`Patlabor221`	`but most of the windows API is there on CE`
`19:59.55`	`doughecka`	`cool`
`20:00.01`	`bzgirl`	`hi`
`20:00.14`	`doughecka`	`whats on these?`
`20:01.25`	`doughecka`	`bleh, I dont want to restart just now`
`20:03.29`	`doughecka`	`on the zaurus all you have to do is install GCC on the zaurus and compile all the apps you want`
`20:03.39`	`Noodleman`	`or distcc`
`20:03.43`	`doughecka`	`openzaurus is based on debian too`
`20:03.44`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`20:03.51`	`doughecka`	`or get a arm cross compiler`
`20:05.22`	`Cell`	`i won`
`20:06.29`	`Patlabor221`	`for windows CE they give you a cross compiler`
`20:06.37`	`Patlabor221`	`even an emulator compiler`
`20:06.41`	`Patlabor221`	`so you can debug localy`
`20:11.03`	`Patlabor221`	`hmmm intell upt out a GL 1.2 update`
`20:11.11`	`Patlabor221`	`now to find 1.3 or 1.4`
`20:11.16`	`Cell`	`gl 2.0`
`20:11.34`	`Patlabor221`	`it's only speced at this point`
`20:11.42`	`Cell`	`ups`
`20:13.28`	`Patlabor221`	`1.4 is the current release`
`20:13.34`	`Patlabor221`	`but not everyone supports it`
`20:13.36`	`Cell`	`i cant use directX any more after i used opengl only for a while`
`20:13.59`	`Patlabor221`	`why not`
`20:14.08`	`Patlabor221`	`can't go back to an ugly api?`
`20:14.17`	`Cell`	`it has ugly interface`
`20:14.22`	`Cell`	`right`
`20:16.56`	`Cell`	`most ugly is the mirrored coordinate system, right hand`
`20:18.01`	`Patlabor221`	`you must mean left hand`
`20:18.05`	`Patlabor221`	`OG is right hand`
`20:18.17`	`Patlabor221`	`GL is right hand`
`20:18.21`	`Patlabor221`	`it's just rotated 90`
`20:18.40`	`Cell`	`ah, yes`
`20:19.06`	`Patlabor221`	`I asume DX flips Y ?`
`20:19.27`	`Cell`	`do you know why in a trasformation sequence in opengl the first transformation is calle last? I knew why :)`
`20:19.43`	`Patlabor221`	`cus it's all just matrix muls`
`20:19.47`	`Patlabor221`	`that's what you do`
`20:20.04`	`Patlabor221`	`so they are applied revers order`
`20:20.29`	`Cell`	`right`
`20:20.52`	`Cell`	`but only the brackets`
`20:23.40`	`Cell`	`MV = MVABC = (((MVA)B)C), so C is the first logical tranformation but due to not kill the MV ( model view) Matrix C has to be applied last`
`20:25.14`	`*** join/#bzflag doughecka (SteveJobs@216.135.68.133)`
`20:25.14`	`doughecka`	`greetings`
`20:27.55`	`*** join/#bzflag [STC]_creeperz (creeperz@host-178-78-220-24.midco.net)`
`20:28.24`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Good news: I got the rest of the Doritoes washed out of my nose and I can breathe!`
`20:30.16`	`Cell`	`whats that for a game: http://217.89.13.238/xxxx.jpg`
`20:30.40`	`doughecka`	`cannot find server`
`20:30.51`	`doughecka`	`ah, there it goes`
`20:30.53`	`Patlabor221`	`that is horibly bland`
`20:31.35`	`Cell`	`what kind of game contest?`
`20:31.55`	`doughecka`	`but thats like saying iraq is a good vacation area`
`20:32.02`	`Patlabor221`	`why would they do that`
`20:32.19`	`Patlabor221`	`they would if there was a reason`
`20:32.21`	`doughecka`	`why would iraq be a good vaction area?`
`20:32.28`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Sand`
`20:32.31`	`Patlabor221`	`I did send one to noodle`
`20:32.37`	`Patlabor221`	`he should get it tomrow`
`20:32.39`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`And free spent bullets`
`20:32.43`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I know :)`
`20:32.49`	`doughecka`	`bullets?`
`20:32.53`	`doughecka`	`how about bullet shells?`
`20:32.55`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`shells*`
`20:33.01`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`SORRY!`
`20:33.52`	`Patlabor221`	`ohh won't get there till tuesday`
`20:34.09`	`doughecka`	`huh`
`20:34.10`	`Patlabor221`	`it's in portland now`
`20:34.15`	`doughecka`	`yay`
`20:34.23`	`doughecka`	`I got VB to say hello 5 times!`
`20:38.04`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`How do I get DB to get files?`
`20:38.18`	`Patlabor221`	`to "get"?`
`20:38.40`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`How on BZFlag it gets wall.rgb`
`20:38.46`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`and identifies it`
`20:38.48`	`Patlabor221`	`ohh load a file`
`20:38.53`	`larsl`	`I need supplies.`
`20:38.55`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ummm, yes I think`
`20:38.56`	`Patlabor221`	`I'm sure they have somethign like open`
`20:39.01`	`Patlabor221`	`or file read`
`20:39.05`	`Patlabor221`	`read up on there API`
`20:39.12`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ok`
`20:39.35`	`Cell`	`larsl isnt it too late for grocery store`
`20:39.51`	`doughecka`	`24 hour stores?`
`20:39.52`	`Patlabor221`	`you don't have stores that are open 24/7 ?`
`20:39.59`	`Cell`	`no`
`20:40.07`	`doughecka`	`larsl does`
`20:40.18`	`Cell`	`where`
`20:40.24`	`Patlabor221`	`cell do you live in the coonies?`
`20:40.28`	`Patlabor221`	`boonies even?`
`20:40.29`	`Cell`	`lol`
`20:40.33`	`Cell`	`nope`
`20:40.54`	`Patlabor221`	`what happens if you get hungry at 3:30 ?`
`20:41.18`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I'm going to move up to VB after DB`
`20:41.23`	`Cell`	`hm, i have to close my eys for some hours and sleep`
`20:41.26`	`doughecka`	`[STC]_creeperz: move.. up?`
`20:41.34`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Expand...`
`20:41.34`	`doughecka`	`you should move up to C++ after that`
`20:41.40`	`Patlabor221`	`VB has less stuff for games`
`20:41.47`	`doughecka`	`alot less stuff`
`20:42.05`	`Cell`	`VB:NEt is cool but VB old is not good`
`20:42.07`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ahhh, you have to identify the file`
`20:42.32`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Hmm...I'm hungry`
`20:42.32`	`Patlabor221`	`well how else would it know what to load?`
`20:42.44`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Magic Genie?`
`20:42.48`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`ESP?`
`20:42.52`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`CIA? FBI?`
`20:42.57`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`LAPD`
`20:43.04`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`VCPP`
`20:43.08`	`Patlabor221`	`baka`
`20:43.13`	`doughecka`	`weee, I need 2 monitors if I want to do this`
`20:43.16`	`*** join/#bzflag greg1 (~admin@greghub.net1.nerim.net)`
`20:43.19`	`greg1`	`Hi`
`20:43.21`	`doughecka`	`hi`
`20:43.26`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Yea yu are!`
`20:43.30`	`Noodleman`	`hihihi`
`20:43.37`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Noodle!`
`20:43.39`	`doughecka`	`~seen widget`
`20:43.39`		`widget <~me@12-240-76-157.client.attbi.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 14d 11h 21m 55s ago, saying: 'hihihi'.`
`20:43.42`	`Noodleman`	`the noodle lives`
`20:43.46`	`Noodleman`	`hehe`
`20:44.02`	`Patlabor221`	`noodle your card is scheduled to get there on tuesday`
`20:44.02`	`Noodleman`	`i was copying widget`
`20:44.05`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~seen bzgirl`
`20:44.05`		`bzgirl <~brat@toronto-hs-64-26-176-61.d-ip.magma.ca> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 44m 4s ago, saying: 'hi'.`
`20:44.06`	`Noodleman`	`okie`
`20:44.53`	`Cell`	`OOO`
`20:44.53`	`Cell`	`MOo`
`20:44.54`	`Cell`	`mOO`
`20:44.56`	`*** part/#bzflag Cell (~Cell@pD9590DEE.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`20:45.07`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~moo Cell`
`20:45.10`		`ACTION moos at Cell`
`20:45.10`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:)`
`20:45.23`	`doughecka`	`you should learn the cow programming languege`
`20:45.28`	`doughecka`	`its very easy`
`20:45.30`	`*** join/#bzflag mmu_man (~revol@ALyon-202-1-1-119.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`20:45.32`	`doughecka`	`its all moos`
`20:45.33`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Never heard of it`
`20:45.35`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ahh`
`20:45.44`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Mo0-moo?`
`20:45.45`	`Noodleman`	`http://bigzaphod.com/moo/`
`20:45.53`	`Noodleman`	`i think`
`20:45.54`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`?`
`20:46.28`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Nope :(`
`20:46.33`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Oh well`
`20:46.46`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Noodle: Want to help me make two things before I die?`
`20:47.03`	`Noodleman`	`what's that? :-)`
`20:47.17`	`doughecka`	`a grave and a stone`
`20:47.21`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`A) A game like BZFlag yet a little bit more sophisticated B) A web browser`
`20:47.33`	`doughecka`	`a web browser?`
`20:47.37`	`doughecka`	`what ever for?`
`20:47.38`	`*** join/#bzflag bzgirl (~brat@toronto-hs-64-26-176-61.d-ip.magma.ca)`
`20:47.40`	`Noodleman`	`i'm not sophisticated enough with programming`
`20:47.46`	`doughecka`	`he knows perl only`
`20:47.49`	`Noodleman`	`and php`
`20:47.51`	`doughecka`	`ah`
`20:47.53`	`Noodleman`	`learning C`
`20:47.53`	`doughecka`	`php is cool`
`20:48.05`	`bzgirl`	`Patlabor221: are you there?`
`20:48.06`	`Noodleman`	`VB isn't portable`
`20:48.12`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`HAHA!`
`20:48.14`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:)`
`20:48.18`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Go DB!`
`20:48.45`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`G0 DB!! G0 DB!!`
`20:48.49`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Brb`
`20:48.59`	`doughecka`	`I will learn C++ after VB`
`20:49.29`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`C++ is cool`
`20:49.34`	`Patlabor221`	`yes I am here bzgirl`
`20:49.36`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`My precious`
`20:49.55`	`Patlabor221`	`was just getin cleaned up`
`20:50.10`	`doughecka`	`method or data member not found`
`20:50.12`	`doughecka`	`huh`
`20:50.19`	`bzgirl`	`Patlabor221: i will make a post about my server in the server section, can you do the sticky thing?`
`20:50.21`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Back to DB!`
`20:50.27`	`doughecka`	`oh wait`
`20:50.32`	`Patlabor221`	`your a moderator, you can do the sticy thing :)`
`20:50.36`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`What is a sticky thing?`
`20:50.39`	`bzgirl`	`oh i can? :)`
`20:50.40`	`Patlabor221`	`but if you can't yes I will`
`20:50.44`	`Patlabor221`	`yes you can`
`20:50.52`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Sticky thing?`
`20:50.53`	`Patlabor221`	`your a full moderator`
`20:51.02`	`bzgirl`	`i'll try to :)`
`20:51.12`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`What is the sticky thing?`
`20:51.20`	`Patlabor221`	`makes things stick`
`20:51.27`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I've always wondered about it`
`20:51.31`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Huh?`
`20:51.38`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Stick? What do you mean?`
`20:51.45`	`Patlabor221`	`not move`
`20:51.49`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Oh`
`20:51.51`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Got it`
`20:51.59`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Back to DB`
`20:53.12`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Look everyone! I'm deleting my local hard drive!`
`20:55.13`	`doughecka`	`Date 8 bytes January 1, 100 to December 31, 9999`
`20:55.21`	`doughecka`	`what happens in 10000?`
`20:55.45`	`Patlabor221`	`it explodes`
`20:55.47`	`doughecka`	`dont tell me VB isnt y10k capatible!`
`20:55.49`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`What?`
`20:56.10`	`Patlabor221`	`there are only so many integers you canhave`
`20:56.18`	`doughecka`	`:)`
`21:02.56`	`*** join/#bzflag Skipp (pwojp701@dialup-67.26.51.36.Dial1.Denver1.Level3.net)`
`21:03.34`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I'm restarting. My OS just pretty much crashed to an extent`
`21:03.53`	`Patlabor221`	`deleted too many files?`
`21:05.46`	`Patlabor221`	`bet he killed his pagefile`
`21:06.23`	`*** part/#bzflag Skipp (pwojp701@dialup-67.26.51.36.Dial1.Denver1.Level3.net)`
`21:06.39`	`doughecka`	`hehe`
`21:07.04`	`Noodleman`	`haha`
`21:07.45`	`Patlabor221`	`it won't reboot if he did`
`21:07.52`	`*** join/#bzflag [STC]_creeperz (creeperz@host-178-78-220-24.midco.net)`
`21:08.05`	`Noodleman`	`it worked it seems`
`21:08.13`	`Patlabor221`	`that it seems to have`
`21:08.28`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`My mom is trying to poison me`
`21:08.35`	`Patlabor221`	`now how is one expected to type whilst a cat is laying on the kyaboard`
`21:08.40`	`Noodleman`	`wheatgrass juice? :-)`
`21:08.46`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`She just handed me a half-cooked cheeseburger`
`21:08.54`	`Noodleman`	`eeewww`
`21:08.54`	`Patlabor221`	`mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm raw cow`
`21:08.55`	`*** join/#bzflag paul ([fhzr6kHaV@hibernia.jakma.org)`
`21:08.58`	`Noodleman`	`e. coli`
`21:09.08`	`doughecka`	`MMMMM`
`21:09.10`	`Patlabor221`	`raw fish sounds good`
`21:09.13`	`doughecka`	`better than raw fish!`
`21:09.20`	`Patlabor221`	`raw fish rocks`
`21:09.38`	`Patlabor221`	`don't knock it till you have had good raw fish`
`21:09.43`	`Patlabor221`	`not something your dad made`
`21:09.50`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:)`
`21:09.59`	`Patlabor221`	`unleess your dad is a suchi chef`
`21:10.00`	`Noodleman`	`i want more bandwitdh`
`21:10.09`	`Patlabor221`	`don't we all?`
`21:10.19`	`greg1`	`Hi everyone, sorry, I was playing :)`
`21:10.34`	`Patlabor221`	`what did you have doug?`
`21:10.38`	`Noodleman`	`the only problem is that the only cheap way to get more bandwitdh is to uncap my cable modem, and that's illegal`
`21:10.46`	`Noodleman`	`:-)`
`21:10.48`	`Patlabor221`	`so`
`21:10.52`	`Patlabor221`	`uncap away`
`21:11.07`	`doughecka`	`haha`
`21:11.09`	`Patlabor221`	`just tell them there was a power surge`
`21:11.09`	`Noodleman`	`the FBI will raid my house and take all my computers away`
`21:11.12`	`Patlabor221`	`if they ask`
`21:11.16`	`Noodleman`	`http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/02/06/27/1329248.shtml?tid=99`
`21:11.37`	`Noodleman`	`i think they are absolute idiots`
`21:11.58`	`Patlabor221`	`what did they do, super leach?`
`21:12.07`	`Noodleman`	`good question`
`21:12.26`	`Noodleman`	`probably just uncapped, and downloaded a few gigs of pr0n :-)`
`21:12.34`	`Patlabor221`	`and you think the ISP would cap there bandwith`
`21:12.40`	`Patlabor221`	`on there main line`
`21:13.17`	`Noodleman`	`cable companies are an incompetent bunch of idiots tho`
`21:13.24`	`Patlabor221`	`this is true`
`21:13.32`	`Noodleman`	`especially mine :-)`
`21:13.48`	`Noodleman`	`it took them half a week to set up a static ip`
`21:14.03`	`Noodleman`	`i had to call them 4 or 5 times`
`21:14.25`	`*** join/#bzflag Cell (~Cell@pD9590DEE.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`21:15.39`	`*** join/#bzflag Toast (~Toast@user-69-1-14-153.knology.net)`
`21:15.46`	`Patlabor221`	`what company`
`21:15.53`	`Noodleman`	`bendcable`
`21:15.57`	`Noodleman`	`a local company`
`21:16.22`	`Noodleman`	`a bunch of inexplicably idiotic people`
`21:16.56`	`doughecka`	`insult bendcable`
`21:16.57`	`Noodlebot`	`thou art pigeon-liver'd and lack gall, bendcable`
`21:16.59`	`Patlabor221`	`well it's explicable, they work at a cable company`
`21:17.07`	`Noodleman`	`heh`
`21:17.27`	`Patlabor221`	`this lighting is gonna be the death of me`
`21:17.28`	`Cell`	`hold cables, move them for the camera man`
`21:17.42`	`Cell`	`etc`
`21:17.57`	`doughecka`	`?`
`21:18.06`	`Cell`	`cable man`
`21:18.26`	`Patlabor221`	`that's called a grip`
`21:18.42`	`larsl`	`Why do some people think that writing their entire website in Flash and opening it in a popup window is the pinnacle of web design?`
`21:18.43`	`Cell`	`ah`
`21:18.49`	`Patlabor221`	`or the first camera asitand`
`21:19.03`	`Noodleman`	`larsl: because they are idiots`
`21:19.12`	`Patlabor221`	`and work at cable companys`
`21:19.14`	`Noodleman`	`i guess that's my favorite word :-)`
`21:19.20`	`Patlabor221`	`use baka`
`21:19.25`	`Patlabor221`	`sounds coller`
`21:19.26`	`doughecka`	`id8`
`21:19.31`	`Patlabor221`	`bua`
`21:19.33`	`Patlabor221`	`baka`
`21:19.34`	`Noodleman`	`idi8's`
`21:19.40`	`doughecka`	`ah`
`21:19.50`	`Noodleman`	`my cable company is a bunch of idi8's`
`21:19.52`	`Noodleman`	`:-)`
`21:20.05`	`Patlabor221`	`now I'm gonna have to see about a book on lighting`
`21:20.23`	`doughecka`	`lighting?`
`21:20.29`	`Patlabor221`	`yes`
`21:20.36`	`Patlabor221`	`of the OpenGL kind`
`21:20.38`	`doughecka`	`lightning that is`
`21:20.58`	`Cell`	`i saw a cg code for that`
`21:21.08`	`Patlabor221`	`not going to require shaders`
`21:21.21`	`greg1`	`is there a match now ?`
`21:21.24`	`Patlabor221`	`but I do want to have map defined point light sources`
`21:21.33`	`Noodleman`	`it would be funny if i could figure out how to hack bendcables tftp server and uncap EVERYONE'S modem!`
`21:21.51`	`doughecka`	`haha`
`21:21.57`	`Patlabor221`	`I'm sure there is a way`
`21:22.05`	`doughecka`	`they sniff the IRC connections IIRC`
`21:22.12`	`Cell`	`on http://www.cgshaders.org/shaders/show.php?id=10`
`21:22.18`	`doughecka`	`they called the police`
`21:22.18`	`Noodleman`	`their server's are windows 2k`
`21:22.23`	`*** part/#bzflag Toast (~Toast@user-69-1-14-153.knology.net)`
`21:22.32`	`Noodleman`	`wouldn't be too hard`
`21:22.36`	`Patlabor221`	`cell that requires shaders`
`21:22.42`	`Patlabor221`	`not gonna do shaders`
`21:22.51`	`Cell`	`ah, pitty`
`21:22.56`	`Noodleman`	`bendcable: if you can read this, you are a bunch of retarded idi8's`
`21:23.01`	`Cell`	`i do use them`
`21:23.03`	`Patlabor221`	`not enough hardware suports it yet`
`21:23.05`	`Cell`	`of coz`
`21:23.11`	`doughecka`	`I dont think they can hear you`
`21:23.12`	`Noodleman`	`bandcable: and i'm not going to hack your tftp server :-)`
`21:23.15`	`captain_proton`	`i'm waiting on shaders because cg is gonna die out when GLHLS comes out :)`
`21:23.26`	`Cell`	`GLHLS?`
`21:23.29`	`Patlabor221`	`you mean glslang?`
`21:23.45`	`captain_proton`	`gl high level shader language`
`21:23.53`	`Patlabor221`	`I think it's been renamed`
`21:23.57`	`captain_proton`	`hrm`
`21:23.59`	`Patlabor221`	`to glslang`
`21:24.02`	`Patlabor221`	`that's all I see everywere`
`21:24.07`	`Patlabor221`	`GL Shader Language`
`21:24.09`	`Cell`	`cg = glhls`
`21:24.17`	`Patlabor221`	`no not realy`
`21:24.19`	`captain_proton`	`Cell: uh, no`
`21:24.25`	`captain_proton`	`cg = nvidia language`
`21:24.33`	`captain_proton`	`"glslang" = opengl 2.0 spec`
`21:24.34`	`bzgirl`	`Patlabor221: seems all i can do is delete it, lock, unlock or move it`
`21:24.42`	`Cell`	`ah`
`21:24.47`	`Patlabor221`	`This slide set from GDC 2003 gives an overview of the OpenGL Shading Language (glslang) as was drafted by the ARB GL2 working group. It is designed to give people an introduction to the graphics programming language and explain how it fits into the OpenGL programming environment. The actual draft glslang specification is available for comment.`
`21:24.59`	`Patlabor221`	`oh then I'll stikify`
`21:25.32`	`Cell`	`they should just use c with some data structures + operator overloading`
`21:25.55`	`Patlabor221`	`bzgirl, you would have had the option when you first made the post,`
`21:26.03`	`Patlabor221`	`it's not in the moderator menu`
`21:26.07`	`captain_proton`	`C doesn't have operator overloading Cell`
`21:26.10`	`bzgirl`	`oh ok`
`21:26.21`	`Cell`	`I know so they should add it`
`21:26.34`	`Cell`	`and matriy and vector data type`
`21:26.36`	`captain_proton`	`operator overloading adds a lot of complexity to the language`
`21:26.48`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah cap, it's been named glSlang`
`21:26.57`	`captain_proton`	`thats silly`
`21:26.57`	`Cell`	`hm dont thing its just mixfix`
`21:27.00`	`Cell`	`noation`
`21:27.07`	`Patlabor221`	`I think 3dlabs names it`
`21:27.12`	`Patlabor221`	`http://www.3dlabs.com/support/developer/ogl2/presentations/GLslang_GDC2003.pdf`
`21:28.00`	`Patlabor221`	`I also want it to run on a GF3MX`
`21:28.04`	`Patlabor221`	`sorry GF2MX`
`21:28.07`	`Patlabor221`	`so no shaders`
`21:28.16`	`Patlabor221`	`I may make some optional shader effects later`
`21:28.44`	`Patlabor221`	`but right now it's the problem of base lighting of arbitrary meshes`
`21:28.49`	`Patlabor221`	`with some form of shadows`
`21:28.53`	`Cell`	`i need per pixel lighhting for dynamic lights`
`21:29.07`	`Cell`	`so i dont need to tessaelate`
`21:29.07`	`Patlabor221`	`not allways`
`21:29.14`	`Patlabor221`	`thre are many ways to do it`
`21:29.32`	`Patlabor221`	`per pixel is just the brute force lazy way`
`21:29.41`	`Cell`	`its an easy way`
`21:29.48`	`Patlabor221`	`the slow way`
`21:29.53`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Slothful! Not lazy!`
`21:29.56`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:)`
`21:30.03`	`Patlabor221`	`again a sin/`
`21:30.06`	`Cell`	`whats the fast way?`
`21:30.17`	`Patlabor221`	`looks to be a glow pass`
`21:30.22`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Having Jeff do it ;)`
`21:30.25`	`Patlabor221`	`gonna try it`
`21:30.37`	`Patlabor221`	`I've got it down to 3 passes`
`21:30.42`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`OUCH!!`
`21:30.50`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I choked on Hot Cocoa!`
`21:30.56`	`Patlabor221`	`baka`
`21:30.58`	`Cell`	`you use a lightning volume?`
`21:31.02`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`...At least itr isn't coming out of my nose!`
`21:31.08`	`Cell`	`like a shadow volume`
`21:31.11`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`it*`
`21:31.16`	`Patlabor221`	`the shadow pass can ether do volumes or just projectsons`
`21:31.47`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`...I'm going to work on cleaning my Hard Drive`
`21:31.51`	`Cell`	`hm`
`21:31.54`	`Patlabor221`	`it may take too long to get the volume of an arbitrary mesh`
`21:32.02`	`Patlabor221`	`so I may use it's colision volume`
`21:32.09`	`Cell`	`ah`
`21:32.38`	`Patlabor221`	`but shadows will only be cast by static world lights`
`21:32.47`	`Patlabor221`	`dynamics will just effect a glow pass`
`21:33.32`	`Patlabor221`	`each object knows what lights can it it`
`21:33.43`	`Cell`	`cipher uses dynamich shadow volumes, but they do kinda preprocessing that i dont know hoe it works that enables to calc the shadow volume quickly, i thing it has something to do with the silhoutte`
`21:33.45`	`Patlabor221`	`and then it will draw the 8 strongest`
`21:34.08`	`Patlabor221`	`they probably get one per light`
`21:34.22`	`Patlabor221`	`I don't want to spend that much CPU time on lighting`
`21:34.36`	`Patlabor221`	`it just has to look ok, not perfect`
`21:34.59`	`Patlabor221`	`I can get it down to 2 passes if I do it bz style with just the sun light`
`21:35.03`	`Cell`	`but think about shadows on the walls, likke in the new doom`
`21:35.10`	`Cell`	`it looks great`
`21:35.13`	`Patlabor221`	`I am not making the new doom`
`21:35.27`	`Patlabor221`	`I am making something fun`
`21:35.36`	`Cell`	`sure`
`21:35.51`	`Patlabor221`	`doom 3 is a nice engine, wonder when they will make a game using it`
`21:36.30`	`Cell`	`they should licence it for free for noncommercial dev`
`21:36.39`	`Patlabor221`	`why?`
`21:36.43`	`*** join/#bzflag Noodleman (~tucker@bc183148.bendcable.com)`
`21:36.49`	`Patlabor221`	`when it's out, you will get a GPL q3 engine`
`21:36.58`	`Cell`	`cause lot of ppl would make games and maybe pay for a commercial licencew`
`21:37.21`	`Patlabor221`	`those people can just make mods now`
`21:37.24`	`Patlabor221`	`and tha'ts what they do`
`21:38.03`	`Patlabor221`	`id makes good engines, they can't make good games to save there life tho`
`21:39.22`	`Noodleman`	`what about commander keen? ;-)`
`21:39.49`	`Patlabor221`	`I don't think the people who did the gameplay on that work there anymore`
`21:40.22`	`Patlabor221`	`but since Q1 they have gone down in the gamelay dept`
`21:40.42`	`Patlabor221`	`most people play there games with some from of mod`
`21:40.43`	`Noodleman`	`udp portscan, w00`
`21:40.45`	`Noodleman`	`:-)`
`21:40.48`	`Patlabor221`	`or one of there lsicenes`
`21:41.36`	`Cell`	`some has tried the terrain generator ?`
`21:42.03`	`Patlabor221`	`umm yeah it was on "the" webpage`
`21:42.49`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Ok?`
`21:42.53`	`*** part/#bzflag [STC]_creeperz (creeperz@host-178-78-220-24.midco.net)`
`21:43.09`	`*** join/#bzflag [STC]_creeperz (creeperz@host-178-78-220-24.midco.net)`
`21:43.35`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`BRB`
`21:43.50`	`Patlabor221`	`guess you don't want it to boot`
`21:43.58`	`Patlabor221`	`just turn on that slow ass compresion`
`21:44.38`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`18.6 GB`
`21:44.48`	`Cell`	`what was the name of the terrain generator?`
`21:44.49`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`9.36 free`
`21:44.59`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Terrain generator?`
`21:45.14`	`Cell`	`cube map`
`21:45.21`	`Patlabor221`	`it has a name, you said it was "the" terain generator`
`21:45.21`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`What?`
`21:45.32`	`Cell`	`no i forgot the name`
`21:45.43`	`Cell`	`it generates 2d images`
`21:45.45`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`What terrain generator?`
`21:45.47`	`captain_proton`	`come uno scienziato cristiano che guarda una fotografia dello scoppio grande`
`21:45.48`	`Patlabor221`	`then don't asume we know what the hell you are talking about`
`21:46.09`	`Cell`	`~x it en come uno scienziato cristiano che guarda una fotografia dello scoppio grande`
`21:46.11`	`doughecka`	`~x es en come uno scienziato cristiano che guarda una fotografia dello scoppio grande`
`21:46.23`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`?`
`21:46.29`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~x What?`
`21:46.47`	`captain_proton`	`doughecka: wrong language`
`21:46.54`	`Cell`	`italian`
`21:46.55`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~x hallo`
`21:47.01`	`doughecka`	`oh`
`21:47.13`	`Patlabor221`	`creeper don't mess withit`
`21:47.15`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~x it en come uno scein`
`21:47.20`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`ok...`
`21:47.35`	`Cell`	`terragen?`
`21:47.59`	`Patlabor221`	`terragens inteface = liquid monkey ass`
`21:48.02`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`~patlabor221`
`21:48.42`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`ibot, patlabor221 is <reply> Jeff Myers www.bakadigital.com \|\| www.artemisgames.com`
`21:48.43`		`okay, [STC]_creeperz`
`21:48.47`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:)`
`21:48.59`	`Patlabor221`	`~forget Palabor221`
`21:48.59`		`i didn't have anything called 'palabor221', Patlabor221`
`21:49.08`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`I g2g...`
`21:49.13`	`*** join/#bzflag izto (~izto@cable03oam.cybercable.net.mx)`
`21:49.14`	`Patlabor221`	`~forget patlabor221`
`21:49.14`		`Patlabor221: i forgot patlabor221`
`21:49.18`	`Patlabor221`	`then do so`
`21:49.26`	`doughecka`	`yay`
`21:49.28`	`doughecka`	`bzflag compiled`
`21:49.39`	`doughecka`	`but then, its g0 without any mods`
`21:49.40`	`Patlabor221`	`why would it not?`
`21:49.53`	`izto`	`Hello all`
`21:49.59`	`doughecka`	`hi`
`21:50.03`	`doughecka`	`dunon`
`21:50.22`	`izto`	`Who can reset a team's password on the league page? Chestal maybe? :-)`
`21:51.56`	`Patlabor221`	`"it's a great big universe, and we're all realy punny, about the size of Micky Rooney"`
`21:53.04`	`Patlabor221`	`hmmm they swtiched Laura's guns in the new tomb raider`
`21:53.25`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Darn`
`21:53.33`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Laura is kinda cute too`
`21:53.36`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`:)`
`21:53.43`	`Patlabor221`	`Colt 1911's to H&K USPs`
`21:53.53`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`Cool`
`21:54.25`	`Patlabor221`	`wonder if they make the 9mm shells do less dammage`
`21:55.17`	`*** join/#bzflag [STC]_creeperz (creeperz@host-178-78-220-24.midco.net)`
`21:55.23`	`bzgirl`	`izto i think Valoche`
`21:57.01`	`izto`	`Thank you bzgirl`
`21:57.07`	`izto`	`I'll try to find him`
`21:57.21`	`doughecka`	`~seen him`
`21:57.21`		`i haven't seen 'him', doughecka`
`21:57.58`	`izto`	`In the meantime: anyone withouth a team that wishes to join the unbeatable team consumption?? :-)`
`21:58.08`	`*** join/#bzflag GenRommel (~gene@24-193-121-4.nj.rr.com)`
`21:58.09`	`bzgirl`	`:)`
`21:58.23`	`[STC]_creeperz`	`UUGH!!!`
`21:58.41`	`izto`	`And to all members of other teams, here I challenge you! To the Death! :)`
`21:59.37`	`GenRommel`	`hehe - izto is so funny`
`21:59.52`	`doughecka`	`he is?`
`21:59.52`	`bzgirl`	`he is`
`21:59.56`	`doughecka`	`oh, he IS!`
`22:00.01`	`Patlabor221`	`well I think it's time to go outside and play in the sun`
`22:00.06`	`doughecka`	`aww`
`22:00.13`	`doughecka`	`I dint know programmers knew what a sun wad`
`22:00.15`	`Patlabor221`	`sun good`
`22:00.15`	`doughecka`	`was*`
`22:00.20`	`bzgirl`	`its only 2C here :(`
`22:00.29`	`doughecka`	`its 38 here`
`22:00.29`	`Patlabor221`	`offta`
`22:00.35`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah but you have snow right?`
`22:00.44`	`Patlabor221`	`it's like 80 here`
`22:00.46`	`doughecka`	`I dont`
`22:01.13`	`hardwire`	`doughecka: hiya`
`22:01.17`	`doughecka`	`hey`
`22:01.19`	`bzgirl`	`doug make ibot convert 80 to celsius`
`22:01.20`	`doughecka`	`got the ticket yet?`
`22:01.26`	`hardwire`	`ticket?`
`22:01.29`	`Patlabor221`	`like 27 28`
`22:01.34`	`bzgirl`	`ahh`
`22:01.35`	`doughecka`	`the licence`
`22:01.41`	`doughecka`	`the tech`
`22:01.44`	`doughecka`	`etc :)`
`22:01.47`	`hardwire`	`nope.. not yet`
`22:01.49`	`Patlabor221`	`what is body temp? 36?`
`22:01.55`	`doughecka`	`hardwire: hmm, my APRS packets never get out..`
`22:01.56`	`hardwire`	`my hamhead roomie is sitting here playing too`
`22:01.57`	`doughecka`	`:(`
`22:02.02`	`doughecka`	`hardwire: hehe`
`22:02.15`	`hardwire`	`doughecka: heh. well I telneted to an igate repeater for the local area`
`22:02.21`	`doughecka`	`oh cool :)`
`22:02.22`	`hardwire`	`and sat there and watched until my packets went thru`
`22:02.28`	`doughecka`	`hah`
`22:02.40`	`doughecka`	`exept for aprs`
`22:02.44`	`hardwire`	`telnet aprsdden.rmaprs.org 14579`
`22:02.51`	`hardwire`	`do that and watch for KC0MYM-1`
`22:02.56`	`hardwire`	`tell me when you are connected`
`22:03.02`	`Patlabor221`	`have fun everyone`
`22:03.08`	`bzgirl`	`bye`
`22:03.17`	`doughecka`	`hmm`
`22:03.36`	`hardwire`	`are you telnetified?`
`22:03.45`	`doughecka`	`nope`
`22:03.47`	`doughecka`	`hold on`
`22:03.49`	`hardwire`	`cmooon`
`22:04.12`	`izto`	`me funny?`
`22:04.15`	`doughecka`	`huh`
`22:04.18`	`doughecka`	`bad hostname`
`22:04.24`	`izto`	`You should all be afraid of consumption!`
`22:04.27`	`izto`	`:)`
`22:05.02`	`doughecka`	`ok`
`22:05.05`	`doughecka`	`connected`
`22:05.17`	`hardwire`	`ok`
`22:06.00`	`doughecka`	`hah!`
`22:06.04`	`hardwire`	`hehehe`
`22:06.10`	`hardwire`	`neat eh`
`22:06.25`	`hardwire`	`:(`
`22:06.28`	`hardwire`	`I have two radios`
`22:06.30`	`hardwire`	`that helps a lot`
`22:06.33`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`22:06.44`	`hardwire`	`anyhoot.. yay`
`22:06.45`	`doughecka`	`maybe its cutting the signal off when it TXs`
`22:06.50`	`doughecka`	`heh`
`22:06.54`	`hardwire`	`how are you signalling the ptt?`
`22:06.58`	`doughecka`	`yea, I got a pictnc`
`22:07.02`	`doughecka`	`hardwire: grounded`
`22:07.07`	`hardwire`	`ooh ok`
`22:07.17`	`doughecka`	`all I do is ground the ptt to the ground of the radio`
`22:07.20`	`doughecka`	`I use a pictnc`
`22:07.23`	`doughecka`	`ugh`
`22:07.30`	`hardwire`	`ugh?`
`22:07.34`	`hardwire`	`its a lot better than matching grounds`
`22:07.35`	`doughecka`	`relays?`
`22:07.38`	`doughecka`	`bah`
`22:07.48`	`hardwire`	`yeah.. modified the time offset for ptt signaling in the driver`
`22:07.53`	`doughecka`	`ah`
`22:08.07`	`doughecka`	`http://www.john.hansen.net/PICTNC.htm`
`22:08.10`	`doughecka`	`its a kit`
`22:08.11`	`doughecka`	`:)`
`22:08.12`	`hardwire`	`I could ues the serial ones that are basically hooked up to an NPN`
`22:08.19`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`22:08.33`	`hardwire`	`thats too big tho ;(`
`22:08.38`	`doughecka`	`hm`
`22:08.54`	`doughecka`	`ask him, he might give you plans to make a really small one`
`22:09.03`	`doughecka`	`they also have micro one that only TXs :)`
`22:09.07`	`hardwire`	`well I could probably do that as well`
`22:09.11`	`doughecka`	`GPS goes in one side, radio out the other`
`22:09.25`	`doughecka`	`that pictnc also does the same, hook it to the gps directly :)`
`22:09.30`	`hardwire`	`yeah`
`22:09.35`	`hardwire`	`just export NMEA data`
`22:09.44`	`doughecka`	`into aprs UI packets`
`22:09.58`	`doughecka`	`heh`
`22:10.01`	`hardwire`	`it works pretty well for what needs to be done`
`22:10.03`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`22:10.12`	`doughecka`	`I was gonna do that`
`22:10.17`	`hardwire`	`also I made a 5 relay system..`
`22:10.23`	`doughecka`	`but then I decided to get a real hardware system`
`22:10.28`	`hardwire`	`the 5th I use for PTT on the radio`
`22:10.35`	`hardwire`	`I need 4 other ones for the balloon`
`22:10.41`	`hardwire`	`and I was running out of IO`
`22:10.47`	`doughecka`	`hehe`
`22:10.48`	`hardwire`	`I have 4 serial devices.. and 2 serial ports`
`22:11.06`	`doughecka`	`hmm`
`22:11.07`	`hardwire`	`it has been a pain.. but with relays and a paralell port I have been able to do all sorts of switching`
`22:11.16`	`doughecka`	`heh`
`22:11.36`	`hardwire`	`I am just happy the send to aprs repeater part worked ;)`
`22:11.41`	`doughecka`	`yea`
`22:11.45`	`hardwire`	`now if I were only 10,000 feet in the air`
`22:11.58`	`hardwire`	`I have the tx delay set to around 150ms`
`22:12.23`	`doughecka`	`oh`
`22:12.28`	`doughecka`	`mine is at 25`
`22:12.29`	`doughecka`	`:)`
`22:12.31`	`doughecka`	`maybe thats why`
`22:14.21`	`doughecka`	`hah`
`22:14.25`	`doughecka`	`it works on my desktop too`
`22:14.34`	`doughecka`	`hm`
`22:14.37`	`doughecka`	`only goes up to 80`
`22:15.18`	`doughecka`	`whats that callsign again?`
`22:15.23`	`doughecka`	`I am gonna try sending a message`
`22:16.32`	`doughecka`	`oh wait, I cant.. I took apart my cable to wire up a FRS radio to my radio`
`22:38.26`	`larsl`	`What are the dimensions of a texture tile (the bricks) in BZFlag length units?`
`22:55.28`	`*** join/#bzflag Noodlebot (~noodlebot@bc183148.bendcable.com)`
`23:04.12`	`larsl`	`~towers`
`23:05.33`	`larsl`	`~towers`
`23:10.57`	`*** join/#bzflag Skipp (pwojp701@dialup-64.157.26.194.Dial1.Denver1.Level3.net)`
`23:11.25`	`*** part/#bzflag Skipp (pwojp701@dialup-64.157.26.194.Dial1.Denver1.Level3.net)`
`23:14.19`	`larsl`	`~towers`
`23:15.14`	`*** join/#bzflag Noodleman (~tucker@bc183148.bendcable.com)`
`23:23.38`	`*** join/#bzflag Noodlebot (~noodlebot@bc183148.bendcable.com)`
`23:32.47`	`larsl`	`~towers`
`23:47.33`	`Patlabor221`	`when did my home town become so gheto`
`23:47.42`	`captain_proton`	`?`
`23:48.10`	`Patlabor221`	`I was just back in my home town`
`23:48.15`	`Patlabor221`	`it's now all wierd`
`23:48.43`	`*** join/#bzflag Chestal (thilo@vmax.unix-ag.uni-siegen.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`23:48.43`	`*** join/#bzflag GenRommel (~gene@24-193-121-4.nj.rr.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`23:48.44`	`*** join/#bzflag paul ([fhzr6kHaV@hibernia.jakma.org)`
`23:48.44`	`*** join/#bzflag ak\|ra (~mathias@p50883E47.dip.t-dialin.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`23:48.44`	`*** join/#bzflag larsl (~larsl@c213-100-62-28.swipnet.se) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`23:48.44`	`*** join/#bzflag [dmp] (~somewhere@0x50c4919b.adsl-fixed.tele.dk) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`23:48.44`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o Chestal] by leguin.freenode.net`

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